What's a "traditional" Catholic?

[Anastasia13]

What's a "traditional" Catholic?

[MC Just]

[quote name='Light and Truth' date='Nov 25 2005, 05:33 AM']What's a  "traditional" Catholic?
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Traditional=Orthodox Catholic.

Ultratraditional= schismatic catholics.

[brendan1104]

A traditional Catholic is a Catholic who adheres to the Traditional Liturgy i.e. Calendar of seasons and feasts, Gregorian Chant, Roman Breviary, and traditional Tridentine Mass. They also remain attached to true, traditional Catholic doctrine- Council of Trent/Baltimore Catechism.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='brendan1104' date='Nov 25 2005, 10:42 AM']A traditional Catholic is a Catholic who adheres to the Traditional Liturgy i.e. Calendar of seasons and feasts, Gregorian Chant,  Roman Breviary, and traditional Tridentine Mass. They also remain attached to true, traditional Catholic doctrine- Council of Trent/Baltimore Catechism.
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Unless the are obedient to Rome, they are locked in a time warp and are outside the Catholic Church, and they haven't bought a calendar since the sixties.

[inDEED]

[Extra ecclesiam nulla salus]

actually they make new tridentine calendars. especially for us catholics who prefer the traditional mass.

[zabbazooey]

[Dave]

[quote name='brendan1104' date='Nov 25 2005, 10:42 AM']They also remain attached to true, traditional Catholic doctrine- Council of Trent/Baltimore Catechism.
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And the Catechism of the Catholic Church doesn't contain true, traditional Catholic doctrine? Not true. No approved catechism contains heresy.

[Era Might]

To be Catholic is, of its very essence, to be traditional.

The phrase "traditional Catholic" is a misnomer, at least in how it is commonly applied, because it suggests other Catholics are somehow not "traditional". But this is impossible.

The living Tradition of the Church, handed on from generation to generation, is not defined by superficial practices (eg, a particular Liturgy or custom).

Rather, it is defined by the Church's faith in Christ, in all he has revealed through his Apostles, and in the indefectibility of their successors.

"Traditional", as it is commonly used, is an arbitrary nomenclature. If a person prefers, say, the 1955 missal over the 1962 Missal, which is the "traditional" Catholic? Or if a "traditional" Catholic does not advocate the vernacular Liturgy, per the practice of the early Church, is he really "traditional" enough?

These are superficial questions, of course. Preferring the 1962 missal or AD 100 Liturgical discipline does not make you "traditional". Obedience to the Church, in the person of her living Magisterium, makes you Catholic, and by extension, you are inherently "traditional".

Edited November 25, 2005 by Era Might

[tojo]

The only Catholics who aren't "traditional" are those who either don't follow the teachings of the Church (schismatics therefore are NOT traditional because it is traditiional to submit to the wisdom of Church authority) and/or do not value the historic practice (traditions) of Catholicism.

[argent_paladin]

[quote name='tomasio127' date='Nov 25 2005, 03:55 PM']The only Catholics who aren't "traditional" are those who either don't follow the teachings of the Church (schismatics therefore are NOT traditional because it is traditiional to submit to the wisdom of Church authority) and/or do not value the historic practice (traditions) of Catholicism.
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I use the phrase "traditional Catholic" to describe myself because I don't like the phrases "conservative Catholic" (which is imported from the political world) or "orthodox Catholic" because it is confusing (with Orthodox Christians) and confrontational, as well as being not very descriptive (who doesn't think that they are orthodox?)
For me, traditional Catholic is very broad. It is anyone who values the traditions of the Church. Anyone who says that they are Catholic but that the church is so out-of-date, old-fashioned, etc is NOT a traditional Catholic. Catholics for Free Choice, Voice of the Faithful, those who support women's ordination, communion for all, etc are NOT traditional.
I think at a minimum a traditional Catholic must 1. know the traditions of the Church, 2. value them 3, pass them on. I go to Novus Ordo mass daily, sing in a choir that sings polyphonic music from the last six centuries, am a member of a 13th century Order and work in youth ministry.
I think that there is a big difference between a traditional Catholic and a traditionalist Catholic. I am not the latter. The people who have posted that all Catholics are traditional Catholics are correct. I wish that I could just say that I am Catholic. But in the world we live in, too many people claim that name unjustly. In a world where someone who is pro-abortion, wants to abolish the papacy and priesthood, wants to abolish all liturgical rubrics in mass, etc calls himself a Catholic, I must invent some language to distinguish myself from that.
Traditional Catholic, to me, means that I think that Augustine, Aquinas, Newman, Chesterton, the Church Fathers are more relevant to my life than anything in the NYTimes or on cable TV. There is something of an achronological aspect to a traditional Catholic .Just because something was written or said 8 centuries ago rather than 8 minutes ago, doesn't mean that it is irrelevant.

[AlterDominicus]

[quote name='Light and Truth' date='Nov 25 2005, 05:33 AM']What's a  "traditional" Catholic?
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My example is simple, the "old ways" the "other" Vatican the "point" to where instead of calling a religious prioress -who runs her community- sister, you call them Mother! Or ah...well...Reverend Mother

Sort of some what like um....Mother Angelica's community. :

:

[tojo]

Right on Argent_Paladin!

[qfnol31]

Oftentimes, though this is disregarded, "Traditionalist Catholic" actually defines the outlook towards the Church. To say it is not to say other Catholics are not such or that they are not Catholic, but just the different approach, that does fall within teachings.

Just as the Holy Father calls himself an Augustinian and I call myself a Thomist, this does not negate our Catholicism but defines our approach. Likewise, to call oneself a Traditionalist Catholic is to define that person as someone who prefers the more traditional disciplines and practices of the Church.

I use the phrase "traditionalist" here so as not to create confusion after argent's post.

Edited November 25, 2005 by qfnol31

[Anastasia13]

[quote name='MC Just' date='Nov 25 2005, 04:41 AM']Ultratraditional= schismatic catholics.
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But they are still Catholic then?

[inDEED]

I think I'm a bit confused...

Are you meaning "traditional" as in "conservative"? Or "traditional" as in the opposite of "charismatic"? Or "traditional" as in following all Christ's teachings (ie: those of the Church)?

[Anastasia13]

[quote name='inDEED' date='Nov 25 2005, 03:49 PM']I think I'm a bit confused...

Are you meaning "traditional" as in "conservative"? Or "traditional" as in the opposite of "charismatic"? Or "traditional" as in following all Christ's teachings (ie: those of the Church)?
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I was reading this and didn't know quite what it is was talking about. [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=43295&hl="]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=43295&hl=[/url]

[zunshynn]

[quote name='brendan1104' date='Nov 25 2005, 07:42 AM']A traditional Catholic is a Catholic who adheres to the Traditional Liturgy i.e. Calendar of seasons and feasts, Gregorian Chant,  Roman Breviary, and traditional Tridentine Mass. They also remain attached to true, traditional Catholic doctrine- Council of Trent/Baltimore Catechism.
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what's so special about the Baltimore Catechism? Wasn't it promulgated just by the American bishops? Why would it have supremacy over the catechism promulgated by the pope?

And what's wrong with Vatican II and Vatican I?

And how come they think that the Tridentine Mass is valid, but not Novus Ordo? I mean... neither one is the "original" liturgy is it? If the language mattered wouldn't we still have to do it in Aramaic?

Do they think the Novus Ordo is actually invalid? or do they just dislike it? And I know SSPXers aren't sedevacantist... but why do sedvacantists think that the Roman See is vacant? What do they think went wrong to make it invalid? And how long do they think it's been vacant?

Sorry for all the questions...

Edited November 25, 2005 by zunshynn

[tojo]

[quote name='Light and Truth' date='Nov 25 2005, 04:35 PM']But they are still Catholic then?
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But then we would have to discuss what makes someone Catholic, many people have the name, it can be seen very broadly.....

For example, to be formally declared a heretic, you have to be Catholic. So I guess those people are Catholic heretics.

The Catholic Church is very big family and we have many relatives we aren't happy with, but many of us are reluctant to throw them out of the family altogether.....

[Excelsior1027]

As my priest says, there is no such thing as a traditional Catholic, non-traditional Catholic, conservative, liberal, left-wing, or right-wing Catholic. There are only Catholics and non-Catholics.