The Holy Spirit, partie deux

[Sojourner]

In the related Holy Spirit thread, many of you said you think about the Spirit often. What do you think about? What types of things do you attribute to the Holy Spirit's work in your life?

And for tomasio, I'm interested in hearing about your experiences as a charismatic Christian. For starters, can you relate the story of the first time you spoke in tongues?

[Era Might]

I try to think of God in Trinitarian terms as often as possible. That way, I don't leave anyone out. The "Glory Be" is one of my favorite prayers, because it kills three birds with one stone.

When I think of the Holy Spirit, I think of the living presence of God since Pentecost. He's the "soul" of the Church, and in a sense, he becomes our "soul", if we let him. He's your strength every day, guiding your in all things.

Edited December 1, 2005 by Era Might

[tojo]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Dec 1 2005, 11:13 AM']And for tomasio, I'm interested in hearing about your experiences as a charismatic Christian. For starters, can you relate the story of the first time you spoke in tongues?
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Well, first I have to make my disclaimers.

1. I've became both charismatic and a Christian almost 8 years ago. I became Catholic 1 year ago, therefore the great majority of my charismatic experiences have of course occured outside of Catholicism, and I actually know very little about the Catholic Charismatic Renewal.

2. The Church has defined very little doctrinally about the charismatic gifts, and even Protestants have little consensus. This makes some stuff hard to talk about, since, for example, there are few terms that are widely agreed upon that are used in order to understand various experiences and ideas related to the charismatic renewal.

And one note for a few people: It's CHARISMATIC not CHARASMATIC, because they are CHARISMS and not CHARASMS.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='tomasio127' date='Dec 1 2005, 11:34 AM']Well, first I have to make my disclaimers.

1. I've became both charismatic and a Christian almost 8 years ago. I became Catholic 1 year ago, therefore the great majority of my charismatic experiences have of course occured outside of Catholicism, and I actually know very little about the Catholic Charismatic Renewal.

2. The Church has defined very little doctrinally about the charismatic gifts, and even Protestants have little consensus. This makes some stuff hard to talk about, since, for example, there are few terms that are widely agreed upon that are used in order to understand various experiences and ideas related to the charismatic renewal.

And one note for a few people: It's CHARISMATIC not CHARASMATIC, because they are CHARISMS and not CHARASMS.
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OK, I'm fine with that. How about we make the focus of this thread more the actual experiences you and others have had, and the "Speaking in Tongues" thread can be discussion of the ins and outs of the theology behind said experiences. That work?

[philothea]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Dec 1 2005, 11:13 AM']In the related Holy Spirit thread, many of you said you think about the Spirit often. What do you think about? What types of things do you attribute to the Holy Spirit's work in your life?
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(Pause of awkwardness. Mmm.)

I didn't answer in the other thread because by the time I got home it had gone off topic, and this is already awkward enough. I'll reply to both here. I ask for the help of the Holy Spirit every morning, to give me the strength to do God's will, and in particular I ask for help and inspiration before writing.

I don't know if I get any help on the writing. I particularly attribute to the Holy Spirit certain kinds of prayer, times when I am able to achieve good things that I would normally be too weak to do, and sudden reminders of God's presence and will.

(Not being Tomasio, I'll let him answer that part. )

[Sojourner]

[quote name='philothea' date='Dec 1 2005, 12:10 PM']
I didn't answer in the other thread because by the time I got home it had gone off topic, and this is already awkward enough.  I'll reply to both here.  I ask for the help of the Holy Spirit every morning, to give me the strength to do God's will, and in particular I ask for help and inspiration before writing.

I don't know if I get any help on the writing.   I particularly attribute to the Holy Spirit certain kinds of prayer, times when I am able to achieve good things that I would normally be too weak to do, and sudden reminders of God's presence and will.

(Not being Tomasio, I'll let him answer that part.  )
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Very interesting.

I've had a couple of experiences in writing certain stories where I definitely felt some sort of influence other than myself while I was writing ... that in the actual writing, it became a form of worship. I've attributed that to the Holy Spirit. Have you ever experienced anything similar?

[tojo]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Dec 1 2005, 11:56 AM']OK, I'm fine with that. How about we make the focus of this thread more the actual experiences you and others have had, and the "Speaking in Tongues" thread can be discussion of the ins and outs of the theology behind said experiences. That work?
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Yeah, it's rather convenient that thread exists also at this time.

Okay, so I will talk about my personal experiences in my way using terms the way I prefer to use them, interpreting things the way I personally view them


Well, I was raised non-religiouslym and most of my knowledge of Christianity came from the 700 Club, lol. In middle school my best friend was Pentecostal and one night in 8th grade I went with him to his church's youth group service. At this church, youth group was just as much a church service as was the one on Sunday morning. There was prayertime, songtime, sermontime, and altartime. No communion though, that church did it like twice a year. Anyways, I stood when they stood, and sang along as best I could, and generally tried to participate as much as I could. After the youth pastor's sermon was finished, he told us we all had to be sure we were "right with God" and that everyone should repent of their sins and praise God. My 700 Club experiences had led me to "pray the sinners prayer" and such before, so I readily repented, and then I raised my hands like everyone else was, and I told God thatI imagined He was pretty cool (I had no idea how to"praise" Him).

At this point I should mention that I had barely ever heard of the Holy Spirit, I had no idea what Pentecostal meant, and had never heard of the idea of tongues at all.

Anyways, so as I feebly attempted to praise God, I began to have a very difficult to describe experience. Suddenly the presence of God became very real and very powerful to me. My upraised hands felt like "an electricity" was shooting into them, and it seemed to me, even at that time, that it was coming from the hands of God into my hands. It was a very wonderful experience, and tears began to stream down my face, and I was completely caught up in the experience, and only just barely aware of what was going on around me.

I did not speak in tongues that night, but I do believe that was when I had the experience that I call "the baptism of the Holy Spirit."

Anyways, I went back to the youth group two weeks later, and had a similar but much less intense experience, and I spoke in tongues then. I think it might have not happened the first time because I wasn't relaxed enough to open my mouth and speak. Anyways, during the "praising God time" I opened my mouth and words came out that I didn't understand. I wasn't babbling, though it may have sounded that way to some, even somewhat to myself, but I can babble and I know the difference.

The words were very beautiful and full of expression and emotion and (that time) sounded a bit like Italian.

This has been an account of my initial persoanl experiences of the Holy Spirit. Stay tuned, lol....

[Sojourner]

Very interesting. Did it feel natural to you from the start, or were you really weirded out at the beginning?


Oh, and if inDEED has had similar experiences, I'd like to hear about those, too.

[tojo]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Dec 1 2005, 01:11 PM']Very interesting. Did it feel natural to you from the start, or were you really weirded out at the beginning?
Oh, and if inDEED has had similar experiences, I'd like to hear about those, too.
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The funny thing is, that it felt very natural from the beginning, it didn't seem weird at all.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='tomasio127' date='Dec 1 2005, 01:25 PM']The funny thing is, that it felt very natural from the beginning, it didn't seem weird at all.
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Very, very interesting.

The first time I went to a charismatic service, I was 16-ish. We had, as I think I've said elsewhere, friends who were charismatic, and for some reason my straight-laced Calvinist Dad didn't have a problem with me going to church with them. There was a point in the service during a time of prayer that a couple of people started praying in tongues, and I felt the presence of God very clearly. The first part of Psalm 46:10 -- "Be still, and know that I am God" -- came into my mind with great force, as though God were saying it, and I was overcome with emotion. My friends didn't quite know what to do with me.

I went back to services with those friends a couple of other times, but never had a similar experience. And honestly, it did weird me out. I'm an emotional person, but not entirely comfortable with things I can't easily put into words, so I was never quite able to be comfortable with the strength of the emotion I felt that day. But I have to say that experience, in part, laid the groundwork for my becoming Catholic. And then I had a somewhat similar experience several years later (although in a Presbyterian church, of all places) that served as a testimony to me of the truth of Christ's presence in the Eucharist.

[Sojourner]

Tomasio, how did your journey progress after your first experience with the Holy Spirit? Did you continue speaking in tongues on a regular basis?

[philothea]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Dec 1 2005, 12:20 PM']Very interesting.

I've had a couple of experiences in writing certain stories where I definitely felt some sort of influence other than myself while I was writing ... that in the actual writing, it became a form of worship. I've attributed that to the Holy Spirit. Have you ever experienced anything similar?
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Yes, though I couldn't attribute it to the Holy Spirit with any confidence. (Not that I doubt it either, it's just too... I don't know. Too exalted, I guess.) There is definitely a similar experience to be had in both prayer and art.

Ever since I decided about six months ago that writing was my... ...vocation I try to offer all my writing as prayer, so I am more conscious of a greater purpose now (even if I'm just imagining it). I hope it works, because when I am caught up in a project I can't think of anything else, and all my intentional prayers become very distracted.

[tojo]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Dec 1 2005, 01:49 PM']Tomasio, how did your journey progress after your first experience with the Holy Spirit? Did you continue speaking in tongues on a regular basis?
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Yes, after my initial experiences I continued to be able to pray in tongues at worship services, and at some point at home during my prayertimes, since I hadn't had a prayerlife prior to this, I'm not sure if I ever had a time in which it wasn't available to me for private prayertimes, like some seem to initially.

Tongues remained a very significant part of my prayerlife all throughout high school while I was Pentecostal. When I left Pentecostalism for a non-denominational church, it changed a bit. My church, Hope, had a few people who spoke in tongues and things like that, but most didn't, and those who did didn't at church except silently or almost silently perhaps. The people in that church expected interpretation if they heard us pray in tongues, and since no one had the gift of interpretation, we kept on the quiet side, and reserved tongues primarily for our private prayerlifes. In some ways, this felt oppressive, since in most other ways our church welcome a very free and expressive style of praise and worship. I didn't feel free to connect with God in the most powerful way I knew how, a way He had given to me Himself.

Not too surprisingly, tongues began to play a less significant role in my personal prayerlife then too, and for a time I felt like God wanted me to take a break from it, for about three months, during which I realized how very important an aspect of my spirituality it was for me. Since then, it has remained important, though somedays I may pray much in tongues and other days little.

[Sojourner]

So, you're saying at some point God revealed it was [i]too[/i] important an aspect in your spirituality?

Do you still pray in tongues during corporate worship?

[tojo]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Dec 1 2005, 05:23 PM']So, you're saying at some point God revealed it was [i]too[/i] important an aspect in your spirituality?
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No, He showed me that due to non-charismatic influence, I had allowed myself to de-value tongues too much as part of my spirituality.


[quote name='Sojourner' date='Dec 1 2005, 05:23 PM']Do you still pray in tongues during corporate worship?
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Yes, although it depends on where I am and what it's like. I almost never go to any Protestant functions anymore unless they're charismatic, so I do at those. As far as Catholic Masses and other functions, it depnds. If it is a Charismatic Mass or prayer meeting, yes. If it isn't, either very, very discreetly, or not at all.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='tomasio127' date='Dec 1 2005, 06:50 PM']No, He showed me that due to non-charismatic influence, I had allowed myself to de-value tongues too much as part of my spirituality.
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Ah, I see. I misread what you'd posted earlier. Glad I asked for clarification.

[/quote]
[quote name='tomasio127' date='Dec 1 2005, 06:50 PM']No, He showed me that due to non-charismatic influence, I had allowed myself to de-value tongues too much as part of my spirituality.
Yes, although it depends on where I am and what it's like. I almost never go to any Protestant functions anymore unless they're charismatic, so I do at those. As far as Catholic Masses and other functions, it depnds. If it is a Charismatic Mass or prayer meeting, yes. If it isn't, either very, very discreetly, or not at all.
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Interesting. So you mentioned that earlier you'd felt stifled going to Protestant services that weren't as supportive of praying in tongues. Do you feel that way about Catholic services now, aside from charismatic services?

[tojo]

Well, idk. I haven't been Catholic very long now, and I haven't been exclusively attending non-charismatic Catholic functions, quite the contrary. Most of my issues with non-charismatic Catholic functions stem from the fact that they also tend to be liberal, unfaithful, etc.... It seems that a very large portion of conservative Catholics in this area are also charismatic, or at least very charismatic-friendly. Of course I live near "The Charismatic Vatican" lol........