FUS vs. others

[jiyoung]

I'm enrolled at FUS for Fall '06, but I keep having second thoughts. The other schools I know of are Ave Maria and Benedictine...I'm majoring in catechetics+youth ministry concentration, theology, and a music minor, though a major in liturgical music or something of that ilk is also somewhat attractive.

I keep hearing things about FUS's administration, its atmosphere, and other things...so. Help? I was inspired by the Christendom v. FUS thread--I couldn't handle Christendom, though.

[missionseeker]

St. Gregory's University sounda pretty good. It has LM . It's in
OOOOooooooooooooklahoma

[Brother Adam]

[quote name='jiyoung' date='Dec 29 2005, 02:23 AM']I'm enrolled at FUS for Fall '06, but I keep having second thoughts. The other schools I know of are Ave Maria and Benedictine...I'm majoring in catechetics+youth ministry concentration, theology, and a music minor, though a major in liturgical music or something of that ilk is also somewhat attractive.

I keep hearing things about FUS's administration, its atmosphere, and other things...so. Help? I was inspired by the Christendom v. FUS thread--I couldn't handle Christendom, though.
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I don't know if I even saw that thread...

But the number uno prima reason to go here is the professors. Hahn, Miravalle, Martin, Schreck, Rice, Bergsma, Sr. Johanna, Pauley, Minto, Hildebrand, Fr. Pattee, Fr. Scotto, all great 100% orthodox teachers.

Cons are the headaches dealing with getting and staying here, problems with the overall operation and networking in the school (which are being worked out), for some the charasmatic atmosphere is hard to deal with.

I've finally gotten along enough that I've applied to the MA program.

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='jiyoung' date='Dec 29 2005, 02:23 AM']I'm enrolled at FUS for Fall '06, but I keep having second thoughts. The other schools I know of are Ave Maria and Benedictine...I'm majoring in catechetics+youth ministry concentration, theology, and a music minor, though a major in liturgical music or something of that ilk is also somewhat attractive.

I keep hearing things about FUS's administration, its atmosphere, and other things...so. Help? I was inspired by the Christendom v. FUS thread--I couldn't handle Christendom, though.
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BENEDICTINE!! BENEDICTINE!!

[jgirl]

The number 1 pro is the household system.

I made some of the best friends in my life through my household. It's really amazing to have a friendship with Christ at the center, and with household, you gain a great number of such friends!

I had amazing professors: Dr. Williams (French), Dr. Martin (Theology), Dr. Braun (English and an occasional French class), and Prof. Gaston (HCC/History) are the best of the best. They're all very orthodox Catholics, and they have interdisciplinary interests, which means that if you study with them, you will get a true liberal arts education.

Sr. M. Johanna is a great catechetics teacher, too.

The cons...financial aid usually means tons and tons of loans. Loans and theology degrees don't mix well. On the plus side, it's easy to graduate early if you come in with credits or take summer classes at a community college and take 18 credits each semester. That's like getting a $20,000 scholarship!

Other schools that are good...for sacred music, CUA has a really good department. Benedictine, from what I hear, has a good catechetics/youth ministry component. I think Benedictine has a better music department.

I don't know what the music department is like at FUS now, but the old professor was good and knew her sacred music. She got sick of the shenanigans, though, and left. I started a music minor, but then abandoned it to graduate early.

Edited December 29, 2005 by jgirl

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='jgirl' date='Dec 29 2005, 09:46 AM']The number 1 pro is the household system.
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Unless you're not charismatic, then you feel left out.

There's only one household I'd consider joining, and while I don't think it's their official position, I was a bit worried when they started talking about Urs Von Balthasar like he was some idiot out to destroy the Church.

Adam's right...the number one reason is the professors and the orthodoxy they teach. It's by and large a very solid school.

Pros:
Well-known, orthodox professors
Professors who are leaders in their fields
Theology is brought into every department...even the economics dept. manages to include it
The school is very politically active
People are generally friendly
Town-gown relations seem pretty good to me
You don't have to be worried about offending people by mentioning pro-life positions or speaking out against heterodoxy

Cons:
It can get very cliquish
The computer network is horrible
Non-charismatics can feel excluded
If you want a non-charismatic Mass, you have to wake up at dawn or go off-campus
The chapel is ugly...and that's being generous...they really need to build a nice gothic basilica in the middle of campus
It can be hard to get a student job
There's not much to do in the town
The friars can be hard to get a hold of unless you go up to the friary...sometimes they're available in the chapel
Confession begins promptly and ends promptly...if there's a line waiting after the end-time, they're told to leave and try again another time.

[scardella]

I, for one, certainly enjoyed my time at FUS.

I think the household system they've got is simply amazing. It certainly seems like an effective way to create and maintain faith communities that are student led and student run. They've got a variety of spiritualities represented, and they're all at different levels, faith-wise.

Note, not necessarily in perfect order...
Pros:
- Mass 3x a day, usually full.
- Festivals of Praise
- Dances almost every week
- Daily communal rosaries. (Do they still have that at 11:30?)
- Adoration Chapel 24/7
- Great theology dept.
- Great philosophy dept.
- Catechetics was top-notch. Many
- Humanities and Catholic Culture (Is prof Gaston still there?)
- Also, other decent programs...
- All those crazy friars!
- "As GK Chesterton once said..."
- offered occasional Novus Ordo latin Mass and Divine Liturgies.
- Households...

???
- Open hours: on weekend afternoons only (ie intervisitation in dorm rooms) had benefits and drawbacks. Some of that is mitigated in Kolbe/Clare.
- Usually cannot live off-campus until you're a senior. My sister got off-campus her jr year because she was a nursing major.
- Sense of being separated from the outside world. "The bubble"

Cons:
- Draconian network/computer lab policies, as I recall. I see the benefit from the other side though. MY biggest complaint.
- relating to above: didn't have wireless/ethernet in the dorms, although they had the capacity.
- Cable is only available on the lounge tv's
- The administration (staff) sometimes doesn't have their act together completely in regards to being organized. I didn't have many problems with it, but I always managed to pick classes that I didn't wind up dropping/changing/etc. I tended to have a tough-it-out attitude.
- I'm not a liturgist, but I hear people complaining about a few things regarding liturgy there. The only problem that I can put my finger on squarely is the music, which I'm not convinced that anything really is wrong with it. I don't recall hand-holding during the Our Father, etc...

Overall, I really enjoyed it.

EDIT: Disclaimer: I graduated in '03, so I can't say all of these 100% for sure.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='scardella' date='Dec 29 2005, 11:11 AM']I, for one, certainly enjoyed my time at FUS.

I think the household system they've got is simply amazing.  It certainly seems like an effective way to create and maintain faith communities that are student led and student run.  [right][snapback]838678[/snapback][/right]
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Oh, I think it's a good idea...I just don't like that the administration seems partial to charismatic households.

I don't have anything personal against charismatics, but you know, not all people are or should be. The school and many students seems to think otherwise.

"Are you going to the FOP?"

"No."

"Why not?"

"I don't really care for all the charismatic stuff."

"What?!"

...it's just a little agitating. If the school had some more friars available for the students, a nice basilica (or basilica-style church), and a properly performed liturgy, it would be 500% better than it is.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

By the way, for all this stuff I have against it, I still miss it and wish I was back. I have made a lot of friends there and enjoy my classes very much. I still enjoy it overall.

[scardella]

[quote name='Raphael' date='Dec 29 2005, 10:46 AM']Oh, I think it's a good idea...I just don't like that the administration seems partial to charismatic households.

I don't have anything personal against charismatics, but you know, not all people are or should be.  The school and many students seems to think otherwise.[/quote]

Yeah, but I do think it's well-intentioned, though.

[quote]...it's just a little agitating.  If the school had some more friars available for the students, a nice basilica (or basilica-style church), and a properly performed liturgy, it would be 500% better than it is.
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- I don't know what if anything they can do about the friar issue.
- Agree w/ the church... unfortunately those cost lots of $$$. Perhaps there should be a petition to start a "new chapel" fund?
- I'm still about the liturgy thing?

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='scardella' date='Dec 29 2005, 11:54 AM']Yeah, but I do think it's well-intentioned, though.
- I don't know what if anything they can do about the friar issue. 
- Agree w/ the church... unfortunately those cost lots of $$$.  Perhaps there should be a petition to start a "new chapel" fund?
- I'm still about the liturgy thing?
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Oh, I'm certain there's no ill-intent, although some people, I understand, come across quite snobby about being charismatic. I haven't personally had that experience, though.

-There's not much, really. It would just be nice if the order was larger and had more people who were available for the students.
-I don't think it would go over well. First we'd have to explain why we want a new one...then they'd tell us to stop being picky and get over ourselves. We just want a proper place of worship. It's win-win for everyone.
-As for the liturgy...the occasional clapping in the congregation isn't cool, but additionally, the songs are often very much P&W. Now, P&W is fine, but at Mass, it's iffy at best. The rubrics as I understand them require much more solemn, God-centered music with a preference for chant and a distinct place for Latin. Additionally, the Gloria in particular stands out. On occasion, they use the version from the St. Louis Jesuits which reads, "Give glory to the God in the highest..." The problem with this is that in that single word "give" the emphasis changes from the congregation giving glory to God, glory rightfully being His, and glory, by its nature, being owed to Him...the emphasis changes to the congregation...the congregation tells itself and whomever else it's addressing to give glory to God. It doesn't seem big until you really think about it...the emphasis, at least on the near subconscious level, has been switched. All I have to ask is this: what's wrong with using more traditional hymns? I mean, if they are the preference of the Church, then it has to be a very conscious act to change it. Now, I'm certain they mean well, but it very clearly comes from a desire to use more popular music. Instead of switching the music to the type the students sing outside of Mass, the choir should stick with music that stands out as reflecting the tradition of the Church, so that they understand the sacred nature of Mass with greater spiritual strength. If the choir sees that those songs aren't popular with the students, then they should try to change the students' views of the music by showing them how beautiful and special it is, rather than throwing it out for already more popular music.

[Brother Adam]

[quote name='Raphael' date='Dec 29 2005, 12:07 PM']Oh, I'm certain there's no ill-intent, although some people, I understand, come across quite snobby about being charismatic.  I haven't personally had that experience, though.

-There's not much, really.  It would just be nice if the order was larger and had more people who were available for the students.
-I don't think it would go over well.  First we'd have to explain why we want a new one...then they'd tell us to stop being picky and get over ourselves.  We just want a proper place of worship.  It's win-win for everyone.
-As for the liturgy...the occasional clapping in the congregation isn't cool, but additionally, the songs are often very much P&W.  Now, P&W is fine, but at Mass, it's iffy at best.  The rubrics as I understand them require much more solemn, God-centered music with a preference for chant and a distinct place for Latin.  Additionally, the Gloria in particular stands out.  On occasion, they use the version from the St. Louis Jesuits which reads, "Give glory to the God in the highest..."  The problem with this is that in that single word "give" the emphasis changes from the congregation giving glory to God, glory rightfully being His, and glory, by its nature, being owed to Him...the emphasis changes to the congregation...the congregation tells itself and whomever else it's addressing to give glory to God.  It doesn't seem big until you really think about it...the emphasis, at least on the near subconscious level, has been switched.  All I have to ask is this:  what's wrong with using more traditional hymns?  I mean, if they are the preference of the Church, then it has to be a very conscious act to change it.  Now, I'm certain they mean well, but it very clearly comes from a desire to use more popular music.  Instead of switching the music to the type the students sing outside of Mass, the choir should stick with music that stands out as reflecting the tradition of the Church, so that they understand the sacred nature of Mass with greater spiritual strength.  If the choir sees that those songs aren't popular with the students, then they should try to change the students' views of the music by showing them how beautiful and special it is, rather than throwing it out for already more popular music.
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Talk to Fr. Dominic, he'll beat you into submission regarding the liturgy. I heard it all semester in THE 418 as we slowly read through every major liturgical document. What they do is acceptable, simply not prefable by most (and I'd imagine that would include Benedict).

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Brother Adam' date='Dec 29 2005, 12:22 PM']Talk to Fr. Dominic, he'll beat you into submission regarding the liturgy. I heard it all semester in THE 418 as we slowly read through every major liturgical document. What they do is acceptable, simply not prefable by most (and I'd imagine that would include Benedict).
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We're not minimalists. What is just acceptable isn't what we should strive for...God deserves the best and so do all the baptized.

That said...something about it all still rubs me the wrong way. Jen and I will be going to the charismatic Mass on Tuesdays and Thursdays because time restraints force us to...and we're going to sit in front and not raise our hands.

[Brother Adam]

[quote name='Raphael' date='Dec 29 2005, 12:25 PM']We're not minimalists.  What is just acceptable isn't what we should strive for...God deserves the best and so do all the baptized.

That said...something about it all still rubs me the wrong way.  Jen and I will be going to the charismatic Mass on Tuesdays and Thursdays because time restraints force us to...and we're going to sit in front and not raise our hands.
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I've pretty much gotten over it. There are bigger fish to fry for the moment and I get a lot more out of mass now that I don't dwell on all things that bug the hell out of me. I mean this is FUS. That is what this campus is about and the majority of the people here practice a charasmatic community, I guess going out on a crusade to change it as pitiful college laity is probably not the smartest move or the best use of time.

[jiyoung]

I'm not as concerned about mass because while I'd REALLY like to have chant and such, I *do* live in the LA archdiocese and I'm used to not getting my way on that one. And if there are churches in the area that I could go to that have chant and such, then I'd do that. Better than nothing.

What concerns me are the administration problems, and computer network problems...I'm sort of used to charismatics; I was a Young Apostle for a Steubenville conference, after all, and I've been to 5 of the conferences. It's more technical stuff, I guess. I've heard the internet connection is horrible. Would I be able to get cable internet out there in the dorms at all? What are the companies, how much would it be, etc...and how bad exactly are the problems with the administration? I'm very scared about that. I don't want any problems with scheduling or anything

Also...anyone know anything about the music department currently?

[p0lar_bear]

[quote name='Raphael' date='Dec 29 2005, 10:46 AM'] a nice basilica (or basilica-style church), and a properly performed liturgy, it would be 500% better than it is.
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Everyone knows that the chapel is ugly. I don't think anyone in admin pretends that it isn't, but a new one would easily cost in excess of 3 million. You come up the money, I'm sure they would be more than happy to build one. Last I knew, a new chapel is on the list of building projects, but there are a lot of things on that list.

[missionseeker]

Fransican doesn't have a great music program though does it?

And for Christmas, Christendom sent me a CD of the Schola - beautiful.

But Benedictine's Chamber Singers are singing at the Pope's Epiphany Mass (as well as other well known Italian places.)

[jgirl]

[quote name='Raphael' date='Dec 29 2005, 10:46 AM']Oh, I think it's a good idea...I just don't like that the administration seems partial to charismatic households.

I don't have anything personal against charismatics, but you know, not all people are or should be.  The school and many students seems to think otherwise.

"Are you going to the FOP?"

"No."

"Why not?"

"I don't really care for all the charismatic stuff."

"What?!"

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Maybe it was my experience, but I was never asked why I wasn't at a FOP when I didn't go (which was most of them). My household sister, Susanna, led the music for a few years, and my Troub editor in chief with whom I spent many Tuesday nights as we laid out the paper was on the intercessory team. Neither of them ever pressured me to go, and they certainly didn't question my motives. In fact, there are lots of people who didn't go to FOPS (at least back in the early '00s). We used to have movie nights or go to Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh is much more fun than a FOP, although FOPS are cool from time to time.

I can also say that the Roses--my household--wasn't strictly charismatic. My sisters had all different kinds of spirituality preferences leaning from traddie home school to leader of FOP music ministry. We all peacefully co-existed, and I formed friendships with people who weren't necessarily my type. I learned to really transcend stereotypes at Steubenville. It was kind of like a really, really, really Catholic version of the Breakfast Club--at least for me.

As for the internet, it's gotten a little better. When I was there, they had dialup, and you had to pay for it. You also couldn't connect at speeds faster than 21k in the dorms which was irritating when most schools had high speed access for years.

As Scardella mentioned, you can't get cable in the dorm rooms. You can only get one channel--the local NBC--affiliate if you have an antenna on your tv. When the Olympics were on back in 2002, my roommate and I fashioned one out of a wire coat hanger, a Coke can and some scotch tape so we could watch the ice skating somewhere besides the lounges. That really wasn't important, but it was a fun experience.

Another pro is the location. Steubenville is a depressing city. Everything looks dirty, and there's a dinky mall. However, it is about 30 minutes away from the outer suburbs of Pittsburgh (the cool part with a great mall, Ikea, and pretty much any chain restaurant you can think of) and about 45 minutes to an hour outside of the city. Pittsburgh was one of the cooelst cities I ever experienced. You won't feel like you're in a college town in Steubenville, but Pittsburgh has everything that could possibly cater to a college student. It has the interesting independent coffeeshops, neighborhoods, really nice parks, and great museums. I went into the city at least once a week to explore it, and I was never disappointed. The school is also four hours south of Niagara Falls, and you can do that as a daytrip. Some of my household sisters and I went on random daytrips to buy candy in Canada on a few occasions.

Yet another pro is residence life. I can't tell you how great it is to live in a single sex dorm. The nice thing, though, was that it's nothing like most other schools. You don't have to sign in or out. You don't have curfew (I heard that some of the stricter Catholic schools do). There are open hours on Saturday and Sunday afternoons when members of the opposite sex can visit in your rooms with the door wide open (they actually have catches on the door so that they stay open). Some people think the limited open hours aren't enough, but they really are perfect. Also, alcohol is allowed in dorm rooms. It's nice when you're of age to have the privilege to enjoy it in your room while hanging out with friends. The usage of it by those under 21 increased dramatically from my first year when very few of the underclassmen partied with alcohol to my senior year in 2003 when it was very noticable that the fraternity was trying to get freshmen girls to go to their parties. That year, one of the students died while driving drunk. I'm not sure if that problem has been corrected. Since this is Christendom vs. Steubenville, I have a friend who said drinking's a growing problem there, too, and it started going downhill at the same time.

[jgirl]

[quote name='missionseeker' date='Dec 29 2005, 10:14 PM']Fransican doesn't have a great music program though does it?

And for Christmas, Christendom sent me a CD of the Schola - beautiful.

But Benedictine's Chamber Singers are singing at the Pope's Epiphany Mass (as well as other well known Italian places.)
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The minor consists of theory and harmony 1 & 2, sightsinging and ear training 1 & 2, an ensemble at least once, and then elective music classes which are, for the most part, music history and sacred music. Dr. Treacy knew her stuff, and her history classes were intense, but she's gone. My theory and harmony professor was an adjunct. He was an odd fellow--a Jehovah's Witness, in fact. He had no personality, but he knew music theory, so he wasn't bad. We had another adjunct who led us in a clarinet ensemble once. He was really talented and arranged music for our ensemble.

There is an orchestra, but it's really small. Most of the members are professors' kids. The quality is pretty good considering that little kids are playing original versions of Mozart's symphonies and the like.

[jiyoung]

I'm looking for choir actually--I've been in choir since 5th grade at latest and I can't imagine not singing. I'd love to sing for the Pope...hmmm... haha.