Jesus Christ

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='OLAM Dad' date='Jan 8 2006, 06:05 PM']I, for one, am just glad to see that you've found liberals who admit that Jesus existed.

To properly enter into this debate you have to first define what 'liberal' means.  Don't try to do anything until you first agree on what liberal means and then you can contest their arguments one issue at a time.

I must warn you though, arguing with liberals is like arguing with idiots.  It is a bad idea.  They first drag you down to their level and then they beat you with experience.

Good Luck

p.s. - You can start with the abortion issue.  Most everybody agrees that liberals believe in 'choice'.  Scripture is clear on its objection to abortion.
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"the truth has nothing to fear of lies"

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='thedude' date='Jan 8 2006, 06:56 PM']Check out this website:
[url="http://www.cafepress.com/turn_left"]http://www.cafepress.com/turn_left[/url]
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wow
so i think they would have expected Jesus to show up at one of their demonstrations with a table full of Marxist literature to hold a sign and smoke dope with them afterwards

super duper for them

[Ziggamafu]

[quote name='Socrates' date='Jan 9 2006, 08:56 PM']And it really seems that liberals are the ones forever trying to change the meaning of words to mean whatever they want.  The libs on here keep insisting on using their modern, trendy, p.c. defs of words such as "marriage."  (as opposed to those old, dusty outdated definitions of ten years ago).
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HAHA BURN!!!

[Jaime]

[quote name='Socrates' date='Jan 9 2006, 09:37 PM']

Christ did not try to change "authoritarian attitudes, " but taught with His own authority.  He taught that He alone was the Way, the Truth and the Life.
He wasn't some hippy flower child who taught His followers to simply defy authority and do their own thing!

Christ liberated mankind from original sin, and to bear the gentle yoke of Christ, not to be "free" to engage in licentiousness.

Sure, if you play around with words enough, you can always find some sense in which Christ was "liberal."

However, usually when liberals make this assertion, it is meant to imply that Christ would support the modern liberal agenda.  The evidence is all against this.  Why would Christ support something opposed to Himself?
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How is teaching by his own authority not radical or revolutionary? How is it not a liberal idea to teach that everyone can come to the Father when the Jews believed it was for them alone?


Do some misuse the word liberal? Yes just like some misuse the words Christian

and conservative.

[ruso]

[quote name='Socrates' date='Jan 10 2006, 03:34 AM']Jesus said nothing about how people aquired wealth.

Christ did speak about the spiritual dangers of wealth and attachment to material things.  He recommended voluntary giving up of one's wealth to follow Christ.  He was speaking of voluntary actions for spiritual reasons here. 
He said nothing calling for socialistic government-enforced redistribution of wealth.
[b]Voluntary[/b] poverty is one of the evangelical counsels.  Government-enforced poverty has no merit in itself.

And speaking against hypocrisy of influencial people does not automatically qualify one as a liberal.  I've read plenty of conservatives doing the same thing.

I've still seen zippo evidence given on this thread that Christ supported anything on the liberal agenda.
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Perhasp I have not explained myself well, I have not said that Jesus was communist or socialist, two very different things on the other hand.
Socrates, which I see is that for you a liberal one is the one who
supports things as the abortion, eutanasia, etc..... and economics measures of the left.
Jesus, sight of that way never could be liberal. And of course it is not possible to be catholic supporting first.

[Socrates]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='Jan 10 2006, 06:15 AM']How is teaching by his own authority not radical or revolutionary?  How is it not a liberal idea  to teach that everyone can come to the Father when the Jews believed it was for them alone? 
Do some misuse the word liberal?  Yes just like some misuse the words Christian

and conservative.
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You've defined liberal as:
"1. Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry."
Christ did not come simply to attack tradition, authority, or orthodoxy, but to establish His own authority, and bestow this authority in his own Church.
Liberals (both political and religious) tend to attack the Church established by Christ, the legitimate traditions of His Church, the authority of of His Church, and the Truth of Catholic dogmas.
Simply rejecting legitimate authority and "doing their own thing" hardly makes them Christ-like! (Especially when they are attacking that which is established by Christ Himself.)

hot stuff, you accuse conservatives of twisting the meaning of liberal, but I don't think conservatives are to blame for this. Self-described liberals have defined themselves in this way.
Usually, when self-described modern-day liberals say, "Jesus was a liberal," they mean to imply that Jesus would approve of their liberal positions, and is on "their side" politically (or religiously).

My challenge is to let self-described liberals explain themselves what liberalism means, then give evidence from Scripture that Jesus was indeed a liberal.

[Colleen]

I really don't like it when people try to politicize Jesus. I dunno, it's just that almost every time I read about or hear somebody try to put Him into a political category, especially a very modern political category, that person also denies His Divinity: "Jesus was a liberal . . . he was a nice, warm, fuzzy, popular spiritual leader who was put to death for his liberal views. But his followers were really crafty characters and were able to spread his message of [insert the individual's personal political agenda here] everywhere."

Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life and is perfect as the Father is perfect. He is way above politics and political categories.