Radical Traditionalists

[MC Just]

Hey got a problem with Catholics rappping and taking up something that is used for so much evil, and using it for the Church? I guess you also have a problem with all the pagan temples and places the church took up and converted for GOD. I am reverent, I love Christ in the most Holy Eucharist.

I go to a Latin Novus ordo mass and love gregorian chant, and I love Tradition. So whats the problem eh? I'm using rap music as a tool for evangelization. Buy my album and listen to the intro track.

[avemaria40]

I absolutely agree. When I was studying Catholicism, b4 I converted, they said people used to associate instrumental music with orgies but we do use it in Mass and the Church Christianized it too. Same with feast days that used to be pagan celebrations

[AngelofJesus]

Cows are considered gods in India. They dont eat them. I eat cows, doesn't mean I .... lost my train of thought... what are we talking about?

[Theoketos]

Some people see the new prison with no vision and the pains they are feeling with Hip-Hop and nothing else.

[Church Punk]

The Rad Trad movements seem to target anything new, saying its not holy and can not bring about anything good.

[Amator Veritatis]

I would be delighted to engage in a discussion on this matter when I am not as occupied with other threads. I only have so much time on forums, and I am not able to discuss this matter at present. Perhaps, once the thread I have just begun is finished, I would be able to provide arguments and discussion in this thread.


On a secondary note, I find it odd that this thread is targeted solely at "radical traditionalists". There are plenty of "neo-Catholics" and non-Catholics alike who find the so-called Catholic rap and rock 'n' roll genres, if they may be called such, equally distasteful and beguiling.

[MC Just]

[quote name='Amator Veritatis' date='Apr 3 2006, 12:57 PM']I would be delighted to engage in a discussion on this matter when I am not as occupied with other threads. I only have so much time on forums, and I am not able to discuss this matter at present. Perhaps, once the thread I have just begun is finished, I would be able to provide arguments and discussion in this thread.
On a secondary note, I find it odd that this thread is targeted solely at "radical traditionalists". There are plenty of "neo-Catholics" and non-Catholics alike who find the so-called Catholic rap and rock 'n' roll genres, if they may be called such, equally distasteful and beguiling.
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My apologies, it's not just directed towards radical traditionalists..Any catholic who wants to complain about it. Also, just because we are into "catholic rap" it does not mean we want it in the mass. To me that is a no no. It does not belong there.

Edited April 3, 2006 by MC Just

[Amator Veritatis]

Yes, that is my understanding. I am sure that you would not support such thing at Mass. As I said, I hope to contribute to the discussion soon.

[Extra ecclesiam nulla salus]

[quote name='MC Just' date='Apr 3 2006, 02:08 PM']My apologies, it's not just directed towards radical traditionalists..Any catholic who wants to complain about it. Also, just because we are into "catholic rap" it does not mean we want it in the mass. To me that is a no no. It does not belong there.
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there was a great thread at Fish Eaters about it. you should check it out


Sam

[dspen2005]

schismatic...

[Brother Adam]

Rap, at its very core is poetic. It uses words and puts them into rhythm. Poetry is neither good or bad, it is neutral. I can be used for good or evil. MC uses it for good.

[EcceNovaFacioOmni]

I could not believe it when I saw some people at "Fisheaters" discrediting phatmass because it happens to promote music with Catholic lyrics applied to hip-hop beats. Some of the comments were totally absurd. I see no reason to be opposed to people singing reverent hip-hop songs about Christ and His Church. We are not Puritans.

[MC Just]

[quote name='thedude' date='Apr 3 2006, 02:22 PM']I could not believe it when I saw some people at "Fisheaters" discrediting phatmass because it happens to promote music with Catholic lyrics applied to hip-hop beats.  Some of the comments were totally absurd.  I see no reason to be opposed to people singing reverent hip-hop songs about Christ and His Church.  We are not Puritans.
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They need to remove the giant beams from their eyes before telling us to remove our splinters. We are not trying to get hip-hop into the mass, we are NOT trying to corrupt the mass! they need to stop being "superpopes" and follow the real pope.

Edited April 3, 2006 by MC Just

[Extra ecclesiam nulla salus]

[quote name='MC Just' date='Apr 3 2006, 03:33 PM']They need to remove the giant beams from their eyes before telling us to remove our splinters. We are not trying to get hip-hop into the mass, we are NOT trying to corrupt the mass! they need to stop being "superpopes" and follow the real pope.
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why don't you go over to fisheaters and tell them that?

im sure it would be an interesting debate.


Sam

[Theoketos]

[quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' date='Apr 3 2006, 02:39 PM']why don't you go over to fisheaters and tell them that?

im sure it would be an interesting debate.
Sam
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Pearls before swine?

[Extra ecclesiam nulla salus]

[quote name='Theoketos' date='Apr 3 2006, 03:47 PM']Pearls before swine?
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your hip hop music is pearls and we are swine!

maybe you have a pride problem!

[Myles Domini]

[quote name='MC Just' date='Apr 3 2006, 08:33 PM']They need to remove the giant beams from their eyes before telling us to remove our splinters. We are not trying to get hip-hop into the mass, we are NOT trying to corrupt the mass! they need to stop being "superpopes" and follow the real pope.
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One wonders whether they would've insulted St Ambrose for his utilisation of non-liturgical hymns to bolster the Catholics under siege in the basilica from Empress Justina's Arian supporting army?

[point5]

Everyone needs to chill out. It is not even worth the time to try and convince everyone that hip-hop does not have to be bad. There are always extremists...it just so happens that there are a bunch of extremists on the patmass phorums who happen to care more about what happens in cyberspace than in the real world.

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='point5' date='Apr 3 2006, 10:56 PM']Everyone  needs to chill out.  It is not even  worth the time to try and convince everyone that hip-hop does not have to be bad.  There are always extremists...it just so happens that there are a bunch of extremists on the patmass phorums who happen to care more about what happens in cyberspace than in the real world.
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i always knew i liked you...

[goldenchild17]

[quote name='dspen2005' date='Apr 3 2006, 01:27 PM']schismatic...
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Umm... Is there any heresy in the following statement?

"What is the webmistress's statement of faith?

I believe each and every point of dogma in the Nicene Creed in the same manner the Church has always understood them. I believe each and every solemnly defined dogma ever offered by any Pope or Council, and fully agree with each statement given in Sacrorum Antistitum.

I believe Vatican II was a valid, pastoral Ecumenical Council convoked and approbated by true Popes. I believe the documents from the Council were badly and ambiguously written and that said documents need to be interpreted only in light of tradition, even if they taught nothing that Catholics must accept de fide.

I believe that Benedict XVI is a true Pope and that we must pray for him and his Bishops every day.

I believe that all Masses offered by validly ordained priests using valid matter, form, and intent, are valid Masses.

I pray for the restoration of the human element of Holy Mother Church and a return to a Tradition (all of it -- Sacraments, doctrine, customs, disciplines) enlivened by true charity. I pray also for large, solidly Catholic families headed by strong, caring men, and nurtured by strong women who are treated with the same respect and dignity with which Our Lord treated Our Lady.

I reject the false ecumenism, neo-Gnosticism, Judaizing, Protestantizing, and liberalizing, that have marked the post-conciliar period. From a different angle, I also reject sentimentalism, Puritanism, Jansenism, and legalism wherever I find it.

I also reject the feminizing of the Church, and see a strong patriarchy and support for fatherhood as the sine qua non of civilization. On the other hand, I reject "Victorianism" or "1950-ism" -- the idea that we need to "return" to some Protestant, rigid, Beaver Cleaver or Victorian view of "normalcy" in which women's talents and needs were devalued or sentimentalized away, and in which women were condescended to as if they were overgrown children. No Catholic who knows Our Lady should have this sort of attitude toward women.

I also reject the tendency of some to deny (or behave as if they deny) the fact that the natural virtues and actual grace exist outside of Holy Mother Church; the trend toward Manichaeism on the part of some is very dangerous.

My worldview is profoundly Catholic, medieval, and Italian. It is firmly centered on the Incarnation and sees the common modern desire to "spiritualize" everything away as nothing short of the heresy of dualism.

I believe the Church is a "hospital for sinners" like me rather than a social club for the perfect (may we all say "yes" to the Divine Physician and be healed!) While I believe absolutely that we must judge sin, I am very bothered by those who judge souls and who judge rashly."