Fidei Defensor Posted June 7, 2006 Posted June 7, 2006 [quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='999835' date='Jun 7 2006, 04:27 PM'] ummmm.... I've been a Roman Catholic my entire life, and still am practicing today. are you some sort of Heretic? [/quote] Be nice.
ironmonk Posted June 7, 2006 Posted June 7, 2006 [quote name='jnorm888' post='999759' date='Jun 7 2006, 03:30 PM'] Were you in Brazil? And why aren't you scared of going to a Roman Catholic country knowing that you are not Roman Catholic anymore? You can't preach to them what you think is right for they might use force to shut you up. For error has no right to be preached to the faithfull. Right? INLOVE Jnorm This sounds so Old Testament to me. [/quote] If that was the case, it is not the Church forcing itself on people. It is people who are forcing themselves on others. The culture/mentality/civil authorities of those areas are the problem. Not the Church. The whole liberation theology of south america is really wacked and goes against Catholic teachings. God Bless, ironmonk
XIX Posted June 8, 2006 Posted June 8, 2006 [quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='999835' date='Jun 7 2006, 03:27 PM'] ummmm.... I've been a Roman Catholic my entire life, and still am practicing today. are you some sort of Heretic? [/quote] Did yu not say that you were leaving the Catholic Church?
Extra ecclesiam nulla salus Posted June 8, 2006 Posted June 8, 2006 [quote name='fidei defensor' post='999844' date='Jun 7 2006, 05:45 PM'] Be nice. [/quote] sorry [quote name='XIX' post='999891' date='Jun 7 2006, 07:42 PM'] Did yu not say that you were leaving the Catholic Church? [/quote] i did leave it. But Once Catholic, always catholic.
CatholicCid Posted June 8, 2006 Posted June 8, 2006 EENS: [quote name='CatholicCid' post='996727' date='Jun 4 2006, 07:48 PM'] Could you cite that source? I've been reading a book with quite a few chapters dedicated to St. Athanasius but the most I've seen is that he was exiled quite a few times... I skimmed through NewAdvent and I didn't see anything about excommunication either. If you could eloborate a little more as well... I know St. Athanasius was a main speaker against Arianism, which of course wasn't a teaching of the Catholic Church, though parts of the Eastern Church were taking it as a belief before the 'trend' ended to say... Though that's if you are talking about that heresy [/quote] Tried to PM you to ask about it, but your PM Box is filled or so
Jnorm888 Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='999835' date='Jun 7 2006, 03:27 PM'] ummmm.... I've been a Roman Catholic my entire life, and still am practicing today. are you some sort of Heretic? [/quote] If you are not in communion with Rome then you are no longer a Roman Catholic. You are a follower of the Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre. Therefore I will call you a Lefebverenite. As long as you are outside of Rome you can call me a heretic all you want for the truth is at the end of the day you are in the same boat I'm in. Yupp at the end of the day you are a Protestant. You can deny it all you want but it's the truth. You are a Protestant with "outdated" Roman Catholic beliefs. INLOVE Jnorm Also you have no clue what I am or what I believe. I may be more orthodox in theology than you. but you wouldn't know that now would you. Also what good is it to follow Traditional Roman catholicism without the Pope? Whats the point? At least I like the last 2 Popes.......which were the only two popes I've known Edited June 9, 2006 by jnorm888
heavenseeker Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 I would have to vote yes because I would hate it if someone would tell me that I couldn't practice my Catholic beliefs. Therefor they should have the equal right to practice their beliefs even if they are false.
Jnorm888 Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) [quote name='ironmonk' post='999856' date='Jun 7 2006, 04:07 PM'] If that was the case, it is not the Church forcing itself on people. It is people who are forcing themselves on others. The culture/mentality/civil authorities of those areas are the problem. Not the Church. The whole liberation theology of south america is really wacked and goes against Catholic teachings. God Bless, ironmonk [/quote] I'm not worried about it. I didn't hear anything like that so far from the Apostolic National Church of Brazil nor did I hear anything like that from the Assembly of God who are large in Brazil. Maybe that Jesuit had something against Calvinist or Something but still......the idea of killer priests ain't cool. But I'm not scared. INLOVE Jnorm Edited June 9, 2006 by jnorm888
Extra ecclesiam nulla salus Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) [quote name='CatholicCid' post='999982' date='Jun 7 2006, 09:23 PM'] EENS: Tried to PM you to ask about it, but your PM Box is filled or so [/quote] [quote]Pope Liberius was exiled by Constantine's son Constantius, a semi-Arian, and in exile he was browbeaten by Arian bishops into signing a heretical Arian formula and St. Athanasius of Alexandria, the principal opponent of Arianism was excommunicated. When this was examined at Vatican I it was determined that Athanasius was not in fact excommunicated and that Liberius'Ariann creed was null and void since a statement made under duress was no statement at all.[/quote] [quote name='jnorm888' post='1000920' date='Jun 8 2006, 08:40 PM'] If you are not in communion with Rome then you are no longer a Roman Catholic. You are a follower of the Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre. Therefore I will call you a Lefebverenite. As long as you are outside of Rome you can call me a heretic all you want for the truth is at the end of the day you are in the same boat I'm in. Yupp at the end of the day you are a Protestant. You can deny it all you want but it's the truth. You are a Protestant with "outdated" Roman Catholic beliefs. INLOVE Jnorm Also you have no clue what I am or what I believe. I may be more orthodox in theology than you. but you wouldn't know that now would you. Also what good is it to follow Traditional Roman catholicism without the Pope? Whats the point? At least I like the last 2 Popes.......which were the only two popes I've known [/quote] Funny. what do we say about making assumptions? i am in full communion with Rome. i do not deny any Popes. Nor am I a Lefebvrite. Prove to me that i am excommunicated, and a protestant. [quote] In performing such an act, notwithstanding the formal canonical warning sent to them by the Cardinal Prefect of the Congregation for Bishops on 17 June last, Mons. Lefebvre and the priests Bernard Fellay, Bernard Tissier de Mallerais, Richard Williamson and Alfonso de Galarreta, have incurred the grave penalty of excommunication envisaged by ecclesiastical law. [/quote] -Ecclesia Dei funny, my name ain't on that list. also [quote] The situation of the faithful attending chapels of the Society of St. Pius X is more complicated. They may attend Mass there primarily because of an attraction to the earlier form of the Roman Rite in which case they incur no penalty.[/quote] -monsignor Perl of the Ecclesia Dei commision but ya see, ive never been to an SSPX mass. you obviously do not know what you are talking about. i reject no Dogma of the Catholic Church Church, I recognize the raining Pope, and even attend the NO mass from time to time. a love of the TLM, equals protestant? i know you are a heretic, and that i deny no dogma, nor am i schismatic.... Edited June 9, 2006 by Extra ecclesiam nulla salus
Winchester Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 [quote]I would have to vote yes because I would hate it if someone would tell me that I couldn't practice my Catholic beliefs. Therefor they should have the equal right to practice their beliefs even if they are false. [/quote] What if they involve pedophilia, rape, murder, burning of widows or untouchables? Do you support that? I would hate for someone to tell me I couldn't practice my Catholic faith. Because I would have to disobey them, and that might make them unhappy, and if they had the force of law behind them, that would mean I would have to revolt, and being who I am, I would be victorious and then I would have to rule the nation, and that would be too much work.
heavenseeker Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 i never said i supported any of those things, nor do any of the religions that i know of practic such things or could such things be considered as part of a religion being that they are viewed as illegal acts. there is a difference between religion and crulity
Jnorm888 Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 [quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='1000963' date='Jun 8 2006, 07:58 PM'] Funny. what do we say about making assumptions? i am in full communion with Rome. i do not deny any Popes. Nor am I a Lefebvrite. Prove to me that i am excommunicated, and a protestant. -Ecclesia Dei funny, my name ain't on that list. also -monsignor Perl of the Ecclesia Dei commision but ya see, ive never been to an SSPX mass. you obviously do not know what you are talking about. i reject no Dogma of the Catholic Church Church, I recognize the raining Pope, and even attend the NO mass from time to time. a love of the TLM, equals protestant? i know you are a heretic, and that i deny no dogma, nor am i schismatic.... [/quote] sure, uh huh right. Whatever you say sam. Hey isn't it passed your bedtime? INLOVE JNORM
CatholicCid Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 [quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='1000963' date='Jun 8 2006, 07:58 PM'] Pope Liberius was exiled by Constantine's son Constantius, a semi-Arian, and in exile he was browbeaten by Arian bishops into signing a heretical Arian formula and St. Athanasius of Alexandria, the principal opponent of Arianism was excommunicated. When this was examined at Vatican I it was determined that Athanasius was not in fact excommunicated and that Liberius'Ariann creed was null and void since a statement made under duress was no statement at all. [/quote] Thank you. Was just wondering as the lack of such a document puts it up to such debate. If Constantius had such a document signed by the legitamite Pope condemning St. Athanasius, why not reveal it? And as your cite says, if any statement was made, it wasn't done freely anyway, so St. Athanasius was never excommunicated. Anyway, ignore my off topic rantings
Extra ecclesiam nulla salus Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 [quote] sure, uh huh right. Whatever you say sam. Hey isn't it passed your bedtime. INLOVE JNORM[/quote] what? Im 15. Does that make me stupid? you responded to NONE of what i posted. I am not schismatic. Protestants are famous for saying things, and not being able to prove them [quote name='CatholicCid' post='1000981' date='Jun 8 2006, 10:32 PM'] Thank you. Was just wondering as the lack of such a document puts it up to such debate. If Constantius had such a document signed by the legitamite Pope condemning St. Athanasius, why not reveal it? And as your cite says, if any statement was made, it wasn't done freely anyway, so St. Athanasius was never excommunicated. Anyway, ignore my off topic rantings [/quote] Exactly. Athansius was never excommunicated, becuase the excommunication was invalid.
Jnorm888 Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='1001064' date='Jun 9 2006, 03:56 AM'] what? Im 15. Does that make me stupid? you responded to NONE of what i posted. I am not schismatic. Protestants are famous for saying things, and not being able to prove them Exactly. Athansius was never excommunicated, becuase the excommunication was invalid. [/quote] I can only know what you type which isn't consistent by the way but you are 15 so I won't press you as hard on your logic. INLOVE Jnorm P.S. "how can you leave the Church while still being in full communion with it"? illogical! But then again.....how can you leave when your only 15. My assumption is that your parants probly still force you to go to Mass with them every week. Your not old enough to drive so you can't drive to Mass on your own. Yet you talk this stuff about leaving the church? Maybe when you turn 16 or 18 I'll believe you....maybe. But until then you are just playing games and you have alot to learn. Your thinking is pretty much in concrete mode right now. Maybe in a few years you will be able to think more analytical and maybe then you will be able to appreciate Vatican II God Bless Edited June 9, 2006 by jnorm888
chris Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) Whats so bad about being 16? We were all once at that age and its quite defining age for some people. 16 was when I realized that there more to this world, a further purpose. It scared me to know that I was accountable to a higher God, Jesus the Christ. How would you know exactly if he is playing games when you posted the threatening topic? Secoundly, The only hostle people I know arent Catholics. There was a time in history that we did have the Crusades. Yet do you remeber the cross about the sun? Do you forget what God told him? " In this sign Conqure? Is not the wages of sin death? We all deserve to die and feel the wrath of Christ for Romans 9:11 says All have sinned and fallen short of God's glory. I have protestant parents, and they were the most hostile against me. Not me against them. I couldnt really understand it either. The fact is that Catholics are not hostile. I personally favor Pacifism...Being one. And I am happy to be a converted Catholic. A child in God's eyes. Like every one of us. Yes, to answer your poll. I do belive in religious freedom. Anything to hinder an argument. I will worship and not judge as my GOD tells me not to. But, remeber there is a major difference between judgeing someone and discerning what is right from what is wrong. -In Christ Chris Edited June 9, 2006 by Convert4888
Extra ecclesiam nulla salus Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 [quote name='jnorm888' post='1001096' date='Jun 9 2006, 08:22 AM'] I can only know what you type which isn't consistent by the way but you are 15 so I won't press you as hard on your logic. INLOVE Jnorm P.S. "how can you leave the Church while still being in full communion with it"? illogical! But then again.....how can you leave when your only 15. My assumption is that your parants probly still force you to go to Mass with them every week. Your not old enough to drive so you can't drive to Mass on your own. Yet you talk this stuff about leaving the church? Maybe when you turn 16 or 18 I'll believe you....maybe. But until then you are just playing games and you have alot to learn. Your thinking is pretty much in concrete mode right now. Maybe in a few years you will be able to think more analytical and maybe then you will be able to appreciate Vatican II God Bless [/quote] I left the Church, but i came back to the church. I am a ctholic. its not illogical, you just don't have your facts straight. My parents are not practicing Catholics, i usually drag THEM to the Traditional Latin Mass. What is to appreciate about vatican II? Lefebvre and others did not appreciate vatican II and they were not "childish" or "immature". i do not accept Vatican II because it contradicts the Faith taught up until 1965. Stop assuming things, they always seem to be wrong.
Jnorm888 Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Convert4888' post='1001102' date='Jun 9 2006, 06:39 AM'] Whats so bad about being 16? We were all once at that age and its quite defining age for some people. 16 was when I realized that there more to this world, a further purpose. It scared me to know that I was accountable to a higher God, Jesus the Christ. How would you know exactly if he is playing games when you posted the threatening topic? Secoundly, The only hostle people I know arent Catholics. There was a time in history that we did have the Crusades. Yet do you remeber the cross about the sun? Do you forget what God told him? " In this sign Conqure? Is not the wages of sin death? We all deserve to die and feel the wrath of Christ for Romans 9:11 says All have sinned and fallen short of God's glory. I have protestant parents, and they were the most hostile against me. Not me against them. I couldnt really understand it either. The fact is that Catholics are not hostile. I personally favor Pacifism...Being one. And I am happy to be a converted Catholic. A child in God's eyes. Like every one of us. Yes, to answer your poll. I do belive in religious freedom. Anything to hinder an argument. I will worship and not judge as my GOD tells me not to. But, remeber there is a major difference between judgeing someone and discerning what is right from what is wrong. -In Christ Chris [/quote] It's Romans 3:23 fam "for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God" And there is nothing wrong about being 16. In some states you can drive at the age of 16. Which means you can actually drive to whatever Mass you want. And I can only know what he types. Not only on this thread but elsewhere as well. He is either telling fibs about leaving the Roman church or his reasoning about being in full communion is missleading. You can't have it both ways. And that stuff about the Cross and the Sun?............Are you Talking about Constantine? What does he have to do with this? His Christian Empire has to do with what we call the Byzantium Empire. That's the authentic or real Holy Roman Empire. And the Christians of that Empire were Eastern and Oriental Orthodox for the most part. For the Latin church .....centuries later ordained her own emperor. Rome caused a civil schism when she created her own Empire which in my opinion paved the way for the Church schism of 1054 A.D. But that's another story. What does Constantine and his Empire and killing to get it have to do with this? And by the way. This isn't my thread nor my poll. INLOVE Jnorm I'm sorry to hear about your parents treating you bad, but that stuff happens on both sides of the fence. Well I'm happy for you, and I'm glad that you are a Latin Catholic, but take my advice and don't stop reading your Bible. Vatican II allows you to read God's word. So take full advantage of it and stay away from those rad trads. Instead read the modern catechism as well as alot of the PreNicene, Nicene, and early Post Nicene Fathers. And you should be fine. God Bless Edited June 9, 2006 by jnorm888
Extra ecclesiam nulla salus Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 [quote name='jnorm888' post='1001128' date='Jun 9 2006, 09:25 AM'] It's Romans 3:23 fam "for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God" And there is nothing wrong about being 16. In some states you can drive at the age of 16. Which means you can actually drive to whatever Mass you want. And I can only know what he types. Not only on this thread but elsewhere as well. He is either telling fibs about leaving the Roman church or his reasoning about being in full communion is missleading. You can't have it both ways. And that stuff about the Cross and the Sun?............Are you Talking about Constantine? What does he have to do with this? His Christian Empire has to do with what we call the Byzantium Empire. That's the authentic or real Holy Roman Empire. And the Christians of that Empire were Eastern and Oriental Orthodox for the most part. Rome caused a civil schism when she created her own Empire which in my opinion paved the way for the Church schism of 1054 A.D. But that's another story. What does Constantine and his Empire and killing to get it have to do this? And by the way. This isn't my thread nor my poll. INLOVE Jnorm I'm sorry to hear about your parents treating you bad, but that stuff happens on both sides of the fence. Well I'm happy for you, and I'm glad that you are a Latin Catholic, but take my advice and don't stop reading your Bible. Vatican II allows you to read God's word. So take full advantage of it and stay away from those rad trads. Instead read the modern catechism as well as alot of the PreNicene, Nicene, and early Post Nicene Fathers. And you should be fine. God Bless [/quote] There is obviously a disconnect here. I left the church. Then i came back. therefore I'm in full communion. Get it? Vatican II allows me to read my bible? you are ridiculous. what the hell does that even mean? I will not read the New catechism, becuase it is filled with errors of vatican II. I prefer the older catechisms. i don't need advice from someone who is a protestant heretic.
Jnorm888 Posted June 9, 2006 Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='1001124' date='Jun 9 2006, 07:15 AM'] I left the Church, but i came back to the church. I am a ctholic. its not illogical, you just don't have your facts straight. My parents are not practicing Catholics, i usually drag THEM to the Traditional Latin Mass. What is to appreciate about vatican II? Lefebvre and others did not appreciate vatican II and they were not "childish" or "immature". i do not accept Vatican II because it contradicts the Faith taught up until 1965. Stop assuming things, they always seem to be wrong. [/quote] Well I'm glad you cleared that up for me. So is it safe for me to assume that you are a Roman Catholic in full communion who is in dissent on the issue of Vatican II? INLOVE Jnorm [quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='1001129' date='Jun 9 2006, 07:35 AM'] There is obviously a disconnect here. I left the church. Then i came back. therefore I'm in full communion. Get it? Vatican II allows me to read my bible? you are ridiculous. what the hell does that even mean? I will not read the New catechism, becuase it is filled with errors of vatican II. I prefer the older catechisms. i don't need advice from someone who is a protestant heretic. [/quote] That post was for Convert4888 If you didn't know he is a convert. And if you didn't know Protestants read the Bible. Therefore I told him to keep reading the Bible as A Roman Catholic for Vatican II allows him to. And now that you mentioned it I think you are in need of much advice from Protestant heretics. INLOVE Jnorm P.S. "Just Because you are a Roman Catholic doesn't mean you must be biblically illiterate." Edited June 9, 2006 by jnorm888
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