Hope to stop use of 'liberal' and 'conservative'

[jswranch]

Someone is either obedient or disobedient to church teachings. There is no liberal or conservative view of this authority. Someone can be given over to dissent through Secularism, Humanism, Indifference, or Relativism or their own private interpretation... etc. How about faithful or unfaithful instead of lib or conserv? I would also accept cafeteria catholic, even for Society of St. Peter (i only know a little about them) or sedevacantis. I suppose Traditionalism, Feenyism are also terms (not sure if SSPXism or anti-VII or anti-ecuminicsm are words), but you all can come up with better terms than I. Isn't a refusal to receive communion in the hand a level of tolerated disobedience in the USA? If one tosses out one teaching, they are picking and choosing.

I just do not like "liberal' or 'conservative,' especially when there is a third option of following what the church teaches.

Edited June 21, 2006 by jswranch

[Aloysius]

"the society of st. peter"... if by that you mean the FSSP, they are in full union with the Church.

I believe you're lookin for the SSPX, society of st. pius x

[thessalonian]

Right, left, and Catholic (which is not neccessarily center)

Prov.4
[27] Do not swerve to the right or to the left;
turn your foot away from evil.

Edited June 21, 2006 by thessalonian

[Nathan]

Orthodox and heterodox are popular around these parts.

[morostheos]

[quote name='Nathan' post='1009908' date='Jun 21 2006, 03:20 PM']
Orthodox and heterodox are popular around these parts.
[/quote]

That's my vote.


I suppose the problem with all of these terms is the same reason we find them more appropriate.

The terms liberal and conservative by themselves carry no judgement. Of course, depending on who you talk to one is good and the other bad, but it's subjective.

With faithful and unfaithful, or orthodox and heterodox there is a judgement that one is right and the other is wrong. This is why they are really more appropriate terms, but also why it's very hard for them to come into widespread use. Heterodox Catholics certainly don't want to be called such, but they generally see "liberal" as a positive term.

So, while we would certainly strive to use more objective terms ourselves, I don't think the subjective ones will disappear any time soon.

[Myles Domini]

Spirituales and Relaxti work for me.

[Laudate_Dominum]

I often constrast the orthodox with the heterodox. I've found that I can call someone heterodox to their face and they don't seem bothered, whereas calling them a heretic usually brings out some hostility.

[Myles Domini]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1010258' date='Jun 22 2006, 06:39 AM']
I often constrast the orthodox with the heterodox. I've found that I can call someone heterodox to their face and they don't seem bothered, whereas calling them a heretic usually brings out some hostility.
[/quote]

[jswranch]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1009863' date='Jun 21 2006, 12:04 PM']
"the society of st. peter"... if by that you mean the FSSP, they are in full union with the Church.

I believe you're lookin for the SSPX, society of st. pius x
[/quote]
I meant FSSP. Correct any of my errancy, but they, while in full communion, detract and disagree with the magisterium on some VII and post-VII issues.


Shame on me for speaking this without doing more research. I thought they (FSSP) are founded by SSPX reverts who belive Lefebvre had a valid argument, but was errant in splitting from Rome.

[Aloysius]

the FSSP was erected by pontifical right by Pope John Paul II

[jswranch]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1010258' date='Jun 21 2006, 11:39 PM']
I often constrast the orthodox with the heterodox. I've found that I can call someone heterodox to their face and they don't seem bothered, whereas calling them a heretic usually brings out some hostility.
[/quote]
orthodox and heterodox are good. However, in the spoken word confusion occurs between, "He is orthodox," and, "He is Orthodox." "He is a faithful Catholic," is much more clear.

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1010315' date='Jun 22 2006, 07:06 AM']
the FSSP was erected by pontifical right by Pope John Paul II
[/quote]
Yes, I have heard this before.


I withdraw my comments categorizing FSSP as quasi-dissident as I have no solid arguments to support such claim. Apologies for any offended. Thank you for the correction.

Edited June 22, 2006 by jswranch

[Domine ut Videam]

[quote name='Nathan' post='1009908' date='Jun 21 2006, 02:20 PM']
Orthodox and heterodox are popular around these parts.
[/quote]


that's my vote........

[Jaime]

I like those as well. However some folks may not like to use the phrase "you've been blinded by the mindless heterodox media"


It doesn't quite have the same ring to it..

[Sojourner]

[quote name='hot stuff' post='1010348' date='Jun 22 2006, 10:43 AM']
I like those as well. However some folks may not like to use the phrase "you've been blinded by the mindless heterodox media"
It doesn't quite have the same ring to it..
[/quote]
I dunno. I might just have to adopt that.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='jswranch' post='1010318' date='Jun 22 2006, 07:19 AM']
orthodox and heterodox are good. However, in the spoken word confusion occurs between, "He is orthodox," and, "He is Orthodox." "He is a faithful Catholic," is much more clear.
[/quote]
yeah, I've had that happen a few times, but I kind of like it. If I fear what I'm trying to express might be a bit ambiguous I might qualify it and say they are an "orthodox catholic". It kind of has a ring to it.

[Socrates]

The way the mindless liberal media use the words "conservative" and "liberal," when reporting on the Catholic Church, they make it sound as though these are simply two equally legitimate "political factions" in the Church. (Just as one may be a liberal or conservative American.) This is especially irksome when they talk about things such as "Pope Benedict's ultra-conservative views on abortion and homosexuality" as though a "moderate" Pope could simply come in and change the Church's timeless moral teachings, or when it is implied that such teachings merely reflect the Pope's particular political persuasions.

I tend to prefer "orthodox" and "heterodox," or "faithful" and "unfaithful," though I myself have been known to gripe about "liberal Catholics."
I think "liberalism" can be used as an accurate label for the dominant heterodox "progressive" "do-your-own-thing" philosophy in the Church, as opposed to "right-wing" or "rad-trad" dissent.
While "Rad-trad" schism seems to be a growing problem in the Church, the vast majority of heterodox dissenters in the Church are of a "liberal" persuasion.
The typical "liberal Catholic" disagrees with the Church on things like abortion, women's ordination, and a host of sexual moral issues.

[jswranch]

In terms of the media and evangelical christians, I am a 'liberal' in the following areas:

Concern for the dignity of the worker
Empathy for those who die in the desert coming from Mexico for a better life
Against death penalty in US
Pro-organized labor movements
Dignity and loving treatment of persons with homosexual attractions
etc...


Conservative as I support teachings and policies of the CC.




Just another reason why I do not like 'liberal' and 'conservative' when describing catholics

[EcceNovaFacioOmni]

Contenders and pretenders?

[CrossCuT]

[size=1][color="330000"]I do not think that the difference between Liberal and Conservative are as strong as "Faithful and Unfaithful" etc.

I dunno...Im not much of a political person.
[/color][/size]

[jswranch]

[quote name='thedude' post='1010960' date='Jun 23 2006, 11:13 AM']
Contenders and pretenders?
[/quote]
best so far