Are We Catholics Ready To Save The World - Stop Global Warming?

[Anomaly]

[quote name='tate4242' post='1245735' date='Apr 16 2007, 01:46 PM']If you go to "News and Press Releases" at this link you will run into some pretty powerful statements that I personally have neither the expertise nor the inclination to attempt to disprove.[/quote]And there-in lies the rub. You neither have the time, nor the inclanation to disprove the powerful claims of someone. In the Debate phorum, there is a thread titled 'Global Warming is a hoax.' Sure the thread sounds negative, but there are a number of links that address both sides of the controversy.
Sure, it would be nice to live in a world where people told the truth, didn't have ulterior motives for almost everything they do, and it wasn't hard to find truthful answers to questions we may have. I keep pressing the 'easy' button, but nothing happens (although we haven't had to order white out for a long time now).
In this world we live in, the truth is usually somewhere in the middle of the what the extremists are shouting about. It's worthwile to listen to both sides and educate yourself as best you can, especially if you feel committed enough to think you have to encourage others to save the world, we gotta 'do something'. What is that something? Is recycling better than biodegradable and minimal package? Does recycling glass bottles use less energy and precious resources than aluminum? Can Americans not only use more efficient cars but also eliminate their energy use by turning off the 3rd and 4th TV, eliminating the decorative landscape lighting, turning on the computer only when you really are going to use it, use up the electronics (computer, tv, dvd player etc.) during it's functional life instead of our incessant up-grading to the latest gadget, how about sweeping the drive and using a manual edger instead of firing up the gas powered blower/edger/trimmer?
hmmm.......

[tate4242]

[quote name='Lounge Daddy' post='1245767' date='Apr 16 2007, 12:29 PM']As an evil conservative I am doing everything that I can to increase the size of my carbon footprint
bwaaa haha
but welcome to the Catholic Church[/quote]

Shalom Lounge Daddy:

Actually, when it comes to the green movement I am an absolute hypocrite...but my ability to admit this fact may be of some value. I HATE RECYCLING!!!...but i know that it is an extremely good idea....and i am kind of scared of getting a fine that is over $700 here in Nova Scotia if i get caught burning trash...and frankly it would probably be even easier to catch me doing this sort of diabolical act than it was for that reporter who got the Presidential candidate...was his name Rice....who claimed that he wasn't having an affair??

Anyway....there are two ways for the left to stop evil conservatives like you and I from burning our trash...they can either hit us with huge fines and jail terms longer than if we had committed murder...or recycling could be accomplished with more of a carrot/reward approach and somebody could fund a global deposit on virtually every sort of container...I was kind of hoping to convince Pope Benedict to consider taking on this role.....print up a Vatican Currency Unit and introduce a version of it in virtually every nation...so that recycling is handled by understanding conservatives as opposed to being controlled by zealous, well meaning but probably less than merciful left wing types!

[tate4242]

[quote name='Anomaly' post='1245802' date='Apr 16 2007, 01:07 PM']And there-in lies the rub. You neither have the time, nor the inclanation to disprove the powerful claims of someone. In the Debate phorum, there is a thread titled 'Global Warming is a hoax.' Sure the thread sounds negative, but there are a number of links that address both sides of the controversy.
Sure, it would be nice to live in a world where people told the truth, didn't have ulterior motives for almost everything they do, and it wasn't hard to find truthful answers to questions we may have. I keep pressing the 'easy' button, but nothing happens (although we haven't had to order white out for a long time now).
In this world we live in, the truth is usually somewhere in the middle of the what the extremists are shouting about. It's worthwile to listen to both sides and educate yourself as best you can, especially if you feel committed enough to think you have to encourage others to save the world, we gotta 'do something'. What is that something? Is recycling better than biodegradable and minimal package? Does recycling glass bottles use less energy and precious resources than aluminum? Can Americans not only use more efficient cars but also eliminate their energy use by turning off the 3rd and 4th TV, eliminating the decorative landscape lighting, turning on the computer only when you really are going to use it, use up the electronics (computer, tv, dvd player etc.) during it's functional life instead of our incessant up-grading to the latest gadget, how about sweeping the drive and using a manual edger instead of firing up the gas powered blower/edger/trimmer?
hmmm.......[/quote]

Excellent points Anomaly.

I will certainly try to find this thread but I will appreciate it if you put a link here because I am on dial up and at our new house and our connection seems to be roughly five times slower than at our older home where we shared a line with only two other families.

These are all excellent questions...and frankly I so hope that Pope Benedict will appoint a group of experts to tackle all of these questions because frankly....I don't really know the absolutely best answer to any of them...I worked in forestry for twenty five years and inhaling all that power saw exhaust has played havoc with my ability to be a scholar! Not to mention all those other brands of cigarettes that I smoked....and I always inhaled every cigarette that was passed to me even if the brand name of the tobacco might have been Zig Zag!

Well, it seems like some synaptic activity has been miraculously preserved because I am kind of proud of this introductory letter/warning shot over the bow, that I recently sent off to MP Peter MacKay who I will be running against if I do manage to get my candidacy in order for the upcoming federal election.

[b]Minister of Foreign Affairs MP Peter Mackay. Federal Budget 2007 is Good for Nova Scotia. Dennis Tate[/b]

[quote]Foreign Affairs Minister MP Peter Mackay

Dear Minister Mackay:

I wish to thank you for providing Central Nova with
what both my wife Maria and I regard to be excellent
representation under the existing political and
economic parameters. I must agree with you that each
of the benefits mentioned in your article "Federal
Budget 2007 is Good For Nova Scotia" are important
accomplishments for you and for the federal
Conservative Party of Canada. I am especially glad to
read that there is a new $2000 Child Tax Credit and
that Lifetime Capital Gains Tax Exemption has been
increased to $750,000.


Minister Mackay, I heard you speak at the 2006 federal
debate held at Pictou Campus of NSCC. I personally was
in essential agreement with perhaps eighty percent of
your comments but I am still seriously considering
running as an independent candidate for Central Nova
in the upcoming federal election.

One issue that you raised at the debate that I cannot
support was that you are pro-choice in regards to
abortion. I would appreciate your further elaboration
if not complete reconsideration on this important
question.

Minister Mackay, please imagine that you, Prime
Minister Harper and your Conservative Party colleagues
are soon able to help restructure the entire Canadian
federal monetary and taxation system to such a degree
that each year Canada has a massive federal budget
surplus in excess of thirty billion dollars?

Please visualize also that at this same time that you
have helped to reduce the personal income taxation
burden on Canadians to less than twenty percent at
most? Under this much more positive set of political
and economic conditions I am sure that we would soon
see Canadian unemployment levels drop to an all time
low.

If the Canadian economy is booming from coast to coast
I suspect that you no longer would have such a high
level of empathy for young women who at this time,
under the existing far less than ideal conditions,
feel that if they deliver a child previous to the
completion of their education that they may well be
condemned to a life characterized by reliance on
social assistance.

One of the impressions that I took away from the NSCC
debate was that you Mr. Mackay will one day make a
highly capable Prime Minister of Canada. Obviously
Prime Minister Stephen Harper feels the same way or he
would not have appointed you Minister of Foreign
Affairs and of ACOA.

Minister Mackay, do you not think that Canadians will
regard you with even greater esteem if you help to
free up an extra sixty to one hundred billion dollars
for each annual federal budget?

Please find below part one of my application for the
Virgin Earth anti-global warming Challenge. It is
entitled "Anti-Armageddon Paradigm Shift Monetary
Policy Theory - The Introduction."

Shalom.

Dennis Tate

p.s.

[url="http://www.virginearth.com/"]http://www.virginearth.com/[/url]

"Dr James Hansen, Director of NASA’s Goddard Institute
for Space Studies: “I think we have a very brief
window of opportunity to deal with climate change ...
no longer than a decade, at the most. This is why I am
supporting the Virgin Earth Challenge as a judge – we
must explore all means, both known and unknown, to
help alleviate this crisis.”"

Minister Mackay, I personally do not possess either
the expertise or the courage to discount this
statement by Dr. Hansen. I think it is prudent to take
a serious look at Canadian Wartime monetary policy to
see if our existing Canadian monetary and taxation
system can be adjusted slightly to give us greatly
improved fuel efficiency.

"Anti-Armageddon Paradigm Shift Monetary Policy Theory
- The Introduction."[/quote].....at this point we are right back to the first post in this thread.

[Phoenix Reborn]

[quote name='tate4242' post='1263398' date='May 3 2007, 01:47 PM']I will certainly try to find this thread but I will appreciate it if you put a link here because I am on dial up and at our new house and our connection seems to be roughly five times slower than at our older home where we shared a line with only two other families.[/quote]

[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=46841&st=0"]THIS[/url] should be the thread.

[curtins]

[quote name='Lounge Daddy' post='1245767' date='Apr 16 2007, 02:29 PM']As an evil conservative I am doing everything that I can to increase the size of my carbon footprint
bwaaa haha
but welcome to the Catholic Church[/quote]


me too.

[tate4242]

[quote name='Phoenix Reborn' post='1263408' date='May 3 2007, 03:51 PM'][url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=46841&st=0"]THIS[/url] should be the thread.[/quote]

Thank you Phoenix Reborn. You are right some extremely good points are made here! If I plan to debate with the gifted and glib Mr. Peter MacKay then I can get some good practice in by starting with these points.


[quote]There is no such thing as "global warming" in the sense that it will send us into an ice age or just keep getting hotter.

Why do I say this? Because when we look back in history we see that the earth's temperature cycles vary from 100 to 250 years. Much longer than any of us will live. The earth cools and warms in cycles. We are living in a warming phase and it will start to cool back down within the next ten years, possibly five years.

The world is so many millions of years old, one volcano puts out more pollutants than we do in 10,000 years... more CFC's and more "green house gases" than we could ever do. 30 volcanoes erupt every year. So, for humans to do as much "damage" as one year of "damage" that volcanoes do it will take us 300,000 years... Now, what we do is a drop in the bucket when looking at the big picture.

What happens in our atmosphere to the bad gases? When the sun's UV rays hit oxygen they create ozone which is a bond between 3 oxygen atoms. Ozone is highly reactive and seeks out various gases, reacts with them, and turns them into somthing harmless - it's also a great way to kill germs. That is why if you put a UV light near the litter box it will help destroy foul odors. It is also why many safety glasses cabinets in chemistry classes have uv lights in them.

It's all a cycle.

Just look at the temperatures throughout history... grab a farmers almanac.

The media are a bunch of chicken littles and are very selective in what they show you. The "Sky is falling" gets more ratings than "We have nothing to worry about.".

As Public Enemy said "Don't believe the hype".

God Bless,
ironmonk
[url="http://www.CatholicSwag.com"]http://www.CatholicSwag.com[/url] <- Media zombie free[/quote]

Shalom Iron Monk:

You may well be somewhat correct that the world is experiencing a warming trend that is partly the result of a natural cycle. Even if this is the case this would still not negate the potential benefits that could be drived if hundreds of massive desalinization plants were constructed to pump fresh water into the Sahara or Sinai desert.

If the polar ice caps continue to melt then the town of Antigonish, Nova Scotia would be pretty well flooded if world ocean levels went up by merely two meters. In the movie/documentary "Too Hot Not To Handle" it was stated that world ocean levels would rise by roughly twenty feet if the ice cap on Greenland Melted and by 240 ft if the Antarctica ice pack melted. Many communities in the riding of Central Nova will be destroyed and property values will plummet as we see ocean levels rise.

My theory that politicians, statesmen and business leaders all over the world should begin to discuss how to FINANCE massive projects that at least will temporarily alleviate some of the most potentially destructive immediate symptoms of global warming is still valid, even if a natural warming trend accounts for perhaps forty percent of world temperature increases.

If you tell me that we don't have to worry about this for at least another fifty years I could respond that in the latter days somebody is supposed to come along who will inspire parents to care more for their children. If we mortals had a better grasp of Judeo-Christian ethics we would be more careful to not set in motion trends that will probably result in disaster for our grandchildren.

"A righteous man leaves an inheritance for his children's children."

Perhaps I am thoroughly incorrect in this assertion but I personally feel that because the Vatican is a state, nobody on earth is in quite as powerful a position to take the necessary action needed to finance such a massive project as I am proposing than Pope Benedict XVI. I believe that he has been sent here at this time for exactly this type of action.

"those who know their God shall be strong and shall do exploits."

It has been theorized that Pope John Paul I was murdered by the Italian Mafia after he promised to introduce generally accepted accounting principles into the Vatican Bank where it is suspected that the mafia has gained considerable power.

I have a method in mind that could clean up the Vatican Bank in a few months but it is much safer for Pope Benedict himself if this clean up happens as part of a grassroots movement rather by lay persons in the Catholic Church rather than by Papal edict.

[tate4242]

[quote name='thessalonian' post='1243235' date='Apr 14 2007, 07:12 PM']I am not a fan of global warming. But I wouldn't call you a heretic for believing in it and you are welcome in the Church. Here is a counter websited by the way:

[url="http://newsbusters.org/node/11940"]http://newsbusters.org/node/11940[/url]

Though I am in favor of cleaing up our air and water and caring for the planet God has entrusted us with. I am just doudtful that we are the cause of this current shift in weahter since there have been similar shifts in the past and I vividly remember as a teen hearing about global cooling and the immenent ice age that the governement was supposed to fix.

I would say that your desires to rid the world of it's hunger problems and all is a noble one. The solution to it however is simple. Catholics must start living their faith and then the world will follow and be converted. To that end come in to the Church with fire and you will do far more than some new economic idea. Not that I would discourage your economic ideas. I just say Jesus Christ above all is THEE answer. Prayer is key.

God bless and welcome to phatmass.[/quote]

Shalom again Thessalonian:

I am curious. Personally I believe that Isaiah chapters 42 - 46 indicate that standing up for the basic religious freeom of others should be an important part of our Catholic Faith. The historical King Cyrus allowed a high level of religious freedom for all his subjects Jewish and Gentile.

I plan to make increased economic cooperation with the nation of Israel as well as Jewish control of the Temple Mount area and the construction of the Jewish Third Temple an important part of my federal level political platform.

Do you think that I will get excommunicated for believing that the upcoming millennium should be one where Jews have the religious, economic and political freedom to fulfill every verse in Ezekiel chapters 40 to 48?

Do you think that I will be kicked out of the church for advocating that we should organize a one million sister march to the Vatican state and encourage the nuns to occupy all Vatican Bank buildings so that the promises of Pope John Paul I can be put into place?

All of this can be organized as a reality film. I believe that if Pope Benedict XVI proposed the creation of a new Vatican Currency unit at the same time that the nuns are trained to take over the roles of all the male workers in the Vatican Bank. Then the influence of the Italian mafia on the Vatican Bank can be virtually eliminated and the desires of Pope John Paul I can be granted to him.

If the sisters knew that they were about to get involved in monetary policy at the macro-economic level then they would be well aware that within ten years it would be possible to give the necessary medicine to every leper on earth, food for the hungry, computers for students, free circumcisions could be arranged for poor males all throughout the Third World. (It has been proven that an HIV infected wife virtually cannot transmit the AIDS virus to her husband if he is circumcised so free circumcisions for young men in the Third World would almost eliminate the AIDS epidemic within two to five decades)!

Sisters armed with the knowledge that they are about to be able to change the entire world would easily hold back the Italian Mafia.

Better yet! The Vatican Bank could be moved to Antigonish Nova Scotia which would be perfectly set up by bestowing sainthood on Dr. Moses Coady and Dr. Jimmy Thompkins!

[url="http://www.coady.stfx.ca/history.cfm"]http://www.coady.stfx.ca/history.cfm[/url]

[Maggyie]

[quote]Do you think that I will be kicked out of the church for advocating that we should organize a one million sister march to the Vatican state and encourage the nuns to occupy all Vatican Bank buildings so that the promises of Pope John Paul I can be put into place?[/quote]

[tate4242]

[quote name='Maggie' post='1271944' date='May 12 2007, 01:04 PM'] [/quote]

Hi Maggie:

Yes...I know that this sounds a little far fetched.....but at the very minimum it is kind of encouraging to speculate that maybe we could fulfill some of the more nasty prophecies as scenes in an epic reality film series???!!!

[quote]Before their face the people shall be much pained: all faces shall gather blackness.
They shall run like mighty men; they shall climb the wall like men of war; and they shall march every one on his ways, and they shall not break their ranks:
Neither shall one thrust another; they shall walk every one in his path: and [when]they fall upon the sword, they shall not be wounded.[/quote]Joel

Although I am 99.8% certain that I am incorrect in this assumption...I do regard it as a remote possibility that these passages could perhaps be talking about the making of a reality film....Maybe these wounded soldiers are for real trying to crush, kill, rape, pillage and destroy and maybe they have some sort of new genetically engineered drug that revives them after being wounded.....or are they involved in a massive epic series of reality films based in Europe and the Middle East....brilliantly tailored for the evangelical Xian market????!!!!

Yes...I admit that synthetically produced blood flowing up to the bridles of the horses ....as a movie prop....is kind of far fetched....but surely this would be better than doing all this for real during a time of total agricultural collapse????!!!!

[quote]Then he said unto them, O geniuses, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: [/quote]Luke 24:25

I am obligated to believe everything in the Bible but it comforting to imagine that we may have some control over the how and when that events are fulfilled so that the negative consequences of all this can be minimized...and perhaps the wrath of the LORD appeased:

[quote]Who art registered in the judgments of times to [b]appease the wrath of the Lord[/b],[/quote]Ecclesiasticus 48:10

I've given a lot of thought over the past few years as to how Jewish control of the Temple Mount area could be arranged....how the Arab nations could be convinced to agree to this happening and the best most promising theory on how this may be arranged is the putting forward of a forty year plan to shoot massive epic reality films centered in Jerusalem...and at the end of this forty year period Israel has complete control of the Temple Mount area....The Jewish Third Temple has been built.....every stone in the ancient Temple has been "thrown down" and then reassembled elsewhere as a museum/historical site....

The Dome of the Rock on the other hand should be dismantled with the utmost care and again reassembled elsewhere as a historical site..... It was originally a gift to the Jewish people from an Arab prince who had tremendous respect for Moshe and all things Jewish so it could be given back to the Arab nations quite gracefully especially if doing so paved the way for the rebuilding of the Third TEmple....

I think that one half of Jerusalem must be rented/leased for the filming of the capture of one half of Jerusalem spoken of by Zechariah....

The rental/leasing of Jerusalem among other royalties, concessions and box office sales will help finance the REbuilding of the Third Temple leaving Israel with no outstanding debt despite the magnitude of the entire project......

Considering that China will by 2010 have perhaps as many as 170,000,000 men who will have virtually no hope of ever finding a wife due to China's habit of aborting ninety percent of female babies....I believe that larger and larger troops of reality film actors posing as soldiers from many time periods and places....can be lured to the Valley of Megiddo....partly due to the efforts of female actors who are metaphorically spiritual eagles who are very interested in nabbing themselves one of those desperate guys from China!

And of course who better to arrange all of this than Pope Benedict XVI?

[tate4242]

[quote name='Maggie' post='1271944' date='May 12 2007, 01:04 PM']
St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle![/quote]

Oh...If I am not mistaken another name for Michael is Metatron and this ancient Jewish writing certainly will give us some promising material for reality film scenes:

[url="http://www.religiousstudies.uncc.edu/jcreeves/sefer_zerubbabel.htm"]http://www.religiousstudies.uncc.edu/jcree..._zerubbabel.htm[/url]

[quote]Metatron responded by saying to me: ‘Ask me (questions) and I will provide you with answers before I depart from you.’ So I again asked him and said to him, ‘My lord Metatron, when will the light of Israel come?’ He answered and said to me, ‘By the Lord Who has sent me and Who has appointed me over Israel, I solemnly swear to reveal to you the Lord’s doing(s), for the Holy God previously commanded me, “Go to My servant Zerubbabel, and tell him (the answers to) whatever he may ask of you.”’ Then Michael, who is (also) Metatron, said to me, ‘Come closer and pay careful attention to everything which I shall tell you, for the word which I am speaking to you is true; it was one spoken by the Living God.’[/quote]

[The Joey-O]

I prefer to listen to science over journalism. We are contributing to global warming in a big way (those of us in the states, anyways), despite what your newspaper or local Republican may be telling you.

[tate4242]

[quote name='The Joey-O' post='1275096' date='May 16 2007, 12:45 PM']I prefer to listen to science over journalism. We are contributing to global warming in a big way (those of us in the states, anyways), despite what your newspaper or local Republican may be telling you.[/quote]

Hi Joey:

Personally I agree with you and I take the thread of global warming seriously although I must admit that I saw an interview by a Dr. Faron Ellis two days ago that quite well covered other aspects of this question. For one thing he disagreed with using corn to produce ethanol for several reasons. For one thing people in Mexico were complaining that the mad rush to produce ethanol had caused a massive hike in the price of tortillas because of increases in the price of corn. Dr. Ellis said that it took essentially one barrel of oil of energy to produce one barrel of oil worth of energy if you used corn to produce ethanol. Sugar cane on the other hand when used to produce ethanol was much better. It took only one barrel of oil of energy to produce six barrels worth of ethanol when using sugar cane.

He well illustrated how activists can be well meaning but can take actions that make life very difficult for the poor who are facing circumstances different from ours.

I do love the idea though of financing a massive solar energy unit in the Mojave desert though that could replace fossil fuel usage for the entire USA as theorized in the movie "Too Hot NOT to Handle."

[jckinsman]

Wow! I don't know what it is about this subject that makes me want to sleep! Welcome anyway! I love your energy on this topic! It's refreshingly silly in serious way No,I don't smoke and I never have! I guess after reading all of this I'am a little more educated on the subject. Here is my stand in a nutshell. I love the earth! God made it! He made it for us to live on. He gave us an atmosphere so that we can survive here. He gave us renewable resources to use, not abuse. We should all do our part to take care of what God has entrusted us with. We have not been here for billions of years,so in saying that,....we can only predict the out come of our abuses. Fiction not fact. We can however see that when we abuse somthing long enough it will fail eventually.I hope that as catholics we can look beyond the steriotypical conservative thinking that all enviromaniacs are freakest! Only because in some instances they have taken some issues to an extreme. Ultra- conservatives such as my brother,will go far right to overemphasize the point. Spotted owls,beached whales and such. I on the other hand believe all things that live are connected.Take care of them and it ,in return,will take care of you. Sin against nature and reap the consequences of it.
Above all,I hope that we all do the right thing before GOD. I hope we thank him everyday for this wonderful planet and I pray he places before us people of great discernment. If we do not happen to hear him in time,....I hope we all made it to confession! *catholic Humor* Peace be with you JC :

[tate4242]

[quote name='jckinsman' post='1275180' date='May 16 2007, 03:11 PM']Wow! I don't know what it is about this subject that makes me want to sleep! Welcome anyway! I love your energy on this topic! It's refreshingly silly in serious way No,I don't smoke and I never have! I guess after reading all of this I'am a little more educated on the subject. Here is my stand in a nutshell. I love the earth! God made it! He made it for us to live on. He gave us an atmosphere so that we can survive here. He gave us renewable resources to use, not abuse. We should all do our part to take care of what God has entrusted us with. We have not been here for billions of years,so in saying that,....we can only predict the out come of our abuses. Fiction not fact. We can however see that when we abuse somthing long enough it will fail eventually.I hope that as catholics we can look beyond the steriotypical conservative thinking that all enviromaniacs are freakest! Only because in some instances they have taken some issues to an extreme. Ultra- conservatives such as my brother,will go far right to overemphasize the point. Spotted owls,beached whales and such. I on the other hand believe all things that live are connected.Take care of them and it ,in return,will take care of you. Sin against nature and reap the consequences of it.
Above all,I hope that we all do the right thing before GOD. I hope we thank him everyday for this wonderful planet and I pray he places before us people of great discernment. If we do not happen to hear him in time,....I hope we all made it to confession! *catholic Humor* Peace be with you JC :[/quote]

Shalom JCKinsman:

In my opinion your reply demonstates a truly wonderful and highly insightful approach to this critical....but yes...rather dull subject!

I agree that many conservative types are classifying most environmentalists as radical whereas perhaps this movement has its roots in an outpouring of the Ruach ha Kodesh/Holy Spirit that is stirring people up to wish to try to obey one of the first commands ever given to mankind: "dress it and keep it."

The Apocalypse speaks about a mark of the beast system and by analogy our modern industrial economy that is wiping out numerous species of flora and fauna is obviously somewhat of an abomination because we do not know how much effort, "time" and experimental labour may have gone into YHWH inventing and mass producing each and every life form that inhabits this world.

Personally I think of Abba Father YHWH as an inventor/scientists who engineered each life form out of energy. I am wide open to the idea that the first Other that He created was YHWH The Mother who is known as Wisdom/Infinite Knowledge in Judaism. I suspect that he ripped something like a rib out of His own side to form her from. Then she was with Him as He worked on, designed and invented every higher space time dimensional realm with all the myriad variety of life forms that inhabit them. We know from Job chapter 38 that the angels shouted for joy at the creation of the earth so obviously they had been given life long before we humans were put here.

Dr. Stephen Hawking and other nuclear mathematician physicists believe that the four forces that exist in our realm can be mathematically unified in ten space time dimensions. Interestingly a fifth dimension in which electromagnetism is mathematically unified with gravity would be INVISIBLE from our fourth dimension for reasons that they elaborate on....also a seventh dimension could be INVISIBLE to a sixth dimensional life form...and so on.

If Abba Father YHWH is the Being who evolved in the SuperForce/Super Energetic tenth or eleventh space time dimensional continuum that always has existed because it is composed of truly absolute energy that cannot be further subdivided.....then all other life forms in the entire universe have been invented, designed, engineered much as we humans come up with new technology and devices. Truly we have been made in the image of God! ....I truly believe that when we have a common language and a goal that we can agree on...human technological and inventive capability is almost without limit!

Twenty five years ago I would not have believed it if anybody had told me that I was going to be a Catholic by perhaps 2010. Seventeen years ago The Heavenly Father has been shoving me in exactly this direction and considering the phenomenal replies that I am receiving here on this topic...it is obvious to me that The Roman Catholic Church....despite her flaws and we all have so many of those....still...Catholics are the people who seem to be awaiting the return of Mashiach/Messiah/Christ with the most humble and expectant attitude!

It is truly an honor to have met you and to read your replies....Thank you IMMENSELY for wading through this thread!!!!

You have all greatly encouraged me!

[tate4242]

[quote name='Winchester' post='1243278' date='Apr 14 2007, 08:04 PM']Unless we can find a way to halt the continual warming since we left our last ice age, we aren't going to stop global warming. We can reduce or eliminate our theoretical contribution, but we can't halt it.[/quote]

The more I think about this comment...the more I realize that you may well be onto something!

I guess that The Creator has set in motion a series of events that lead up to a time period when the light of the sun will be sevenfold around the time that the Messianic era dawns...so it is quite possible that to whatever degree our planet is going through a warming trend...this trend could be far moreso partly natural than I might tend to think after watching "An Inconvenenient Truth" two times and then "Too Hot NOT to Handle" as well!

But still...the obsession with taking a serious look at our industrial and technological economy in hopes to put pressure on government and industry to make alterations that will result in fewer and fewer life forms being wiped out each year...is a very good thing!

And Mr. Al Gore sure made a powerful point when he stated that the parts per million level of CO2 in our atmosphere is 650,000 times as high at our time period than ever before.

The movie "The Corporation" also makes a very good case that large multi national companies tend to behave in a manner comparable with the thought pattern of a sociopath! So certainly we cannot fully trust a govenment policy that has been pushed on political leaders by big business! The same people who tend to be calling out for reform to combat "global warming" also tend to be against such measures as "terminator gene" technology being used in food production...which I agree is dangerous in the extreme.

On the other hand Dr. Faron Ellis certainly seems to be correct that the Kyoto agreement obsession with increasing our use of ethanol may be almost as harmful ...and in some cases more harmful than beneficial.

The prophet Esdras once told the King of Persia that TRUTH was the most powerful force and that sooner or later it would over power all of its opponents. May the heavenly Father speed the day when the weakest Christian has a greater level of understanding of truth than John the Baptist possessed and also when the weakest Jew is more powerful than King David.

One problem with growing in our understanding of TRUTH on any subject is that we have to face lots of information that may contradict what we previously believed...therefore we may go through a stage where we tend to flip/flop back and forth somewhat on how to approach that particular subject. But if we pray for guidance from God and continue to research our favourite topics we will certainly draw closer and closer to having a good understanding in our main areas of interest.

[jckinsman]

So what you are saying is you believe God created all life! I would love to here what you have to say on the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist! Might I say It does take elements of FAITH in God to pull it all together and I worry the sceintific mind may have the tendency to,....well overthink, what the Grand creator had intended. How do you keep yourself in check? Do you have a source of authority when you can not find an answer? Might I suggest the book" A father who keeps his promises" by Dr.Scott Hahn. A study on the typology in the bible. Maybe you have already read it!....... Now I was just curious about the date that you set for becoming catholic? Why then? JC

[Aloysius]

Here are the alternative theories which explain everything happening on our planet just as much and account for why the temperature of Mars has also been increasing:
[url="http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/milankovitch.html"]http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/milankovitch.html[/url]

[url="http://blog.gildertech.com/index.php?/archives/44-Good-news,-Mr.-Gore,-the-Apocalypse-has-been-postponed.html"]http://blog.gildertech.com/index.php?/arch...-postponed.html[/url]

[quote]Personally I think of Abba Father YHWH as an inventor/scientists who engineered each life form out of energy. I am wide open to the idea that the first Other that He created was YHWH The Mother who is known as Wisdom/Infinite Knowledge in Judaism. I suspect that he ripped something like a rib out of His own side to form her from. Then she was with Him as He worked on, designed and invented every higher space time dimensional realm with all the myriad variety of life forms that inhabit them. We know from Job chapter 38 that the angels shouted for joy at the creation of the earth so obviously they had been given life long before we humans were put here.[/quote]
No, this begins to get into heresy and polytheism. The Father begets the Son before all Ages in eternity, the love between the Father and the Son is the Holy Spirit; and these three are one; and there is no other Person in this blessed Trinity. If you believe there to be another person within this trinity, you put yourselves outside the realm of Catholic Doctrine. If you believe there to be a mother goddess, you put yourself outside the realm of monotheism itself. You would have to place this "Mother YHWH" as an angel of some sort, but we know from scripture and tradition that Angels are pure spirit and have no sex; which is why we refer to them in the masculine because that is the default (think of a crosswalk sign in new york city: it has the symbol for a man walking; one time, as an experiment, they took down the no crossing sign with an x through the little man symbol and put one with the x through the little woman symbol... they had to take it down because too many men were almost getting killed: the feminine refers to a specific sex, the masculine does not so much)

Our Mother is Mary most Holy, the mother of all Christians. It is said that part of the reason the Angels rebelled is because they knew of God's plan to raise her, a mere human creature, above them- pure angelic beings.

The stuff in the Hebrew Scriptures about "Wisdom" refers either to Christ and/or (scriptures can have multiple layers of meaning) Mary most Holy.

If you like, we can extend this into the debate table.

[XIX]

[quote name='tate4242' post='1275760' date='May 17 2007, 11:33 AM']And Mr. Al Gore sure made a powerful point when he stated that the parts per million level of CO2 in our atmosphere is 650,000 times as high at our time period than ever before.[/quote]
650,000 times as high as before? That sounds like a really horrible statistic to me, like something that happens when some researcher has a clonclsion in mind and will do anything to get to that conclusion. But in all honesty, I think you are remembering the statistic wrong.

I mean if it was really that high, wouldn't the atmosphere be like 80% CO2 or something like that? Wouldn't we all die from suffocation if CO2 was that high?



Personally, I tend to think that global warming is real. But I don't know this, and I never will know for a fact. It's not going to affect my lifestyle--being environmentally friendly is a good thing to do, global warming or no global warming. And it's not going to affect how I vote--I am a very proud single-issue pro-life voter.

[jckinsman]

Hey a match made in heaven! :applause:

[tate4242]

[quote name='jckinsman' post='1275779' date='May 17 2007, 12:26 PM']So what you are saying is you believe God created all life! I would love to here what you have to say on the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist! Might I say It does take elements of FAITH in God to pull it all together and I worry the sceintific mind may have the tendency to,....well overthink, what the Grand creator had intended. How do you keep yourself in check? Do you have a source of authority when you can not find an answer? Might I suggest the book" A father who keeps his promises" by Dr.Scott Hahn. A study on the typology in the bible. Maybe you have already read it!....... Now I was just curious about the date that you set for becoming catholic? Why then? JC [/quote]

Shalom JCKinsman:

For starters I can't become Catholic until I feel that I have warned each and every Catholic official to whom I am submitting my request to be Catholic about all the reasons why they might perhaps not want me as a member of the church. If they feel that they will have to excommunicate two or three months after I become a member then it is better for everybody concerned that I remain as a non-member.

This subject of Christ in the Eucharist is a fascinating one. Twenty years ago I would have laughed at the idea but not anymore.

I take very literally the statement "in all their affliction he was afflicted." As a matter of fact I believe that the scourging and the crucifixion of Yahushua/Jesus that was so well portrayed in "The Passion" would have been a piece of cake for Yahushua/Jesus in comparison with what He has had to do over these past two thousand years as He was seated at the right hand of Power/The Ancient of Days.

Personally, I believe that Joseph/Yosef and Mary/Myriam had several other children after Yahushua/Jesus was born. I believe the names of the sons were James, Joses, Simon and Judas and Jesus also had sisters (plural)/more than one. Now Joseph and Mary were Jewish and it is not stated clearly that all the brethren of Yahushua/Jesus became Christians although I believe that James and Judas are two who did. If the others did not become Christian, and remained Jewish, then they probably married Jewish spouces and had Jewish children as well as Jewish grandchildren.

Pope John Paul II stated plainly that the Roman Catholic Church had historically been a ring leader in anti-Semitic activity. This statement is certainly true but this admission is extremely important to me and is one of the reasons why I might just be able to be accepted as Catholic.

Yahushua/Jesus promised to rule over his people with wrath and fury poured out and I believe that He has certainly fulfilled this promise. But I cannot imagine or comprehend that He has enjoyed the process.

Not long after Yahushua/Jesus clearly and accurately stated that all power in heaven and on the earth had been given to Him, He arranged for the destruction of the Second Temple and the diaspora of all his relatives and friends all over the earth. Then He arranged for a sword to be raised up against them. Often He used His church to be the sword, or hammer, or fire that He used against His own people. He certainly has shown not one iota of favouritism to his own family, not even to the probable literal descendants of Joseph and Mary.

But all of these things He did for a million reasons that my poor little 118 IQ level brain cannot even begin to comprehend.

I believe firmly that to some degree YHWH, The Ancient of Days and Yahushua/Jesus/The Word is truly inside of/connected to each and every human being who walks this earth today. King Solomon spoke of a silver cord and numberous people who had a near death experience report viewing a silver cord that was connected either to their head or to their stomach area. "The heart of the king is in the hands of YHWH, he turns it wherever he wills."

I believe that YHWH in one sense is composed of absolute energy and could well be seen as a Being of Light. This passage in the Book of Baruch causes me to suspect that the Being of Light viewed in roughly thirty percent of near death experiences is none other than YHWH.
[url="http://www.drbo.org/chapter/30006.htm"]http://www.drbo.org/chapter/30006.htm[/url]
"For my angel is with you: And I myself will demand an account of your souls."

I also believe that YHWH and Yahushua/Jesus are connected to every living thing. It states in a Psalm somewhere that Messiah will come to the earth riding a cherub and in the Apocalypse it is stated that Christ returns riding a white horse. Is the cherub mentioned in the Psalms in the form of a horse???

Are animals made in the image of various forms of angelic life? Is our raising chickens in miniscule cages analogous to what the Nazi government did to the Jewish people??

Is it true as reported in various NDE's that every blade of grass in heaven is alive and has a far greater level of consciousness than we could imagine possible?

It is also shown to many nde experiencers that God is somehow in every blade of grass or flower in heaven!

If God is therefore in higher space time dimensional blades of grass or wheat, or corn, then could He somehow NOT be in our fourth space time dimensional grass or corn??

And if He is somehow in all grass or corn then ofcourse He is even moreso somehow within the unleavened bread that we decree is in the image of the body of the Mashiach that was broken for us.

And here is one of the problems that the Roman Catholic officials who deal with me will face as I come closer to "conversion." I have certain superstitions/beliefs/habits/opinions based on the fact that I am rather "Jewish" in my philosophy and upbringing. As I near my first communion I will request that the priest break the wafer similar to how it is my custom to break up a piece of unleavened bread/matzos to represent how Yahushua/Jesus was broken for our healing.

To my thinking the passage in Isaiah 52:
"As many were astonied at thee; his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men:"
may indicate that perhaps Yahushua/Jesus even went through castration.

....maybe I am terribly in error in thinking this....but I am certain that He took upon Himself every curse.....for our sake!

The man who would do all this for us has not had an easy time sitting at the right hand of Power and decreeing all the events of the past two millennia....

When somehow the coming last Elijah person will be able to "appease" his wrath....I bet it will be an incredible relief to Him.

In my opinion...maybe relative ignorance is indeed bliss...I love being human and knowing so little....I would compare sitting at the right hand of Power while Nazi doctors are injecting blue dye in the eyes of little Jewish girls as a level of hell that I cannot comprehend....

and I know that THEY suffer when we abuse animals as well.....

All things have been formed by the WORD of YHWH...by the Holy Spirit...by Super Force and Super Energetic Matter....and just as we break up the wafer so also the Universe is here for us to be taught and learn more and more....

Oh a subatomic level....perhaps quarks are saying YEEEHAH!....weeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!! almost as if on a roller coaster ride...they may have a far higher level of consciousness than we might imagine...Albert Einstein stated that infinite smallness was just as possible theoretically as infinite bigness!

Yes...Yahushua/Jesus is somehow in those wafers that men...made in His image...bless and state are representative of Him/His Body. But I wonder if the priests who I meet will be offended when I request that the wafer be broken to symbolize how Yahushua/Jesus was indeed broken for us???

If this small request grieviously offends them...then what would they do with an actual Chassidic Jew from the Bronx if he were led to the Catholic Church as well???

As far as having an authrity goes...we Jews have kind of a problem...the soldiers of Israel refused to follow the orders of King Saul when he commanded them to kill the priests at the city where King David had been assisted.

I believe that all authority comes from YHWH...certainly King Nebuchadnezzar was a servant of YHWH and even a head of gold...but it was the job of Hananiah, Mishael and Azariah to disobey the order to worship the image that King Nebuchadnezzar had been inspired to set up. YHWH is the greatest of reality film producers and He has the infinte right to tell each of us to go wherever He wishes for us to go and say and do whatever He tell us....and the result is for our consumption as well!