Harry Potter

[goldenchild17]

[quote name='johnnydigit' post='1330346' date='Jul 15 2007, 10:41 PM']if it's 99% harmless and 1% evil, is it ok? what if it's 90% harmless and 10% evil, is it ok? 70/30? 60/40? 50/50? where do you draw the line? how safe would you want your own children to be?

if you think it's harmless, perhaps you should find out why important officials in our Church feel the way they do. you might be surprised. i don't know the details, but i'll just play it safe and find something else for my nephew and future children.[/quote]

Satan's more than happy with 99 truths if you accept one lie

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='jiyoung' post='1330403' date='Jul 16 2007, 06:26 AM']It's not meant to be a catechetical Catholic movie. But as the catechetics faculty at FUS says, you can make anything catechetical. And besides, we're not supposed to shield children from EVERYTHING that could *possibly* have a message not completely congruent with Catholic teaching--they'll never watch anything. I think there's nothing wrong with letting the children watch/read Harry Potter as long as you take the opportunity to use it as a catechetical moment. The woman who wrote that book, The Mystery of Harry Potter, is saying as much. Take the time with your kids to read it with them and point out what's good and reinforces Catholic teaching and general good morals, and what doesn't, perhaps more importantly--because the concern is more about the things that don't go along with Catholic foundations and can creep in to affect a child's beliefs negatively undetected. I think the uproar is more about the witchcraft and all that's involved. But honestly I don't think it really resembles actual witchcraft--brooms, wands, hocus-pocus magic words, fanciful creatures like dragons? It's fantasy, not occult literature. And as long as a child is firmly grounded in reality, a little fantasy won't hurt. But, as that book also stresses, it's up to the parents, who should read the books and decide what to do themselves.[/quote]

That's how I see it, too. These books are more about good vs. evil than anything else, and can be used to illustrate a point. I don't remember the link that Terra Firma put up a few weeks back, on how these books basically rely on tradition of alchemy, which is strong in British literature. Besides, if I were to be against these for witchcraft, I also would not read MacBeth, pretty much any of the Norse sagas, etc. It is definitely important to stress to the child reading it that it is fantasy, and to talk about it, though.

[Innocent]

[quote name='zwergel88' post='1330237' date='Jul 16 2007, 08:58 AM']I think that this thread is the most ridiculous thing I have ever seen. Harry Potter is some of the greatest literature ever written,[/quote]

That's a very interesting viewpoint. What do you consider to be the distinguishing features of good literature?

[Bonbon]

Harmless, to someone who knows the truth. My younger siblings watch it, knowing that is all fake. They don't go around pretending to be wizards. They barely think about the movie after they watch it. Some children are more sensitive yes. Its all up to a parent whether their kid can watch that movie. They know how their kids are.

If people are up against it because its about magic. What about LOTR? there's wizards in there, Chronicles of Narina? Wizard of Oz? Wicked? Countless movies have magical people and things in them. Yes there is dark wizard and good wizard. But what movie has all good people in it. NONE!!

Now I'm just talking about the movies. I have not read the books. I'm not much of a Harry Potter fan. But I do like seeing the movies.

Edited July 16, 2007 by Cardinals Flower

[scardella]

Most of this is targetted at whether it's good for kids. Does the same apply to adults?

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='scardella' post='1330695' date='Jul 16 2007, 08:20 AM']Most of this is targeted at whether it's good for kids. Does the same apply to adults?[/quote]

Adults and kids are different. I think HP is less bad for adults than it is for kids.

[Didymus]

Patrick Madrid always noted the fact that LOTR and the Chronicles obviously show a fantasized world which pretty much all of the readers regardless of age know they cannot ever arrive in, whereas the Harry Potter series (which i have not read so correct me if I'm wrong) does not so well distinguish the fantasy in the book with the real world and thus if one is not careful they can begin to mix the two, and that is why many worry about the dangers with children and whatnot because when they don't the difference, together with the false belief that there is a difference between good and bad magic, that can become quite the problem.

[Bonbon]

[quote name='T-Bone _' post='1330698' date='Jul 16 2007, 08:22 AM']Adults and kids are different. I think HP is less bad for adults than it is for kids.[/quote]
Most likely, but HP is attracting more of a younger crowd then older.

[scardella]

[quote name='Cardinals Flower' post='1330730' date='Jul 16 2007, 10:45 AM']Most likely, but HP is attracting more of a younger crowd then older.[/quote]

Well, I know several adults who love to read Harry Potter...

[uruviel]

I don't think it's right to contrast LOTR, CON, and HP in terms of magic. The witch craft and wizardry in HP is different. The magic is REAL in HP. The incantations are real ones that satan worshipers use. That does NOT seem right to me. HP is a lot darker than other fantasies, I don't think kids should get into magic, whether they seem to be effected by it or not. It's certainly not healthy for them. The question is whether it would harm them or not. I believe that you aren't always the one to judge that, even the parent cannot know what will harm his or her child. I don't see it as safe to put your child in that position in the first place, yes they may not care or think about it. But it brings me back to the halloween subject. Kids see it as innocent fun, when it is not.
Children see HP as innocent. But satan is good at perverting innocent things in a very secret way, because the only way to draw children to him is to make it innocent like their minds. Anyways, I'm rambling, the point is that we may not be being careful enough, it is hard to define between innocent fun and evil nowadays because of the way satan works. I would prefer to avoid it all together.

[Bonbon]

[quote name='uruviel' post='1330871' date='Jul 16 2007, 10:51 AM']I don't think it's right to contrast LOTR, CON, and HP in terms of magic. The witch craft and wizardry in HP is different. The magic is REAL in HP. The incantations are real ones that satan worshipers use. That does NOT seem right to me. HP is a lot darker than other fantasies, I don't think kids should get into magic, whether they seem to be effected by it or not. It's certainly not healthy for them. The question is whether it would harm them or not. I believe that you aren't always the one to judge that, even the parent cannot know what will harm his or her child. I don't see it as safe to put your child in that position in the first place, yes they may not care or think about it. But it brings me back to the halloween subject. Kids see it as innocent fun, when it is not.
Children see HP as innocent. But satan is good at perverting innocent things in a very secret way, because the only way to draw children to him is to make it innocent like their minds. Anyways, I'm rambling, the point is that we may not be being careful enough, it is hard to define between innocent fun and evil nowadays because of the way satan works. I would prefer to avoid it all together.[/quote]
You don't like halloween Its a catholic holiday! All Hallows Eve!!
It is innocent fun. Theres nothing satanic about halloween...

[philosophette]

It is in between, depending upon the person's temperament, how impressionable they are, how they internalize what they read and see, and whether or not they can accurately distinguish between fantasy and reality.

[Resurrexi]

I would never let anyone under 13 read Harry Potter, but it is probably alright for a well-catechized Catholic teenager or adult who has no inclinations to witchcraft or satanism to read it (but a former wiccan should probably not read it because it might make them want to become a wiccan again).

Edited July 16, 2007 by StThomasMore

[XIX]

[quote name='Cardinals Flower' post='1330883' date='Jul 16 2007, 12:05 PM']You don't like halloween Its a catholic holiday! All Hallows Eve!!
It is innocent fun. Theres nothing satanic about halloween...[/quote]
It's not innocent if you dress up as Chuck Norris for Halloween.


:

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='StThomasMore' post='1330905' date='Jul 16 2007, 06:48 PM']I would never let anyone under 13 read Harry Potter, but it is probably alright for a well-catechized Catholic teenager or adult who has no inclinations to witchcraft or satanism to read it (but a former wiccan should probably not read it because it might make them want to become a wiccan again).[/quote]

Good point. I mean, there are exceptions (if a slightly younger child has a really firm grasp on things, for example). And I still maintain that, whatever the child reads, the parents should also read the book and discuss it with them. In this way, the parents can help to steer the child towards a proper understanding of it.

[uruviel]

[quote name='Cardinals Flower' post='1330883' date='Jul 16 2007, 01:05 PM']You don't like halloween Its a catholic holiday! All Hallows Eve!!
It is innocent fun. Theres nothing satanic about halloween...[/quote]

I like All Saints Day. I do not like halloween for various reasons, I have been into this before and don't really have the time to explain, but in short...
All Hallows Eve has been perverted into a day for the devil. It is, in a very literal sense, satan's day. Whereas, I know none of y'all treat it like that, it is none the less treated as that by many other people, so on halloween I prefer to pray and not celebrate.

[Didymus]

[quote name='StThomasMore' post='1330905' date='Jul 16 2007, 01:48 PM']I would never let anyone under 13 read Harry Potter, but it is probably alright for a well-catechized Catholic teenager or adult who has no inclinations to witchcraft or satanism to read it (but a former wiccan should probably not read it because it might make them want to become a wiccan again).[/quote]

i actually heard that many wiccans don't actually like the Harry Potter series, because they believe that it is too fantacized

[kateri05]

[quote]The incantations are real ones that satan worshipers use.[/quote]


no they aren't! terra has already addressed this. some are plain made up (riddikulus?), while others are based on alchemy from british history. go read the article she posted.

[carrdero]

The poll neglects another probable choice:
Unoriginal

[uruviel]

[quote name='kateri05' post='1331142' date='Jul 16 2007, 05:32 PM'] no they aren't! terra has already addressed this. some are plain made up (riddikulus?), while others are based on alchemy from british history. go read the article she posted.[/quote]

Thanks.


I haven't heard that before. What I did hear was that the exorcist at rome claimed that she used real incantations.