Ok, Another 'what If'...

[Budge]

[quote]Popes are infallible until they are proven wrong, then it wasn't an infallible statement.[/quote]

Yeah because a system that has people so easily able to paint themselves into a corner has to have OUTS!

[chelsea]

I just want to make it clear that I DO believe in purgatory and saints and the infallibility of the Pope. I dont have time to explain my statements right now, but another example is that we dont have to believe in visions or miracles. if we dont believe in miracles, how can we believe in the saints, because they only get canonized BECAUSE of miracles. and without visions, how can we believe in the Sacred Heart, or the Divine Mercy, or anything of that nature?
see what i'm saying?

(i do believe in miracles and visions and the whole shebang!)

[goldenchild17]

[quote name='chelsea' post='1358104' date='Aug 13 2007, 11:06 AM']I just want to make it clear that I DO believe in purgatory and saints and the infallibility of the Pope. I dont have time to explain my statements right now, but another example is that we dont have to believe in visions or miracles. if we dont believe in miracles, how can we believe in the saints, because they only get canonized BECAUSE of miracles. and without visions, how can we believe in the Sacred Heart, or the Divine Mercy, or anything of that nature?
see what i'm saying?

(i do believe in miracles and visions and the whole shebang!)[/quote]

That's fine and I do see what you're saying. And I would agree that visions and things of that nature are not under the realm of infallibility. Which is why the magisterium only ever tells us that such and such a thing is worthy of belief, not that we have to believe it. And I would probably also agree that we don't need to believe in certain miracles. But I would certainly disagree if you are saying that we don't have to believe that miracles happen at all. A miracle happens every day at Mass, and we certainly have to believe that one to be Catholic. I think we do have to believe miracles exist. Devotions such as the Sacred Heart and the Divine Mercy are private devotions, and as such are not infallible, and have never been declared so by any pope. As a matter of fact, I personally do not follow the Divine Mercy devotion and disagree with a number of aspects of it, at least in the newer version. But I would hope one could see the difference between these non-infallible things and all the other things that the Church has declared as necessary for belief.

Edited August 13, 2007 by goldenchild17

[Thy Geekdom Come]

Pope Chuck would be correct because we should highly doubt the veracity of any statement by a French pope.

jk

[goldenchild17]

God would never allow a chump in tights to be pope...