Secular Authority

[hyperdulia again]

I'm interested in hearing your thoughts on the parameters of secular authority. To me this is the most frightening statement imaginable: Who says the state does not have authority over your diet?

It smacks of tolalitarianism and of a deep enmity towards freedom.

[Autumn Dusk]

I think it depends on the control of the food system. If there is a government says that they are setting up an organization for the control of safe food then the common person can go to any store and buy food they know someone's watched over. It dosn't work 100% of the time, but in general its much safer than chaos.

If you personally want to take a risk with food, raw milk, alcohol, tobacco, certain chemical fats, then go right ahead. However, don't expect the government to pay for one cent of your medical care or even go public transit to seek that care.

You only have rights to do with your body what you want when you can %100 care for it without government help. If you can't do that tough. You're just like a kid who can't eat candy, its part of what you give up for having someone to wipe your bum.

[PapaHilarious]

[quote name='hyperdulia again' post='1403418' date='Oct 15 2007, 10:12 PM']I'm interested in hearing your thoughts on the parameters of secular authority. To me this is the most frightening statement imaginable: Who says the state does not have authority over your diet?

It smacks of tolalitarianism and of a deep enmity towards freedom.[/quote]

It's called the FDA. They regulate what we are allowed to sell and eat.

[hyperdulia again]

Yes the FDA does exist Papa!

[hyperdulia again]

Whether or not it should is my question.

[PapaHilarious]

[quote name='hyperdulia again' post='1403418' date='Oct 15 2007, 10:12 PM']It smacks of tolalitarianism and of a deep enmity towards freedom.[/quote]

Real classy, calling me names because I used the FDA as an example of government authority.

[hyperdulia again]

honestly had i known the FDA was what you were talking about I wouldn't have said it. i'm the grandchild of a jewish-catholic refugee from nazism. my mind went immediately to totalitarianism.

[PapaHilarious]

[quote name='hyperdulia again' post='1403443' date='Oct 15 2007, 10:34 PM']honestly had i known the FDA was what you were talking about I wouldn't have said it. i'm the grandchild of a jewish-catholic refugee from nazism. my mind went immediately to totalitarianism.[/quote]


okay. thanks for the explanation. just a little confusion then. no worries.

[Autumn Dusk]

I believe there should be an authority. We know what's in our food, we are bound by law to get food that is not expired, in correct packaging, and more or less safe.

No authority, no safe foods in the long run. Ther'd probably be a few notable "safe" companies to eat from, but after that nothing. However, even "safe" companies don't always produce "safe" food. Anyone remember beechnut? In the 1980's they sold colored water as baby apple juice, until they were caught and prosecuted. I think alot more of that would go on if there wasn't an FDA.

On the other hand who's to say FDA knows anything. The've turned the food pyramid into a food obliesk. They change their minds about eggs every week and there's more "scientific opinions" on chocolate than there are on latin mass.

FDA is good for the masses. FDA is good to protect children from being fed dangerous food because its cheap. However, if as a knowledgeable citizen you want to go out and buy a food go right ahead, but that piece of food dosn't come with the same rights to health as the one at the grocer that the FDA approves.

[hyperdulia again]

Autumn I'm actually talking about something larger than the FDA--the powers that the government exercises in general, over where we can school our children, who we can "marry," etc.

[hyperdulia again]

Your posts are very thoughtful and not all mean spirited Autumn.

[photosynthesis]

I think that the government should do everything within its power to prevent people from popping their collars up.

[PapaHilarious]

[quote name='photosynthesis' post='1403453' date='Oct 15 2007, 10:48 PM']I think that the government should do everything within its power to prevent people from popping their collars up.[/quote]

are the collars in question edible?

[Autumn Dusk]

[quote name='hyperdulia again' post='1403452' date='Oct 16 2007, 01:47 AM']Your posts are very thoughtful and not all mean spirited Autumn. [/quote]


I can fix that if you want

[dairygirl4u2c]

wait where are the hardcore republican conservative christians. to outlaw fatty foods, or at least people from eating unhealthy generally. hardcore republicans, not true libertarians, outlaw anything sinful, after all.

i could see liberals outlawing fatty foods too. depends on how you look at it i guess. but from hardcore con point of view, they'd ban it cause it's sinful.

[photosynthesis]

[quote name='PapaHilarious' post='1403454' date='Oct 16 2007, 01:49 AM']are the collars in question edible?[/quote]
no. Like if you buy a polo shirt and instead of having the collar edges down, you roll them up so that they cover your neck.

[CatholicCid]

[quote name='photosynthesis' post='1403584' date='Oct 16 2007, 11:21 AM']no. Like if you buy a polo shirt and instead of having the collar edges down, you roll them up so that they cover your neck.[/quote]

What, then, shall protect my neck?

[rkwright]

I think you're looking at it backwards. The government only has power which we the people give it. We have given the power to regulate food to the government (through congress). Most American's I think have it mixed up; the constitution does not start with the government's powers, but rather with the people's rights. We submit some of those rights to the government, and thats where it gets its power.

Secondly, we're not giving them power to regulate our food, but rather protect our food. I'm pretty sure the FDA comes out a time when food was not held to the highest standards, and the only group that could provide safe food for everyone and enforcement against the large producers is the government.

If the government wasn't able to regulate food, the only way to ensure our own safety would be to grow our own food.

[Socrates]

[quote name='hyperdulia again' post='1403451' date='Oct 15 2007, 11:46 PM']Autumn I'm actually talking about something larger than the FDA--the powers that the government exercises in general, over where we can school our children, who we can "marry," etc.[/quote]
The government controls who we can marry??

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' post='1403567' date='Oct 16 2007, 10:43 AM']wait where are the hardcore republican conservative christians. to outlaw fatty foods, or at least people from eating unhealthy generally. hardcore republicans, not true libertarians, outlaw anything sinful, after all.

i could see liberals outlawing fatty foods too. depends on how you look at it i guess. but from hardcore con point of view, they'd ban it cause it's sinful.[/quote]
Most Christians (hardcore conservative or otherwise) would not regard eating fatty foods as sinful (unless done in gluttonous excess maybe).

And Dairy, I'd challenge you to name five Republican politicians who are actually for banning "anything sinful." Heck, it's hard enough to find a Republican (or Dem for that matter) who's really for banning [i]anything[/i] sinful (even abortion)!

Dairy, your view of Republicans and conservatives is out of a comic book, and has little relation to reality.

[hyperdulia again]

It attempts to control who you can marry (it makes decisions about what marriages it will recognize).
It forbids you your first cousin (in about half of the country) even with a dispensation.
The Church has of late even encouraged this interference (gay marriage opposition--the Catholic position always struck me as "it's inconsequential what the state recognizes it can marry no one").