Pedophile Priests Or Tridentiners

[mark4IHM]

If we look at the reactions of the American bishops to each group,

the answer seems clear.

For decades American bishops have had a policy of sheltering homosexual

priests who sodomize and rape Catholic children, mostly boys. The bad priests were not suspended, but were shuttled from diocese to diocese, where often they found new victims. The other part of the Bishop's protection policy has been to

legally stonewall attempts at justice by the victims of predatory priests.

It is estimated that up to two-thirds of the American Bishops have acted

criminally by protecting pedophile priests (National Review Online), taking

pains to keep them "priests "in good standing," and only suspending child

abusing priests when their crimes become public. The bishop of

Arlington, Virginia, even suspended an orthodox priest, Father James Haley,

for exposing pedophile priests.

Another bishop, in Dallas, also followed the policy of sheltering pedophile

priests. Yet when one of his diocesan priests, Father Steve Zigrang, began

celebrating the "old" Mass instead of the Novus Ordo Mass, the bishop

immediately suspended him and removed Zigrang from his parish (Dallas

Morning News).

This is another policy of the American episcopate, namely, to limit as much

as possible any expression of traditional Catholicism, particularly the

"old" Mass. Consequently, when the Fraternity of St. Peter arrived at the

Basilica of the Immaculate Conception

to celebrate the "old" Mass (a scheduled visit), they were refused

permission, disappointing hundreds of Catholics who had traveled across the

country for the event (The Wanderer).

One can conclude from this that American bishops seem more alarmed about

traditional Catholics ("Tridentiners") expressing their faith than

pedophile priests expressing their perversions.

Are the bishops right?

[hyperdulia again]

no they aren't mark. i'd trust my kid with a trad, before i would with a ped.

[cmotherofpirl]

THis is not even worth replying to.

[jasJis]

Two different things. Two different reactions. How sick can you be to equate the two?

That is sick, and I'm quite offended you posted that there.

Calumny!

[Guest SemJoe]

In my understanding of all of topic of pedophile priests, each case is individual and each case is important. The way we did things in the past is good to look at, but not to dwell on. It seems clear that the church has taken the right steps to fixing the problem and protecting children from this problem. Of course, there is a greater problem out there than pedophile priests, namely, pedophilia in general is something that is a great problem. It is not just happening in rectories, it happens in every walk of life. If is understand it correctly, this problem happens more often in the very homes the children live in my their very own fathers.

As regards to the Tridentine mass, it doesn't relate my friend, it is a different issue. The priest who was kicked out for saying the mass was probably kicked out of his parish for other reasons than just saying the mass. I would look into all the details of that action before making a generalized statement about the decision of the bishop there.

Mary, queen of the rosary...pray for us

JoeSem

[Don John of Austria]

There is nothing Wrong with the Tridientine Mass, the Church does not say there is anything Wrong with it, there is something wrong with defying the Magisterium on matters of the mass.

[Good Friday]

St. Michael, the Archangel, defend us in battle. Be our safeguard against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray; and do you, O Prince of the heavenly host, by the power of God cast into hell Satan and all the evil spirits who wander through the world seeking the ruin of souls. Amen.

Edited August 4, 2003 by Good Friday

[VanHooty]

Taken from http://www.dickalba.demon.co.uk/usenet/gui...e/faq_trol.html:

5. What is a Troll?

On Usenet, a Troll is someone who posts messages in newsgroups with the deliberate intent of provoking flames or heated discussion or, in the case of a destructive troll, an attempt to destroy the group.

As such, I smell a troll. :D

[jasJis]

No Troll. Mark4IHM's been here awhile. <_<

[VanHooty]

He's posted 23 posts in the span of about a month. I've managed to post more in the span of a few days. <insert bragging here>

Now, as a Usenet junky, staying for a month sounds like a rather persistent, stubborn, or foolish troll to me. I could be mistaken though.

[Winchester]

Pedophiles should get life. Real life, that is, until they are totally (not mostly) dead.

That is, if parents don't get to them first.

And we should send the Marines in to do target practice on NAMBLA members (in all countries)

[Donna]

If my memory is correct Mark was also at the old phorum.

[hyperdulia again]

I'd like to say that it's a shame that the "Old Mass" isn't acceptable everywhere.

[Donna]

Re-read the first post. Is it true, or is it not?

That the Bishops do move fast to squelch the expressions of "Tridentine" faith but not to remove the flock-abusing wolves?

Does anyone here read the Dicese Report or the Wanderer? Do people know about Roman Catholic Faithful? Or Michael Rose' book?

Bad fruit.

Read the depositions. C. Law, and poor Father Haley's, et al. Go to RCF's website for Father Haley's. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks of RCF: they have the documentation. If not for them, Bishop Ryan in Ililinois and others would not have been exposed.

Ask the Dallas people about Blessed Sacrament parish, where the Bishop is trying to kick out the beloved pastor... the one who took a sinking parish, made it thrive and uses the Novus Ordo Latin -supposedly not suspect and allowed. The people there are crying to not be starved, 'cause there are like two parishes in the whole place Catholic enough where people discern they won't lose the faith.

We're in big trouble that God would place such men to be over us. But we're in the worst trouble of all if we layity deny the stinking, rotten fruit.

Edited August 5, 2003 by Donna

[cmotherofpirl]

THe Wanderer is way far off the deep end of the map. The Diocese Report is fast heading in the same direction. THey lack any sense of balance.

Disobedience on all fronts is a sin whethers its a trad or liberal or pedophile (which most of these priests were not).

[cmotherofpirl]

No Troll.  Mark4IHM's been here awhile.

If the shoe fits.....

[Good Friday]

Say it with me now: May the unity of Christ be with us all.

Mark and Donna -- It is totally inappropriate to question the Bishops' decision to allow the Tridentine Mass, as ultimately that decision is theirs and theirs alone. No "universal indult" has been granted to the entire Church to celebrate the Tridentine Mass; since one has not been granted, it is up to the Diocesan Bishop to decide whether or not the Tridentine Mass will be celebrated or not. If the Bishop decides yes, that's his right. If the Bishop decides no, that's his right.

I agree that some of the Bishops were very wrong for defending priests who were involved in violation of their priestly celibacy by committing the acts of a pedophile and/or sleeping with young men (which is not pedophilia). But that was not all Bishops, nor is it your place to correct them. They will be corrected civilly by the court of law and they will be corrected in the Church by the Holy Father, not a couple of laypeople who think they know what's best.

Besides, it doesn't seem from your post that you are truly interested in the scandal, but on capitalizing on the scandal -- just like Voice of the Faithful, a pro-abortion "Catholic" group that has capitalized on the scandal to advance their agenda, i.e. discrediting the Bishops so that their agenda doesn't look so bad. What you and Mark have done here is no different just because you happen to be traditionalists rather than liberals.

To everyone else -- I don't think it was appropriate to call Mark a troll, and I don't think we need to resort to personal insults to get our points across.

[VanHooty]

To everyone else -- I don't think it was appropriate to call Mark a troll, and I don't think we need to resort to personal insults to get our points across.

Quite honestly, I come from a Usenet background. Usenet, from what I've gathered, seems to be very different then this here webforum. It's as close to anarchy as you can get, and the occasional flame doesn't seem to bother anyone. Including the person being flamed.

So, if I've broached some sort of rule of web phorum nettiquete, I hearily apologize. We Usenetters are known for our bluntness. :)

[Good Friday]

It's no big deal, VanHooty. Having been at PM for a while now, I've noticed that small things like this can often develop into quite large things, so I'm just trying to keep the peace. I told dUSt I would keep y'all in line while he's gone.

If you had been here during my time with "the dark side," you would know how very funny the idea of me keeping y'all in line is... I've done far worse than call people trolls. But having been involved in almost every argument in the past few months, I know what can potentially cause them, and calling people trolls here can definitely do it. We try not to disrupt Phatmass too much since it could reflect badly on dUSt's website and on the Hip-Hop Compilation Project... if people come here and see us all bickering and being nasty, they're gonna think: "Why do I wanna have anything to do with this website?" That is, of course, what Satan wants. He'd love for us all to bicker each other and Phatmass into a complete lack of credibility and Catholicity.

That's why he throws in a few arguments every once in a while. There seems to be at least one argument going on here fairly consistently. I was just trying to avoid one more.

[littleflower+JMJ]

oh fearless leader, you have done a remarkable job!!!

love ya speech!!!

:D

ps. and vanhooty, its otay! your still a newbie (well not for long with how much your posting! ) its all good!