Gas Station Employee Fired For Fighting Off Robber

[Alycin]

[quote name='kujo' post='1534929' date='May 20 2008, 04:00 PM']Running into burning buildings would "statistically" get you burned to death.
Stopping a mugger from acosting an elderly woman would "statistically" get you beat up.
Running out into the street to save a child who has fallen off his bike would "statistically" get you run over.

Doesn't mean that they aren't the right thing to do.[/quote]

[Autumn Dusk]

[quote name='kujo' post='1534929' date='May 20 2008, 05:00 PM']Running into burning buildings would "statistically" get you burned to death.
Stopping a mugger from acosting an elderly woman would "statistically" get you beat up.
Running out into the street to save a child who has fallen off his bike would "statistically" get you run over.

Doesn't mean that they aren't the right thing to do.[/quote]


However, when acting as the agent of an industry you are informed of what to do. The convince store I worked at (in my state) had a mandatory training class. We were repeatedly told to NOT act violently towards the perp. while working as an employee for their company. It was part of the job that I accepted, and had I acted violently and a perp killed my co-worker i'd be liable for their death. Of course, one can always take the chance and end up on the good end...but its just like selling alcohol...better to refuse then to sell someone under 21 you may think has fake or inaccurate ID and have multiple felony charges.

[kujo]

[quote name='Autumn Dusk' post='1534970' date='May 20 2008, 05:29 PM']However, when acting as the agent of an industry you are informed of what to do. The convince store I worked at (in my state) had a mandatory training class. We were repeatedly told to NOT act violently towards the perp. while working as an employee for their company. It was part of the job that I accepted, and had I acted violently and a perp killed my co-worker i'd be liable for their death. Of course, one can always take the chance and end up on the good end...but its just like selling alcohol...better to refuse then to sell someone under 21 you may think has fake or inaccurate ID and have multiple felony charges.[/quote]

I don't care what my company says...if a woman is getting attacked in my store, I'm kickin' some a**!

[Alycin]

[quote name='Autumn Dusk' post='1534970' date='May 20 2008, 04:29 PM']However, when acting as the agent of an industry you are informed of what to do. The convince store I worked at (in my state) had a mandatory training class. We were repeatedly told to NOT act violently towards the perp. while working as an employee for their company. It was part of the job that I accepted, and had I acted violently and a perp killed my co-worker i'd be liable for their death. Of course, one can always take the chance and end up on the good end...but its just like selling alcohol...better to refuse then to sell someone under 21 you may think has fake or inaccurate ID and have multiple felony charges.[/quote]


Sooo... better to not take a chance of having your own ass in trouble?

Sorry, but I'll take a man that will break policy in order to try to save me over a stickler for rules anyday.

[Laudate_Dominum]

When I was a kid I saw a really bad car accident and people were basically dying so I ran to a gas station that was about 30 meters away and the person said they couldn't call 911 because of company policy. They wouldn't let me call 911 on their phone either because of "company policy." I didn't have any change to use the payphone and of course these twits weren't exactly eager to loan me a quarter. Company policy or not, they should be ashamed of themselves. Basic moral responsibility and humanity trumps some goofy company policy.

[Alycin]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1534985' date='May 20 2008, 04:39 PM']When I was a kid I saw a really bad car accident and people were basically dying so I ran to a gas station that was about 30 meters away and the person said they couldn't call 911 because of company policy. They wouldn't let me call 911 on their phone either because of "company policy." I didn't have any change to use the payphone and of course these twits weren't exactly eager to loan me a quarter. Company policy or not, they should be ashamed of themselves. Basic moral responsibility and humanity trumps some goofy company policy.[/quote]

[Autumn Dusk]

[quote name='Alycin' post='1534977' date='May 20 2008, 05:33 PM']Sooo... better to not take a chance of having your own ass in trouble?

Sorry, but I'll take a man that will break policy in order to try to save me over a stickler for rules anyday.[/quote]


To me he knew the rules and he broke them. Its as simple as that. He's lucky he wasn't arrested. And he's incredibly lucky no one got killed.

[kujo]

This person is a hero. Plain and simple. Whether or not the stupid gas station recognizes it, he did the right thing. He should be proud.

[kujo]

[quote name='Autumn Dusk' post='1534988' date='May 20 2008, 05:41 PM']To me he knew the rules and he broke them. Its as simple as that. He's lucky he wasn't arrested. And he's incredibly lucky no one got killed.[/quote]

ARRESTED?!?!?!?!??!?!

[Laudate_Dominum]

Ah yes, I remember more of that incident.. The payphone at that gas station didn't even work (this was before cell phones) and they still wouldn't let me use their phone.. As I recall I had to run around and find a different payphone and it was very far away.. Those 10 or 15 minutes could have cost people their lives.. and for what?

[Laudate_Dominum]

Yes, he knew the "rules" and broke them which is just brownie points from my perspective. Some people would sit back and do nothing in the face of evil and then pat themselves on the back for being such a good person.

[kujo]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1535000' date='May 20 2008, 05:47 PM']Yes, he knew the "rules" and broke them which is just brownie points from my perspective. Some people would sit back and do nothing in the face of evil and then pat themselves on the back for being such a good person.[/quote]

Research done by Stanley Milgram and Phillip Zimbardo suggests that 6 out of 10 people would actually walk away from a situation like this.

[Autumn Dusk]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1535000' date='May 20 2008, 05:47 PM']Yes, he knew the "rules" and broke them which is just brownie points from my perspective. Some people would sit back and do nothing in the face of evil and then pat themselves on the back for being such a good person.[/quote]

These are not dumb or arbitray rules, which you're acting like they are. We know putting a 1960's hair drier into a tub will likely get someone electrocuted. Not always but sometimes.

This guy may of acted heroically but he did so against the rules. I have no problem with him being fired. He dosn't make a good convience store worker.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Autumn Dusk' post='1535004' date='May 20 2008, 03:50 PM']These are not dumb or arbitray rules, which you're acting like they are. We know putting a 1960's hair drier into a tub will likely get someone electrocuted. Not always but sometimes.

This guy may of acted heroically but he did so against the rules. I have no problem with him being fired. He dosn't make a good convience store worker.[/quote]
Yes, of course these rules generally exist to protect corporate interests and are often reducible to statistics that represent dollar signs. Where we differ is in absolutizing such silly rules. We could put it another way then. If I worked at a gas station and knew that the company policy prohibited me from calling 911 unless the incident (accident or whatever) happened on company grounds and yet there was a brutal accident less than 30 yards away and I could see that people were dead or dying before my eyes what would I do?
The fact that a person would even pause to consider the company policy disturbs me slightly. I can sit by and watch people die or help them and possibly lose my job unjustly.. Hmm.. Tough decision. *sarcasm*

[kujo]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1535015' date='May 20 2008, 05:57 PM']Yes, of course these rules generally exist to protect corporate interests and are often reducible to statistics that represent dollar signs. Where we differ is in absolutizing such silly rules. We could put it another way then. If I worked at a gas station and knew that the company policy prohibited me from calling 911 unless the incident (accident or whatever) happened on company grounds and yet there was a brutal accident less than 200 yards away and I could see that people were dead or dying before my eyes what would I do?
The fact that a person would even pause to consider the company policy disturbs me slightly. I can sit by and watch people die or help them and possibly lose my job unjustly.. Hmm.. Tough decision. *sarcasm*[/quote]

If I were this guy, I'd throw together an awesome resume, put this whole event under "special skills" and apply at whatever the local competitor for his old store was. Probably give the new store a boost in sales for awhile!

[StColette]

This makes me wonder about how many Saints "broke" the rules so to speak when faced with injustice, someone possibly dying, etc.

new research project for moi lol

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Autumn Dusk' post='1535004' date='May 20 2008, 03:50 PM']These are not dumb or arbitray rules, which you're acting like they are. We know putting a 1960's hair drier into a tub will likely get someone electrocuted. Not always but sometimes.

This guy may of acted heroically but he did so against the rules. I have no problem with him being fired. He dosn't make a good convience store worker.[/quote]
Perhaps the ideal convenience store worker would be a robot. You're putting company rules above moral obligation in my opinion. Rules of this sort cannot be more than guidelines since the possibilities of concrete situations, and the complexities of morality go beyond their scope. The mentality you are proposing is that of the ideal citizen in an Orwellian society.

[kujo]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1535026' date='May 20 2008, 06:07 PM']Perhaps the ideal convenience store worker would be a robot. You're putting company rules above moral obligation in my opinion. Rules of this sort cannot be more than guidelines since the possibilities of concrete situations, and the complexities of morality go beyond their scope. The mentality you are proposing is that of the ideal citizen in an Orwellian society.[/quote]

Actually, a robot at a convenience store might provide better service than some of the yahoos I've been helped by. I mean, come on...how hard is it to ring up my slushie, Snickers bar and Newsweek magazine?

[CatherineM]

I suspect he won't have any trouble getting another job.

[Madame Vengier]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1535026' date='May 20 2008, 04:07 PM']Perhaps the ideal convenience store worker would be a robot. You're putting company rules above moral obligation in my opinion.[/quote]

And you're not paying attention. The woman was NOT BEING ATTACKED. Period. By tossling with the robber, that employee could have caused loss of life.

Edited May 20, 2008 by Madame Vengier