Will Ratzinger Apologize?

[Guest MartinLuther21]

The parents of two young girls repeatedly raped by a Melbourne Catholic priest are flying to Sydney from London to face Cardinal George Pell in time for Sunday's Final Mass part of World Youth Day celebrations.

Anthony Foster, whose daughters were raped by Father Kevin O'Donnell as primary school girls, alleges that Cardinal Pell stalled the family's compensation claim against the church when he was archbishop of Melbourne.

Mr Foster told Lateline that last week's revelations that Cardinal Pell had allegedly obstructed a sex offences case against another priest had sparked him into action. He said he hoped he could others with sexual abuse claims against the church and change the church's attitudes to compensating victims.

"I want them to set up a system that provides a lifetime help to victims, that begs forgiveness to victims," Mr Foster said.

He said an apology by Pope Benedict to victims of sexual abuse in the church would not be satisfactory unless it was backed up by change.

"An apology is not enough unless it is backed up with action, unless he removes all obstacles to continuing support for victims," Mr Foster said. "They should come to us and beg for forgiveness."

Mr Foster's daughters, Emma and Katherine, were raped over five years by Father O'Donnell at Sacred Heart Primary School in Oakleigh between 1988 and 1993. Earlier this year, Emma committed suicide after a long battle with drug addiction, which Mr Foster attributed directly to her rape.

Katherine, who began drinking heavily, was hit by a drunk driver in 1999, and was left physically and mentally disabled and requiring 24-hour care.

In 1996 Father O'Donnell was convicted of abusing 11 boys and one girl, aged eight to 14, between 1946 and 1977, and sentenced to 15 months in prison. He died after his release in 1997.

Initially offered a $50,000 sum by Cardinal Pell under his "Towards Healing" compensation program, the Fosters pursued their case through the legal system for eight years, winning a six-figure settlement with the church in one of the largest of its kind in the country.

[Didymus]

what's to debate here? I think everyone would agree that this is a horrible reality that must be remedied in the Church...

[Winchester]

It will never be remedied. Predators will always seek out positions like this. The only thing you can do is try to weed them and those who would protect them because of their own problems out of the seminaries.

As society, so the Church, and society can't keep predators out of their own positions of power, nor do they do much to them once they're caught.

[CatherineM]

What a sad story. It shows that not all priests who were molesters went after boys, and it also shows how an abuse can destroy a life.

I'm not sure exactly what they want from the Pope. All he can do is apologize, which has been done repeatedly, and pledge to try to prevent it from happening again. All he can do from his position is take steps to set up safeties, and promise swift action. He can't wave a magic wand and make it all go away, or go back in a time machine to change what happened decades ago. He can throw money at it, but I'm pretty sure that is happening in most of these cases already.

[Winchester]

They're pissed. They want some sense of justice, like everyone else. It's an emotional thing. I myself am completely unreasonable when it comes to this stuff. Take a look at my comments in threads regarding sexual predators of any sort. In these cases, I generally want vengeance and if I were given my druthers, my side job would be eliminating these scumbags.

[StColette]

I do not believe this topic should be up for debate. It can only lead to emotions becoming flared. Our Holy Father will do what he sees is proper and acceptable. He has proven in the past to be ready to meet and speak with people that are involved in these cases.

I would request that one of the mods close this for debate.

[Didymus]

[quote name='Winchester' post='1602685' date='Jul 18 2008, 11:50 AM']It will never be remedied. Predators will always seek out positions like this. The only thing you can do is try to weed them and those who would protect them because of their own problems out of the seminaries.[/quote]

Why bother trying 'to weed them out' if the problem cannot be remedied?? I'm not saying it will ever be perfect, but there are remedies to the problem.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='Didymus' post='1602709' date='Jul 18 2008, 10:25 AM']Why bother trying 'to weed them out' if the problem cannot be remedied?? I'm not saying it will ever be perfect, but there are remedies to the problem.[/quote]
+J.M.J.+
i took it to mean that those in authority should do their best to try to screen out all potential problem priests or persons in ministry, but that you will never catch every single one.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='StColette' post='1602707' date='Jul 18 2008, 01:23 PM']I do not believe this topic should be up for debate. It can only lead to emotions becoming flared. Our Holy Father will do what he sees is proper and acceptable. He has proven in the past to be ready to meet and speak with people that are involved in these cases.

I would request that one of the mods close this for debate.[/quote]
Sorry but this debate board and its front page news, and the issue will not go away soon, so I for one won't close it.
The question seems to me to be is" how much reparation is enough"? Does money cover emotional pain?

[Lil Red]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1602764' date='Jul 18 2008, 11:24 AM']Sorry but this debate board and its front page news, and the issue will not go away soon, so I for one won't close it.
The question seems to me to be is" how much reparation is enough"? Does money cover emotional pain?[/quote]
+J.M.J.+
and a question as well is 'are bishops/archbishops/cardinals/directors of seminaries doing enough to screen out predators from ministry?'

[StColette]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1602764' date='Jul 18 2008, 01:24 PM']Sorry but this debate board and its front page news, and the issue will not go away soon, so I for one won't close it.
The question seems to me to be is" how much reparation is enough"? Does money cover emotional pain?[/quote]

I understand this to be the debate board and I'm not trying to say that we should ignore the issue, but the person who started the thread did not make it clear what is to be debated here. A person cannot debate over the fact if someone will apologize or not, there's no substance for an argument for debate. Either Pope Benedict will apologize or he will not, that's his personal option to do either or. There's no need to debate over an apology because it is out of our hands.

Now if the person who started the debate asked "how much reparation is enough?" or "Does money cover emotional pain?" that would be different. But the focus of this person's post seems to be if Pope Benedict will apologize or not, which I don't believe is something to be debated, the Holy Father will do as he sees fit.

I also think the possibility of criticism of the Holy Father could accompany such a thread as this, I was saying to close it as a precaution to keep that from happening, not to ignore the problem at hand.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='StColette' post='1602773' date='Jul 18 2008, 11:32 AM']I also think the possibility of criticism of the Holy Father could accompany such a thread as this, I was saying to close it as a precaution to keep that from happening, not to ignore the problem at hand.[/quote]
+J.M.J.+
dUSt has instructed us to use a 'hands-off' approach to moderating - which means not pre-emptively closing a thread just because it 'may' go bad.

[StColette]

[quote name='Lil Red' post='1602849' date='Jul 18 2008, 04:06 PM']+J.M.J.+
dUSt has instructed us to use a 'hands-off' approach to moderating - which means not pre-emptively closing a thread just because it 'may' go bad. [/quote]

Very well.

[Apotheoun]

Only an apoology made by those directly involved in the situation can have any substantive meaning.

[cmotherofpirl]

Yes! An apology is not really meaningful unless you are the one who gave offense.

[Farsight one]

I don't think the question is so much "will he apologize" as it is "will his apology have any effect".

When the abuse cases in the U.S first popped up, people all over the place demanded an apology from the pope. Then he gave one and then everyone kept on complaining and demanding - this time for him to take action. Now that he has, people STILL complain and demand. They'll only be satisfied if someone manages to turn back time and undo what happened.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1602909' date='Jul 18 2008, 07:41 PM']I don't think the question is so much "will he apologize" as it is "will his apology have any effect".

When the abuse cases in the U.S first popped up, people all over the place demanded an apology from the pope. Then he gave one and then everyone kept on complaining and demanding - this time for him to take action. Now that he has, people STILL complain and demand. They'll only be satisfied if someone manages to turn back time and undo what happened.[/quote]
Exactly. An apology cannot turn back the clock.

[cappie]

Pope says sorry for church sex abuse

POPE Benedict XVI has apologised to people sexually abused by members of the clergy in Australia.
He raised the issue during a ceremony to consecrate the altar of St Mary's Cathedral in Sydney, where the Pope has been participating in World Youth Day (WYD) activities.

"Here I would like to pause to acknowledge the shame which we have all felt as a result of the sexual abuse of minors by some clergy and religious in this country,'' Pope Benedict said in his homily.

"Indeed I am deeply sorry for the pain and suffering the victims have endured and I assure them that, as their pastor, I too share in their suffering.

"These misdeeds, which constitute so grave a betrayal of trust, deserve unequivocal condemnation.

"They have caused great pain, they have damaged the church's witness.''

He called on his audience of 3,400 people, including Sydney Archbishop Cardinal George Pell, bishops, seminarians, and religious and school groups, to work together in ``combatting this evil''.
"Victims should receive compassion and care, and those responsible for these evils must be brought to justice,'' he said.

"It is an urgent priority to promote a safer and more wholesome environment, especially for young people.

"In these days marked by the celebration of World Youth Day, we are reminded of how precious a treasure has been entrusted to us in our young people, and how great a part of the church's mission in this country has been dedicated to their education and care.

"As the church in Australia continues, in the spirit of the gospel, to address effectively this serious pastoral challenge, I join you in praying that this time of purification will bring about healing, reconciliation and ever-greater fidelity to the moral demands of the gospel.''

[Guest MartinLuther21]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1602879' date='Jul 18 2008, 04:46 PM']Yes! An apology is not really meaningful unless you are the one who gave offense.[/quote]
Who was the Head of the Confraternity for the Doctrine of the Faith who set up the protocols for how bishops/archbishops/cardinals handled these cases?

Well I just heard a radio news report that there was an apology at a mass in sydney a few hours ago. So we finally have an apology from a pope for what has happened in Australia. I dont know however if he has acknowledged his own contribution (or the contribution of the bishops) to the problem.

How much compensation is enough? is $AUD50000 ($USD35000 at the time) with non-disclosure conditions enough? Should they have had to spend eight years in court fighting the most expensive, obstructive and time-delaying firm of corporate lawyers in the nation to get reasonable compensation? Pell was quite happy to pay the lawyers more than the victims, and is yet to give a meaningful apology.

Edited July 19, 2008 by MartinLuther21

[let_go_let_God]

But the father of the girls wants them to beg for their forgiveness. It sounds like an apology won't simply be enough for them or for many others.

God bless-
LGLG