Russia Is Not At Peace

[dominicansoul]

We really can't determine if Russia is converted or not. How can we judge Russian's souls? But I do believe Our Lady was referencing the fall of Communism. The Church did consecrate Russia to Our Lady's Immaculate Heart, but the Pope and Bishops in communion with him hesitated to do it. It came decades after Our Lady's requesting of it... why? I guess it has a lot to do with the Church's stance on "private revelations." Can the Pope insists when the Church states that one does not have to take any of this and believe in it? I have a real problem with that...because this came from Our Lady herself, and you would think it would have some priority in the Church...*sigh* But even Our Lady knows the Church's standing on private revelations! So, I know she knew it wouldn't come at her insistence...I think the Church should have done exactly as She asked. It's not like she was asking for the impossible. But to answer your question for the topic at hand. Yes, I do believe Russia converted in that Communism fell. It's rising again...so the "period of peace" is coming to an end...OR it could be exactly as Kafka described....something will happen in the future in regards to the messages of Fatima.

Edited August 20, 2008 by dominicansoul

[Ziggamafu]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the peace of Russia contingent upon the world's faithfulness and penance? I mean, consecration or no consecration, I believe Our Lady of Fatima (like all other apparitions) promises more chastisements as a consequence of sin.

[dominicansoul]

[quote name='Ziggamafu' post='1632826' date='Aug 20 2008, 02:04 PM']Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the peace of Russia contingent upon the world's faithfulness and penance? I mean, consecration or no consecration, I believe Our Lady of Fatima (like all other apparitions) promises more chastisements as a consequence of sin.[/quote]


iawtc

[Aloysius]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1632563' date='Aug 20 2008, 11:44 AM']Repeat: Get back on topic, instead of trying to perpetuate the argument you already provoked in the first place.[/quote]
lol I was waaay back on topic by the time you told me to get back on topic (I made two long posts about the subject and then you told me to add something to the conversation) LMAO... I provoked no argument... does anyone here think I provoked an argument?

again, I simply cannot accept that the Immaculate Heart will triumph because of tenuous capitalism in Russia. it was clearly the intention of the message to refer to religious conversion, and that has not happened yet... but we do not know how long it will take for the events to be fulfilled after the consecration... it's not a magic spell.

[Madame Vengier]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1632897' date='Aug 20 2008, 04:30 PM']lol I was waaay[/quote]


Repeat: Get back on topic instead of continuing to stoke an argument that you already provoked--repeat: FOR NO REASON--and then denied it by making excuses about why you did it, thus perpetuating the argument even further.

[Aloysius]

lol take your own advice, there would've been no more posts on this if you hadn't kept repeating this... do you just really want to get the last word in or something? i don't understand I provoked no argument... you read something into my posts that wasn't there perhaps... in any event, like I said, take your own advice... I have made a whole bunch of relevant posts to the topic whilest your last 3 or 4 posts have all been about how I should get back on topic

[dairygirl4u2c]

i don't think you provoked it al. if anyone did, it was her, but i can see how she would think differnt, though.
it's obvious to everyone that she was at best unclear, she could at least concede the point, in saying that stuff about how it has public aspects to it. apo even responded as if she was disputing it. al just said in a very short and sweet way what apo did. she then got caps involved, and al returned the favor. then she started getting more shrill, and al then put her down.
in her mind: she must've been clear enough, and al responded to something that was clear enough. and then she simply got assetive, in her mind, which would be justified for something that was clear enough,, so al's assertiveness was pushing back something that was unjsutified, so she then felt justified to start the shril behavior.
she was the one uping it every time though. and since al was never attitude about it, given her lack of clarity, i don't see how she felt so justified to up it all the time.
just my 2cents since it was asked.

[dairygirl4u2c]

a point of unclarity though, is that al said her point was irrelvant, before she got shrill. so in her mind, it was indeed relevant, so she felt justified to up it.
if it's arguable whether she's justified,,, im bias cause she's the one that was upping it the whole time.
saying "its not relevant" is undertsandaboly upsetting. if there were just misspeaks, then that's really all there is to it, a misunderstanding, is all.

[dairygirl4u2c]

but even saying "that's irrelevant" isn't really that big of a deal... just argue back why it is relevant.

[LouisvilleFan]

Funny that this thread is about being at peace...

[Church Punk]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1629704' date='Aug 17 2008, 03:20 PM']This will just add fuel to the fire of the dissenters who have insisted for decades that Russia was never properly consecrated in the first place and that's why all this is happening. They also say we were supposed to see the "triumph of the Immaculate Heart" in Sr. Lucia's lifetime...and she's nearly 100 years old.[/quote]


She is Dead

[Church Punk]

When did the consecration of Russia together with all the bishops of the world actually take place?

[kafka]

[quote name='Church Punk' post='1633093' date='Aug 20 2008, 07:39 PM']When did the consecration of Russia together with all the bishops of the world actually take place?[/quote]
March 25th 1984. JP II sent a letter to all the bishops in the world in due time asking them to unite with him that day in consencrating the world including Russia.

The BVMs words at fatima:

"To prevent this, I shall come to ask for the consecration of Russia to my Immaculate Heart, and the Communion of Reparation on the First Saturdays. If my requests are heeded, Russia will be converted, and there will be peace; if not, she will spread her errors throughout the world, causing wars and persecutions of the Church. The good will be martyred, the Holy Father will have much to suffer, various nations will be annihilated. In the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph. The Holy Father will consecrate Russia to me and she will be converted, and a period of peace will be granted to the world."

This time when Russia will spread her errors throughout the world and persecute the Church is a future time after the kingdom of the Great Catholic Monarch of Prophecy and the brief era of peace. It is also described in this verse of Daniel:

{7:5} And behold, another beast, like a bear, stood to one side, and there were three rows in its mouth and in its teeth, and they spoke to it in this way: “Arise, devour much flesh.”

Russia should be consecrated in each successive generation until that future time but it wont therefore Russia will rise up and cause much suffering in the world.

Also I want to mention a side note. When the BVM mentions communism in a private revelation it does not refer to political communism but a spiritual communism that is prevelant today in the Church.

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='kafka' post='1633111' date='Aug 20 2008, 07:55 PM']March 25th 1984. JP II sent a letter to all the bishops in the world in due time asking them to unite with him that day in consencrating the world including Russia.

The BVMs words at fatima:

"To prevent this, I shall come to ask for the consecration of Russia to my Immaculate Heart, and the Communion of Reparation on the First Saturdays. If my requests are heeded, Russia will be converted, and there will be peace; if not, she will spread her errors throughout the world, causing wars and persecutions of the Church. The good will be martyred, the Holy Father will have much to suffer, various nations will be annihilated. In the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph. The Holy Father will consecrate Russia to me and she will be converted, and a period of peace will be granted to the world."

This time when Russia will spread her errors throughout the world and persecute the Church is a future time after the kingdom of the Great Catholic Monarch of Prophecy and the brief era of peace. It is also described in this verse of Daniel:

{7:5} And behold, another beast, like a bear, stood to one side, and there were three rows in its mouth and in its teeth, and they spoke to it in this way: “Arise, devour much flesh.”

Russia should be consecrated in each successive generation until that future time but it wont therefore Russia will rise up and cause much suffering in the world.

Also I want to mention a side note. When the BVM mentions communism in a private revelation it does not refer to political communism but a spiritual communism that is prevelant today in the Church.[/quote]

I am still wondering about the dates and future stuff. When you have time, could you address that?

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='LouisvilleFan' post='1632960' date='Aug 20 2008, 05:27 PM']Funny that this thread is about being at peace...[/quote]

[Madame Vengier]

[quote name='Church Punk' post='1633081' date='Aug 20 2008, 07:28 PM']She is Dead[/quote]


That was covered already. About 2 days ago.

[Madame Vengier]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1632907' date='Aug 20 2008, 04:37 PM']lol take[/quote]

You are still not back on topic. Please get back on topic and stop hijacking the thread with your repeated attempts to keep alive an irrelevant and unwarranted argument that you provoked--repeat: FOR NO REASON--in the first place.

[Socrates]

Private parts of apparitions should not be publicly revealed.

[Aloysius]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1633229' date='Aug 20 2008, 11:43 PM']You are still not back on topic. Please get back on topic and stop hijacking the thread with your repeated attempts to keep alive an irrelevant and unwarranted argument that you provoked--repeat: FOR NO REASON--in the first place.[/quote]
when's the last time you've made an on-topic post in this thread? I've made several durring this little spat you've drug me into.

[Justin86]

Al,

In regards to your stance on Russia and the fall of communism, Our Lady at Fatima never predicted that this fall would last forever, as a matter of fact she specifically referred to it as an "Era of Peace", and like any other era it would have to have a beginning and an end. This is specifically interesting if you interpret Fatima in line with Our Lady of Garabandal in which one of the visionaries actually predicted that Communism would fall and rise again, as well as a few other things that have happened in recent Church history, accurately.

As for the post Madame V is arguing over with you I'm going to give you the same advice I give anyone in regards to her: just ignore her and she'll go away. She argues passionately over the most trivial of points, and just won't let it go. She's not worth your time, and life on phatmass becomes much easier if you just put her on ignore as I have done. I felt kinda rotten when I first did it, but now I'm starting to see the good fruits of it.

I didn't find your post in any way argumentative towards her. She just turned it that way and won't let go. That's what she does.

Edited August 21, 2008 by Justin86