Answering Angels & Demons

[kafka]

ha I edited it, so now you look like the dummy.

Anyhow, I wanted to enjoy Angels & Demons (I dont take all the politics/history seriously, in a fictional movie) but either I was too tired, or it was simply too uninteresting.

Edited May 27, 2009 by kafka

[Hassan]

[quote name='kafka' post='1876423' date='May 27 2009, 02:09 AM']ha I edited it, so now you look like the dummy.[/quote]




Like I need your help for that

[Guest]

[quote name='kafka' post='1876388' date='May 27 2009, 12:37 AM']hence the apologies etc. etc. etc.

I went to see Angels and Demons last night. It was that or Star Trek which I've already seen or Sin Nombre a foreign Spanish film. I chose Angels & Demons, fell asleep after about a half an hour, momentarily opened my eyes throughout the film when I heard something or other exploding or to adjust myself in my chair only later to finally realize when I permanently awoke from my slumber we were at the very end where the anti-matter explodes in the sky.[/quote]

haha thats great

Edited May 27, 2009 by Guest

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1876218' date='May 26 2009, 11:19 PM']Was the Church stating theory in regards to the universe revolving around the earth, or was that idea presented as fact?[/quote]

The Church doesn't teach science. So the Church wasn't teaching anything.

It was commonly believed that it was true, however for the people to even consider other ideas as "theories" they had to accept their own as a theory, no? The people had to acknowledge that perhaps it was not true.

Whatever the case, the point is Galelio never suffered any "hard punishment" and he was not "formally declared a heretic by the Church." It is bologna that people all too willingly believe after watching silly films like Angels and Demons and listening to uneducated propaganda from people who usually aren't Catholic and consider the Church to be a tyrannical, evil anyway and, I think for this reason, really have never cared to look into the matter any further.

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='Spence06' post='1876222' date='May 26 2009, 11:21 PM']The group of Cardinals, said this, "

[b]"That the Sun is the centre of the universe and doth not move from his place is a proposition absurd and false in philosophy, and formerly heretical; being expressly contrary to Holy Writ: That the Earth is not the centre of the universe nor immoveable, but that it moves, even with a diurnal motion, is likewise a proposition absurd and false in philosophy, and considered in theology ad minus erroneous in faith....."[/b]

I know theological "opinion" does not represent official stamped teaching but it does represent public actions taken by the Church leaders and not stopped by the official Church teaching. There were certain abuses in our history and this is one of them. Science and faith have a unique relationship and they are not opposed but people can misunderstand that relationship as the Church did in the past.[/quote]

"The Church" has never done anything in the past.

"The Church" is the Bride of Christ and is spotless.

Men in the church gave an opinion. You said they[u] formally [/u]declared him/his ideas hertical, which is just untrue. It simply didn't happen. A group of men in the church gave an opinion of that, and these men obviously weren't supported in that or the Church would have said something to agree with them.

There are certain abuses and mistaken opinions in the history of the men of the church. That is what you get with men. The Church itself has had no abuses in its history.

From what you've written first the church "formally declared him a heretic" and now the church didn't do anything of the sort but "hey, they never stoped men of position in the church from giving their opinion on him so the church is bad on that front now."

yeah

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1876220' date='May 26 2009, 11:20 PM']I agree. The Church has every right to determine which scientific oppinions are legitimate and how the ought to go about being discussed, and anyone whose views may corrupt the faithful and refuse to comply with Church rulings ought to be put under house arrest. [/quote]

Galileo, being a man of faith, willfully put forth his ideas to the Holy Father and men of intellect (which, at the time, just happened to be the Cardinals and Bishops). At that period in time a great number of the intellectuals of society were priests and religious who, having pastoral minds, kept before them the thoughts of the faithful and how new ideas would affect them. Which is smart since there was also a religious rebellion and society was being ripped apart at the seams.

And the ideas which Galileo had were being questioned by the religious sort who wondered or assumed that they went against Holy Scripture. This is just more reason, if Galileo had not willfully put the ideas before them to begin with, seeking their approval and thoughts (as he did), for the Church to look at the work of Galileo and determine if it was heretical or not. The Church has every right to seek to protect the faith of the people.

And you make his house arrest sound like he was thrown in prison or tortured.

Edited May 27, 2009 by TotusTuusMaria

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1876220' date='May 26 2009, 11:20 PM']I agree. The Church has every right to determine which scientific oppinions are legitimate and how the ought to go about being discussed, and anyone whose views may corrupt the faithful and refuse to comply with Church rulings ought to be put under house arrest. [/quote]

The Church [i]does[/i] have authority over all the baptized.

[mortify]

The whole Galileo affair is blown out of proportion and exploited by [i]humanists[/i] who were against the Church. Consider for example that the Pope permitted Galileo's teaching of the Copernican system so long as it was treated as a hypothesis:

[b]1624 April[/b]
[i]"Galileo goes to Rome where he has six audiences with the Pope Urban VIII and also has audience with a number of cardinals. The Pope assured him that he could write about the Copernican theory as long as he treated it as a mathematical hypothesis.[/i]

[url="http://galileo.rice.edu/chron/galileo.html"]http://galileo.rice.edu/chron/galileo.html[/url]


Let us also not forget that Galileo supported the Copernican system by claiming that the tides of the ocean were the result of the earth's movement, something which is not true. Considering his views went against over a thousand years of understanding of mechanics, its not a surprise that it was met with suspicion.