Mrs. Bro. Adam Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 [url="http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/3/2167.html"]My thread in the Baptist only section of the BB[/url] And I have yet to be shown an actual verse without them using their interpretation.
Mrs. Bro. Adam Posted March 31, 2004 Author Posted March 31, 2004 Any thoughts on how I'm doing? Any suggestions of how I can improve on the thread?
Catholic_4_Life Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 ...all good works... :confused: Wouldn't ALL good works include non-scripture works as well? I mean, if Paul is telling the Thessalonians to "hold the traditions which you were taught" to me, these traditions are also good works. I agree with you...I have yet to see them answer your question without adding their own interprutation.
Jake Huether Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 You are awesome! Keep at it. They are giving up. All they can hold onto is 2 Tim, but as you've pointed out, they have to interprit it a certain way. If you indeed read the context of it however: 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. we note that it is Scripture that is useful in teaching, reproof, etc. But it is the teaching, reproof, ect. that makes us fully equiped. So, it isn't Scripture that completes us, it is TEACHING. And Scripture is at best, USEFULL in teaching. Of course, I'm not bashing Scripture. We hold Scripture as the written Word. But it is Teaching which encompasses both Tradition and Scripture. Pastor Larry is skipping a whole section from this passage ("for teaching, rebuking, correction and training in righteousness") and fusing the two ends to read "All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for ever good work." But it is the Teaching that does the equipping. It isn't Scripture (although Scripture is useful as a part of it). Also, you should ask them to identify, using Scripture, the Table of Contents for the Bible. If Scripture attests to itself (as Pastor Larry suggested), then Scripture should point us to which Scriptures are Scripture. And if this is the case, then the Deuterocanon would also be included, becase Scripture uses this as well!
Mrs. Bro. Adam Posted March 31, 2004 Author Posted March 31, 2004 Did you notice that I typed out the complete section of scripture that they said. I included the previous verses, and the verses after. Then I said that they still hadn't given any verses, but then Pastor Larry said that he had... It's amazing, it's like they only read the parts of my posts that they want...the parts that they can argue with...not the entirity, which would make their argument invalid.
Catholic_4_Life Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 [quote name='Mrs. Bro. Adam' date='Mar 31 2004, 03:35 PM'] It's amazing, it's like they only read the parts of my posts that they want...the parts that they can argue with...not the entirity, which would make their argument invalid. [/quote] AMEN!
Brother Adam Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 (edited) I replied. Pastor Larry's position is irresponsible. If scripture is our only authority, then his position as a pastor is useless. We wouldn't need pastors. Dr. Hahn is onto something. :ph34r: Edited March 31, 2004 by Brother Adam
Catholic_4_Life Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 [quote name='Brother Adam' date='Mar 31 2004, 03:47 PM'] Dr. Hahn is onto something. :ph34r: [/quote] I read "Rome Sweet Home" about 2 years ago...since then I have purchased them to hand out to family and friends. Most have read it with great interest in learning what he learned. Does he have anything out that specifically covers the Gospel of John, and how he exactly came to his feelings? I know RSH talked a bit about it, I was wondering if he had something more descriptive that I could read and maybe use as a tool to continue my discussions with family and friends.
Theoketos Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 I love asking my seperated brethern where the List of Books considered to be God's Words is found in the Holy Bible. Then they say it is not. Then I say it must be a tradition then? Then they leave or learn more...
Mrs. Bro. Adam Posted March 31, 2004 Author Posted March 31, 2004 Ya'll should check out Pastor Larry's last post!
Catholic_4_Life Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 [quote name='Mrs. Bro. Adam' date='Mar 31 2004, 04:17 PM'] Ya'll should check out Pastor Larry's last post! [/quote] :irate: :saber: :mad: :noidea: :hammer: :box:
Jake Huether Posted March 31, 2004 Posted March 31, 2004 [quote name='Mrs. Bro. Adam' date='Mar 31 2004, 03:17 PM'] Ya'll should check out Pastor Larry's last post! [/quote] His answer seems to be the irrational one, if you ask me. But so many people have HUGE scales over their eyes. I don't think we can remove them. We can only pray that the Holy Spirit removes them. God bless you Mrs. Bro.
cmotherofpirl Posted April 1, 2004 Posted April 1, 2004 2 Timothy 3:16-17 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works. When Paul wrote this to Timothy the only "scripture" was the Law and the prophets. There was no New Testament yet. If you read the psalms, they do ask man to be perfect, so do the prophets. I don't think this is what the baptist board has in mind. ...furnished to good works? I thought works were not important. Profitable means useful. The word "sole" is not present in that verse. you can go here for references:http://scripturecatholic.com/scripture_alone.html You are doing very well.
cmotherofpirl Posted April 1, 2004 Posted April 1, 2004 Philippians 4 9 Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you. No where in this verse does it say pay attention only to what I write down. Also ask them where in scripture it say to take one verse to decide an issue, instead of taking scripture as a whole. If they consider this good practice that they cannot deny the literal interpretation of the gospel of John, on the eating and drinking of Christ's body and blood.
Brother Adam Posted April 1, 2004 Posted April 1, 2004 The more I read, the more I fall in love with the Church, yet the more the fear of being wrong grows in me. The teachings and the traditions of the Church are beautiful, and seem to be so true, so full, yet so many others that love Jesus tell me that the Church is a pagan cult and satan will parade as an angel of light and his doings will look beautiful and right. So yep, I'm scared.
cmotherofpirl Posted April 1, 2004 Posted April 1, 2004 CS Lewis even after his conversion said sometimes the whole thing seems like a bunch of hogwash, other times it all made perfect sense. I have had both experiences. In those times, I fall back on the fact that God is emeth = faithful and reliable. I remind myself I have seen his miracles first-hand, and I will stand fast in this knowledge, even when my emotions or an event tell me different. God is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow. So if he said Peter was the rock in the past, and the gates of hell will not prevail - then they didn't and they won't.
ilovechrist Posted April 1, 2004 Posted April 1, 2004 shouldn't this be in an apologetics area instead? just curious.. lol ur doing a good job though, keep it up!
Catholic_4_Life Posted April 1, 2004 Posted April 1, 2004 [quote name='Brother Adam' date='Mar 31 2004, 09:26 PM'] The more I read, the more I fall in love with the Church, yet the more the fear of being wrong grows in me. The teachings and the traditions of the Church are beautiful, and seem to be so true, so full, yet so many others that love Jesus tell me that the Church is a pagan cult and satan will parade as an angel of light and his doings will look beautiful and right. So yep, I'm scared. [/quote] Understandable. As one who has grown up in the Church in Utah, an area dominated by Mormons, I know what it's like to have people tell you what is wrong with the Catholic Church. But when I looked into my heart and prayed about it, I realized that I was exactly where I needed to be. So I followed my heart. The fears are still there, and probably always will be to some extent...but I can't hear them as much anymore because I am able to receive the Eucharist. That in itself is enough for me to know I am home.
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