The Attraction Of New Religious Vocations

[laetitia crucis]

Ave Maria!

I recently saw this posted on the [url="http://marymediatrix.com"]Franciscans of the Immaculate[/url]'s website [url="http://missiomariae.net"]MissioMariae.net[/url]:

[url="http://missiomariae.net/church/m-local-churche/248-study-new-religious-vocations-are-attracted-by-traditional-religious-life.html?fontstyle=f-larger"]Study: New Religious Vocations are Attracted by the Traditional religious life[/url]

My apologies if this has already been posted, I haven't seen it recently.

[tnavarro61]

yes, i think it's true, very true. less people are attracted to the more relaxed orders. i think it is good to study (esp in the field of psychology) why people want the "opposite. probably people before want a relaxed rule, now, having a relaxed rule, they want the traditional. i hope this is not offensive.

[VeniteAdoremus]

[quote name='tnavarro61' post='1949536' date='Aug 15 2009, 04:35 PM']yes, i think it's true, very true. less people are attracted to the more relaxed orders. i think it is good to study (esp in the field of psychology) why people want the "opposite. probably people before want a relaxed rule, now, having a relaxed rule, they want the traditional. i hope this is not offensive.[/quote]

I don't think it's offensive at all!

Vatican II and women's liberation has shaken the religious world around, almost entirely in a good way. You won't see many sisters anymore who are only in the convent because they don't want to be housewives, or because they love to teach. And I bet the Nashville Dominicans weren't all so extremely well-educated (often with two Master's degrees apiece) in the 1950s.

So VCII = Good Thing for religious life. Only, as with every change of direction, a sizeable portion over-reached, and you get a corrective movement in the other direction. After a while we'll regain some sort of equilibrium, and then sometime in the next century the world will be turned around on the scale of the 1960s and we can start this discussion anew

[stlmom]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' post='1949555' date='Aug 15 2009, 10:13 AM']I don't think it's offensive at all!

Vatican II and women's liberation has shaken the religious world around, almost entirely in a good way. You won't see many sisters anymore who are only in the convent because they don't want to be housewives, or because they love to teach. And I bet the Nashville Dominicans weren't all so extremely well-educated (often with two Master's degrees apiece) in the 1950s.

So VCII = Good Thing for religious life. Only, as with every change of direction, a sizeable portion over-reached, and you get a corrective movement in the other direction. After a while we'll regain some sort of equilibrium, and then sometime in the next century the world will be turned around on the scale of the 1960s and we can start this discussion anew [/quote]


Well said. We'll miss you when you're gone

[VeniteAdoremus]

[quote name='stlmom' post='1949580' date='Aug 15 2009, 06:34 PM']Well said. We'll miss you when you're gone [/quote]





I'll try bilocation. Hey, it worked for St. Martin de Porres...

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' post='1949608' date='Aug 15 2009, 12:28 PM']



I'll try bilocation. Hey, it worked for St. Martin de Porres...[/quote]


...and St. Padre Pio.

[tnavarro61]

i think that Vatican II is very beautiful, and fruitful. But some misunderstood it and took it to the extremes. Venite said it right: equilibrium!

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='tnavarro61' post='1950157' date='Aug 15 2009, 09:56 PM']i think that Vatican II is very beautiful, and fruitful. But some misunderstood it and took it to the extremes. Venite said it right: equilibrium![/quote]


It's a problem with the translation, I'm sure. Many took the changes and mistook them. Especially the part about modifying the habits to the times. I know a lot of religious orders thought that meant don't wear a habit at all.

My former community of interest, the Carmelite Sisters of the Divine Heart of Jesus, made good changes to their habit. The old veil was too much of a hindrance and produce a "blinder effect." Now, they just have the wrap around veil and the modified Carmelite habit, with no wimple (they never had one before either).

BEFORE:

[img]http://carmelitedcj.org/foundress/mariat.jpg[/img]

AFTER:

[img]http://carmelitedcj.org/life/at_prayer.jpg[/img]

[tnavarro61]

[quote name='InHisLove726' post='1950174' date='Aug 16 2009, 11:30 AM']It's a problem with the translation, I'm sure. Many took the changes and mistook them. Especially the part about modifying the habits to the times. I know a lot of religious orders thought that meant don't wear a habit at all.

My former community of interest, the Carmelite Sisters of the Divine Heart of Jesus, made good changes to their habit. The old veil was too much of a hindrance and produce a "blinder effect." Now, they just have the wrap around veil and the modified Carmelite habit, with no wimple (they never had one before either).

BEFORE:

[img]http://carmelitedcj.org/foundress/mariat.jpg[/img]

AFTER:

[img]http://carmelitedcj.org/life/at_prayer.jpg[/img][/quote]

very interesting!

i talked to a nun regarding that. Before they use wool in their habits but now they use synthetic fabric. Synthetic is cheaper than wool. Their founder chose wool before because it was the cheaper. I think now it's one of the most expensive.

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='tnavarro61' post='1950210' date='Aug 15 2009, 11:38 PM']very interesting!

i talked to a nun regarding that. Before they use wool in their habits but now they use synthetic fabric. Synthetic is cheaper than wool. Their founder chose wool before because it was the cheaper. I think now it's one of the most expensive.[/quote]

Yes, that's exactly what Sr. Annunciata of the Northern Province here in the USA told me when I asked her if her habit was a wool blend. She told me that wool these days was very expensive. I wished I had asked her if they wear a small brown, wool scapular under their habit. You know, like these:

[img]http://rosaries.com/scapular/img0.jpg[/img]

At the time, I didn't even think about it, but I wish I had. One of these days, if I ever get around to visiting some Carmelite nuns, I will ask them and see what they say.

[VeniteAdoremus]

[quote name='InHisLove726' post='1950229' date='Aug 16 2009, 06:59 AM']Yes, that's exactly what Sr. Annunciata of the Northern Province here in the USA told me when I asked her if her habit was a wool blend. She told me that wool these days was very expensive. I wished I had asked her if they wear a small brown, wool scapular under their habit. You know, like these:

[img]http://rosaries.com/scapular/img0.jpg[/img]

At the time, I didn't even think about it, but I wish I had. One of these days, if I ever get around to visiting some Carmelite nuns, I will ask them and see what they say. [/quote]

The "big" scapular counts as a scapular, even though it's technically not wool.

By the way, in .nl the DCJs have a wool winter habit, do they have the same in America?

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' post='1950352' date='Aug 16 2009, 03:47 AM']The "big" scapular counts as a scapular, even though it's technically not wool.

By the way, in .nl the DCJs have a wool winter habit, do they have the same in America?[/quote]

Unfortunately, I never asked the Sisters.


On a side note, have you heard when the postulants at the DCJ Motherhouse will be getting their habits and becoming novices? The postulants in America have already received theirs. I wonder if it will be next month or October?

[VeniteAdoremus]

[quote name='InHisLove726' post='1950371' date='Aug 16 2009, 01:33 PM']Unfortunately, I never asked the Sisters.


On a side note, have you heard when the postulants at the DCJ Motherhouse will be getting their habits and becoming novices? The postulants in America have already received theirs. I wonder if it will be next month or October?[/quote]

This is more on topic than it seems, because the DCJs are exactly one of those communities the report speaks about, with a (modified) habit and strong community life

We thought that Fieke might be invested in July, but Eunice and Petra haven't been postulants for a year yet. It seems Fieke is waiting for them, so they might all be invested in December, if they choose to do investments on December 8th this year (normally it's always July 2 I believe, but that would be a very long wait for Fieke!)

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' post='1950415' date='Aug 16 2009, 10:47 AM']This is more on topic than it seems, because the DCJs are exactly one of those communities the report speaks about, with a (modified) habit and strong community life

We thought that Fieke might be invested in July, but Eunice and Petra haven't been postulants for a year yet. It seems Fieke is waiting for them, so they might all be invested in December, if they choose to do investments on December 8th this year (normally it's always July 2 I believe, but that would be a very long wait for Fieke!)[/quote]


I got a response from Eunice today on Facebook, and she said that they are expecting to be invested on December 8th.

[laetitia crucis]

[quote name='tnavarro61' post='1950210' date='Aug 16 2009, 12:38 AM']very interesting!

i talked to a nun regarding that. Before they use wool in their habits but now they use synthetic fabric. Synthetic is cheaper than wool. Their founder chose wool before because it was the cheaper. I think now it's one of the most expensive.[/quote]


The [url="http://marymediatrix.com"]Franciscans of the Immaculate[/url] use wool (or a wool-blend) fabric for the habits (minus the veil of the sisters which is a cheap synthetic material) -- all fabric is donated to them. Hmm... .. does anyone know if it's "tradition" that Franciscans wear wool habits? -- A few years ago I had asked one of the CFR sisters about their habits, and they had said they chose the grey as it best resembled the unbleached wool of St. Francis' habit.

To say the least, I am amazed that some don't seem to break a sweat in the hot summer months! Perhaps this is an added grace of being in the Order of Penitents.

Although in some parts of the world (like Benin and Nigeria), they have a lighter material (synthetic, I believe).

[Thomist-in-Training]

[quote name='laetitia crucis' post='1950823' date='Aug 16 2009, 09:26 PM']The [url="http://marymediatrix.com"]Franciscans of the Immaculate[/url] use wool (or a wool-blend) fabric for the habits (minus the veil of the sisters which is a cheap synthetic material) -- all fabric is donated to them. Hmm... .. does anyone know if it's "tradition" that Franciscans wear wool habits? -- A few years ago I had asked one of the CFR sisters about their habits, and they had said they chose the grey as it best resembled the unbleached wool of St. Francis' habit.

To say the least, I am amazed that some don't seem to break a sweat in the hot summer months! Perhaps this is an added grace of being in the Order of Penitents.

Although in some parts of the world (like Benin and Nigeria), they have a lighter material (synthetic, I believe).[/quote]

No, I didn't even know what fabric the FI used till you said that. I did notice that the CFI (Poor Clares of the Immaculate) postulants had grey dresses that were the same color but a smoother fabric, so maybe that's because they're synthetic while the real habits are wool or woolly. Hm.

I do know that's why Dominicans have black and white, that's the two colors wool comes in without being dyed!

[Thomist-in-Training]

P.S. I didn't know missiomariae was back up! It went down a few months ago. Nice!

[Gemma]

[quote name='InHisLove726' post='1950229' date='Aug 16 2009, 12:59 AM']Yes, that's exactly what Sr. Annunciata of the Northern Province here in the USA told me when I asked her if her habit was a wool blend. She told me that wool these days was very expensive. I wished I had asked her if they wear a small brown, wool scapular under their habit. You know, like these:

[img]http://rosaries.com/scapular/img0.jpg[/img]

At the time, I didn't even think about it, but I wish I had. One of these days, if I ever get around to visiting some Carmelite nuns, I will ask them and see what they say. [/quote]

If you look at St Therese when she was in her wheelchair, there was a block of color in her midriff area, and it was attached to two bands, one for each shoulder. That was the "medium" version of the small scapular worn by the laity, and is known as the habit scapular (as per an OCD extern).

HTH.

Blessings,
Gemma

Edited August 17, 2009 by Gemma

[Gemma]

[quote name='InHisLove726' post='1950174' date='Aug 15 2009, 11:30 PM']It's a problem with the translation, I'm sure. Many took the changes and mistook them. Especially the part about modifying the habits to the times. I know a lot of religious orders thought that meant don't wear a habit at all.

My former community of interest, the Carmelite Sisters of the Divine Heart of Jesus, made good changes to their habit. The old veil was too much of a hindrance and produce a "blinder effect." Now, they just have the wrap around veil and the modified Carmelite habit, with no wimple (they never had one before either).

BEFORE:

[img]http://carmelitedcj.org/foundress/mariat.jpg[/img]

AFTER:

[img]http://carmelitedcj.org/life/at_prayer.jpg[/img][/quote]

An iron-on transfer of the thorny Eucharistic heart could have sufficed. Anyone who does professional needlework could have done the monogram, also. Or a medallion. Or a pin.

The Thorny Eucharistic Heart was distinctive, and should have been retained, IMHO.

Blessings,
Gemma

Edited August 17, 2009 by Gemma

[littlesister]

Any thoughts on the document itself? Those of us in vocation work are very interested!