University Student Protests "our Lord" On Diplomas

[ardillacid]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' date='30 March 2010 - 07:36 PM' timestamp='1269992213' post='2083724']
so ... you don't want to say the reason why you think religious being professionals is weird.

Is it a stupid reason, or something?

Because that's what people tend to assume

When you won't say what it is.
[/quote]
Fragments smell of elderberries. Why do you insist on using them?

Edit: Unless you are drinking, of course.

Edited March 30, 2010 by notardillacid

[Lilllabettt]

[quote name='Resurrexi' date='30 March 2010 - 08:40 PM' timestamp='1269992403' post='2083726']

A person's opinion of what is weird is almost completely subjective and is often based on preconceptions rather than on logic or on facts.
[/quote]


true that.

[Lilllabettt]

[quote name='notardillacid' date='30 March 2010 - 08:40 PM' timestamp='1269992431' post='2083727']
Fragments smell of elderberries. Why do you insist on using them?

Edit: Unless you are drinking, of course.
[/quote]


excuse me. didn't you see earlier in the thread where it was decided by all concerned that

I AM A POET.

no one understands my art.

[God Conquers]

[quote name='Resurrexi' date='30 March 2010 - 07:40 PM' timestamp='1269992403' post='2083726']
I do not have to have a particular reason for thinking it weird.

A person's opinion of what is weird is almost completely subjective and is often based on preconceptions rather than on logic or on facts.
[/quote]


haha, well that is certainly true in this case.

Is this a case of subjectivity, or of being mistaken?

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='Resurrexi' date='30 March 2010 - 07:34 PM' timestamp='1269992074' post='2083721']
I am certainly aware of the rich heritage of religious sisters as nurses, but I cannot recall any rich heritage of sisters as medical school trained physicians.
[/quote]
I don't know what the difference is, then, other than a few years of additional training.

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='God Conquers' date='30 March 2010 - 06:49 PM' timestamp='1269992977' post='2083734']
haha, well that is certainly true in this case.

Is this a case of subjectivity, or of being mistaken?
[/quote]

One cannot be mistaken in thinking something odd or weird as no objective criteria exists for judging a thing to be odd or weird.

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' date='30 March 2010 - 06:56 PM' timestamp='1269993364' post='2083736']
I don't know what the difference is, then, other than a few years of additional training.
[/quote]

And the diploma. You can't forget the diploma.

[Hassan]

[quote name='HisChildForever' date='30 March 2010 - 07:02 PM' timestamp='1269990176' post='2083709']
Except no one here said or implied that a Muslim hair stylist is incompetent.
[/quote]


No one did, some people did, however, try to justify customers holding that assumption, and defend it as a legitimate assumption for an employer to base hirings upon.

[Slappo]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' date='30 March 2010 - 02:53 PM' timestamp='1269985989' post='2083613']
some muslim women would be insulted by your equation of a casual sporting accessory with a [b]sacramental religious article[/b]

wearing a veil into church is nice

wearing a baseball hat into church is rude
[/quote]

It is only sacramental if used within Catholicism (You could probably broaden it to Christianity) for the purpose of disposing oneself to grace.

This would exclude a muslim woman's use of a hijab. A hijab in fact is simply a religious article. Then again so is a oujia board depending on your religion.

Edited March 31, 2010 by Slappo

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='Slappo' date='31 March 2010 - 12:28 AM' timestamp='1270009711' post='2083869']
It is only sacramental if used within Catholicism (You could probably broaden it to Christianity) for the purpose of disposing oneself to grace.

This would exclude a muslim woman's use of a hijab. A hijab in fact is simply a religious article. Then again so is a oujia board depending on your religion.
[/quote]

Oh, good call.

[Slappo]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' date='30 March 2010 - 03:08 PM' timestamp='1269986910' post='2083636']
Am I Walt Whitman?

Or just somebody who likes to skip lines?

So that I can read?

Nihil if you practice, you will be able to read my work with ease.

And after that, all the masters will be open to you.

[b]1. Nowadays women choose their breast size[/b]
2. Many Muslim women don't feel they have any "control" over how they wear their hair, anymore than you or I feel we have "control" over whether we go to Mass on Sunday

When I go to a hairdresser, I am not interested in her taste.

I am interested in her ability to give me something according to MY taste.

I don't care what she likes. I care about what I like. And whether or not she can deliver that to me.
[/quote]

Women don't choose their [b]breast[/b] size. [b]Some[/b] choose to modify their [b]bust[/b] size by immoral means.

[quote name='Lilllabettt' date='30 March 2010 - 03:21 PM' timestamp='1269987695' post='2083653']
ok, cool



i would not hire someone whose hair looked "dirty". Dirtiness is unprofessional.

but i would not assume that someone who has their hair covered beneath a beautiful hijab has dirty hair, either.
[/quote]

Who says the woman had a beautiful hijab on?

[quote name='Resurrexi' date='30 March 2010 - 03:29 PM' timestamp='1269988189' post='2083667']
I am the only one who thinks it is odd that a Sister is going to medical school?
[/quote]

yes

[quote name='Hassan' date='30 March 2010 - 03:45 PM' timestamp='1269989148' post='2083696']
Sure, and they could decide not to opperate on the assumption that a Muslim employee is incompetant because she covers her hair in public.
[/quote]

It doesn't have to do with the competency of cutting hair, but the competency of advertising hair.

[Lilllabettt]

[quote name='Slappo' date='31 March 2010 - 01:28 AM' timestamp='1270009711' post='2083869']
It is only sacramental if used within Catholicism (You could probably broaden it to Christianity) for the purpose of disposing oneself to grace.

This would exclude a muslim woman's use of a hijab. A hijab in fact is simply a religious article. Then again so is a oujia board depending on your religion.
[/quote]



Of course I don't think the hijab is a sacramental.

The point is, many Muslim women think of it as a sacramental.

The word "sacramental" does not have meaning only for Catholics

Scholars of comparative religion use the term to describe Jewish, Muslim, Hindu and other practices.

Likewise the word "sacrament" is not exclusively Catholic.

We have Sacraments, big "S". But other religions may be said to have "sacraments," little s, that is; outward signs they believe communicate grace.

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' date='30 March 2010 - 10:30 PM' timestamp='1269984652' post='2083586']
people do not give themselves haircuts.
[/quote]
I do.

[quote name='Lilllabettt' date='30 March 2010 - 11:33 PM' timestamp='1269988433' post='2083674']
Of course, I have never been that into buying hair junk. Never had the money to shill out on stuff like that,

"proof" or not.
[/quote]
ditto

[Lilllabettt]

[quote name='Slappo' date='31 March 2010 - 03:32 AM' timestamp='1270017144' post='2083905']
Women don't choose their [b]breast[/b] size. [b]Some[/b] choose to modify their [b]bust[/b] size by immoral means.

Who says the woman had a beautiful hijab on?
[/quote]

Let's start with your second point first. I don't know the particular situation, since HCF just described the situation; no link was posted. The question in my mind is whether a Muslim woman wearing a hijab (in general) can make a professionally effective appearance working in a salon (in general.)

My answer to that question is "yes."

Because:

1. As demonstrated by the photos posted earlier, hijabs can be stylish and beautiful
2. The way a well-dressed woman in hijab styles MY hair, using whatever products work on MY hair, is a far more important factor in "advertising" those products for sale to ME than a demonstration of whatever works in HER hair.

As for your first point:

Plastic surgery is immoral? I had no idea!
There's a difference between bust and breast? Really?

1. I guess my point is, women "may" choose their "bust size."

2. Some establishments, I am thinking of one in particular, might defend their decision to hire only large breasted women by saying
women can work there if they modify their breast size (or bust size. use whatever term you want.)

3. A Catholic woman might say "But I can't change my bust size that way! It's immoral!"

4.

5. Like, you know.

6. A Muslim woman who says she can't change the way she covers her hair. Because she finds doing so would be immoral.


Generally, I am against people suing others.

And I generally don't like laws telling business people who they can/cannot hire or sell.
(The law here in DC requires pharmacists to fill contraception prescriptions, no conscience clause)

What I disagree with is people saying that women who wear hijab can't be effective hair stylists.
(No, the veil does not prevent a woman from having a fashionable appearance, excellent salesmanship and good hairstyling skills.)

Or comparing wearing the hijab to something silly like a baseball cap; like its something that can be easily changed.

The origins of the veil are in a certain part of the Quran. Can't think of where right now. But Mohammad has just gotten married to a new wife. Its their wedding night, and two guests from the wedding are very rudely keeping the couple up talking. Finally Mohammad lets fall a curtain between him and his wife and the outside of the inner tent, as he did so a verse of the Qu'ran was revealed, and he spoke it etc etc etc.

What follows from this is the significance of the veil as a shield; it is to protect something which is private, sacred and holy (the relationship between husband and wife) from base, rude, outside intrusion. Women who wear the hijab believe that they are following God's instruction to protect what is sacred and holy (themselves; their dignity, their modesty) from rude outsiders.

When someone suggests to a Muslim woman that she remove her veil, she may very well be insulted, because in her mind the implication may be that there is nothing sacred and holy in her that is worthy of special protection.

[Lilllabettt]

[quote name='Archaeology cat' date='31 March 2010 - 08:25 AM' timestamp='1270034756' post='2083933']
I do.


ditto
[/quote]

impressive.