What Do You Do

[dairygirl4u2c]

it seems sort of radical to many, but here is the proper response, right?
Luke 6:27-31. “27But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. 29If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic."

let him take the other stuff

Edited June 11, 2010 by dairygirl4u2c

[Laudate_Dominum]

just tell him to leave, but dont resist in any way him taking the TV and other stuff

but...

I would talk the guy's ear off, wouldn't simply ask him to leave. I would make it clear that I don't value material possessions, and have no intention of using violence in retaliation, while at the same time explaining why thievery is evil, etc., and that it isn't too late for him to repent and make amends.

If the situation permitted I would attempt to find out the motivation for his stealing. Depending on the circumstances I might offer him my wallet and my shoes as well, as to a brother. Finally I would wish peace upon him and spend the remainder of the day and/or night praying and fasting.

[Winchester]

I would take the fight out of the man. Anyone entering my home like that is a threat to my family. He will never be a threat again, when I am done.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Winchester' date='11 June 2010 - 10:45 AM' timestamp='1276267531' post='2127182']
I would take the fight out of the man. Anyone entering my home like that is a threat to my family. He will never be a threat again, when I am done.[/quote]
I would not put the protection of their bodies above the safeguarding of their souls. It is better to love thine enemy and put thy trust in the Lord, even unto death, than to inflict violence upon a brother. It would be better to risk bodily harm on your family than to inflict such spiritual harm on their souls. I would suffer death in defense of my family without hesitation, but there is nothing in the world for which I would kill. I would rather suffer violence and death than commit sin. But I don't suppose dairygirl meant for us to debate self-defense. For the sake of simplicity perhaps we ought to pretend we are home alone when this thief scenario unfolds.

Blessed are the peacemakers. Praised be Jesus Christ.

[Winchester]

The risk of them returning is also part of my decision. I may love someone yet still cause them physical injury. It's not about the television. The harm my daughter would or may suffer is of more importance than the harm an intruder might suffer.

Christian pacifism is laudable. My actions cause no problem for the souls of my family, and I am within my rights to stop the intruder and to take the fight out of him.

Having no immediate consequences might embolden the thief. My home would be seen as a soft target. Perhaps next time, he panics or he decides to take more than mere property. Perhaps he rapes someone, next time, or brags to one of his fellows who is not simply a thief. I'll pray for his soul, but I won't risk the life of my family.

Edited June 11, 2010 by Winchester

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Winchester' date='11 June 2010 - 11:43 AM' timestamp='1276271014' post='2127219']
The risk of them returning is also part of my decision. I may love someone yet still cause them physical injury. It's not about the television. The harm my daughter would or may suffer is of more importance than the harm an intruder might suffer.

Christian pacifism is laudable. My actions cause no problem for the souls of my family, and I am within my rights to stop the intruder and to take the fight out of him.

Having no immediate consequences might embolden the thief. My home would be seen as a soft target. Perhaps next time, he panics or he decides to take more than mere property. Perhaps he rapes someone, next time, or brags to one of his fellows who is not simply a thief. I'll pray for his soul, but I won't risk the life of my family.
[/quote]
Don't worry, I was being intentionally "holier than thou" for a bit of fun. I hear ya bro.

[Winchester]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='11 June 2010 - 11:48 AM' timestamp='1276271307' post='2127226']
Don't worry, I was being intentionally "holier than thou" for a bit of fun. I hear ya bro.
[/quote]
Even so, I recognise the decision to not fight is valid, and if done with true faith, is quite holy.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Winchester' date='11 June 2010 - 11:50 AM' timestamp='1276271424' post='2127227']
Even so, I recognise the decision to not fight is valid, and if done with true faith, is quite holy.
[/quote]
Amen. I hope I would do whatever is the most holy in the particular situation, but my track record in life isn't that great. As a youth I had my share of frivolous fistfights.

[Winchester]

God also recognises awesome, and totally radical.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Winchester' date='11 June 2010 - 11:54 AM' timestamp='1276271676' post='2127231']
God also recognises awesome, and totally radical.
[/quote]


[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cEdqWZi13I[/media]

[Era Might]

[quote name='Winchester' date='11 June 2010 - 11:43 AM' timestamp='1276271014' post='2127219']Having no immediate consequences might embolden the thief.[/quote]
It also might escalate a situation beyond what it would have been.

If someone were just stealing my TV, I wouldn't do anything. He'd be doing me a favor (not that I condone stealing).

If my family were in immediate danger, then I would deal with that situation as it arises.

I was watching footage of some gun-rights advocates, who walked around all the time with guns in visible sight. Their reasoning was that you never know when an attacker is going to appear. I thought that was such a sad way to live life, in constant fear of theoretical attackers.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Era Might' date='11 June 2010 - 12:03 PM' timestamp='1276272229' post='2127238']
It also might escalate a situation beyond what it would have been.

If someone were just stealing my TV, I wouldn't do anything. He'd be doing me a favor (not that I condone stealing).

If my family were in immediate danger, then I would deal with that situation as it arises.[/quote]
I agree with these comments. Especially the anti-TV sentiments. Taking dairy's scenario at face value and not adding other factors I hope that I would focus on the thief as a brother than on the stupid TV. Knowing me there is a chance that I'd get uppity and try to box with the guy.

[zunshynn]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='11 June 2010 - 10:07 AM' timestamp='1276272428' post='2127241']
I agree with these comments. Especially the anti-TV sentiments. Taking dairy's scenario at face value and not adding other factors I hope that I would focus on the thief as a brother than on the stupid TV. Knowing me there is a chance that I'd get uppity and try to box with the guy.
[/quote]

I associate you so much with that Kirk guy and the Data guy, that hearing you talk about getting into fistfights brings to mind an image of a brawl between them in a star trek console or something like that.

[Socrates]

I'd strut my stuff physically, maybe do a little dance.

At the sight of my stuff, the burglar would immediately drop the tv, and stand paralyzed in a slack-jawed stupor. Once he had recovered from the shock and awe enough to move, he'd be overwhelmed with a feeling of inferiority, and run away in shame, never to return.

Works every time.





















(Seriously, though, what Winnie said.)

[Resurrexi]

Whoa oh oh oh oh
There's a party at a rich dude's house.
Whoa oh oh oh oh
There's a party at a rich dude's house.
So if you wanna go,
Then you know
We're going to fight till we do it right.
So let's whoa oh oh oh oh
Tonight.

Edited June 11, 2010 by Resurrexi

[Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam]

Here is the response I would like to have if he wanted my tv (and another assuming I even have one) and assuming it is just me in the house. Having a family in the house is a completely different ball game. (home alone) I'd probably help him carry out the tv though I'd be thinking about the Home Alone movie pranks on the burglars and then I'd lock the door behind me once we had moved them out. I'd ask how he was doing? Having hard times? Did he need something to eat, give him the cash in my wallet. Then go back inside and lock the door. This is all assuming it is just me.

If he were threatening my family or a friend then it is a different ball game. if he is just interested in stealing stuff, then again I'd help him carry things out (so he has his hands full with TV's and such and not a weapon instead) so that my family is safe . Once out the house, the people inside are safe. When I have my own place, I plan on sleeping with a bat next to my bed, incase someone really is threatening my family. If he is not just coming to steal stuff but is actually intending to do harm then I am prepared to use my Louisville Slugger bat like I practiced in baseball.

Edited June 11, 2010 by Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam

[Hilde]

I have the upper body strength of a bunny, so I don't think I'd tackle the intruder or anything. I guess I'd hit a long soprano high C to annoy him and alert the neighbors, threaten him with a weapon(might get creative on that one), get a good look at him for the police lineup, call the police

As others have said, the TV is not as important as the harm he may cause to me, my family or my guinea pigs. Whether I have a higher chance of getting into heaven than him in case of death is not something I'll take into consideration. If he don't want to risk his freedom or health he can choose another source of income.

[Socrates]

I don't think we're under any moral obligation to aid others in performing a gravely sinful and criminal act such as robbery, even if against ourselves. People certainly have a right to protect their property, though lethal force should be avoided as far as practical.
If someone has forcefully invaded our homes, he may indeed be a threat to the safety of ourselves and family, and self-defense and defense of others is certainly allowable. If it results in the criminal's death, too bad for him.
Standing by and allowing an attacker to have his way with your family is not holy, but cowardice.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Socrates' date='11 June 2010 - 02:36 PM' timestamp='1276281397' post='2127332']
I don't think we're under any moral obligation to aid others in performing a gravely sinful and criminal act such as robbery, even if against ourselves. People certainly have a right to protect their property, though lethal force should be avoided as far as practical.
If someone has forcefully invaded our homes, he may indeed be a threat to the safety of ourselves and family, and self-defense and defense of others is certainly allowable. If it results in the criminal's death, too bad for him.
Standing by and allowing an attacker to have his way with your family is not holy, but cowardice.
[/quote]
Flamebait[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=105963"]?[/url]

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='11 June 2010 - 10:43 AM' timestamp='1276267411' post='2127180']
just tell him to leave, but dont resist in any way him taking the TV and other stuff

but...

I would talk the guy's ear off, wouldn't simply ask him to leave. I would make it clear that I don't value material possessions, and have no intention of using violence in retaliation, while at the same time explaining why thievery is evil, etc., and that it isn't too late for him to repent and make amends.

If the situation permitted I would attempt to find out the motivation for his stealing. Depending on the circumstances I might offer him my wallet and my shoes as well, as to a brother. Finally I would wish peace upon him and spend the remainder of the day and/or night praying and fasting.
[/quote]

This is why L_D should make more serious posts sometimes.