What They Really Want To Build At Ground Zero

[cmotherofpirl]

http://wdtprs.com/blog/2010/09/ground-zero-mosque-a-rabat-not-a-cultural-center/

[Nunsense]

This is scary - thanx for sharing.

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' timestamp='1284175869' post='2171709']
[url="http://wdtprs.com/bl."]http://wdtprs.com/bl.[/url] ..ultural-center/
[/quote]

Even Satan himself lulled Eve into a rapport before he rocked her world, too. The [mod]NEGATIVE CRITICISM OF OTHER RELIGIONS - A post or comment that negatively criticizes a different religion in a way that is harmful to open ecumenical dialogue. - dUSt[/mod] have rabats, Commies have "People's Palaces," and politicians have got public schools. This is not a new phenomenon.

We should work toward getting rid of all of those ideologies. But that's a cultural process, not a violent/political process. The [mod]NEGATIVE CRITICISM OF OTHER RELIGIONS - A post or comment that negatively criticizes a different religion in a way that is harmful to open ecumenical dialogue. - dUSt[/mod] must be allowed to build whatever they want on their own property. We can easily stop all of them from imposing their ideas on us simply by [i]not believing in them. [/i]

You want to stop them? Get married! Raise lots of Catholic children, and raise them well! "The war against Islam will be won in the bedroom!" as Cardinal Pell said.

And lastly, we must [i]never[/i] let [i]any [/i]of those groups, [mod]NEGATIVE CRITICISM OF OTHER RELIGIONS - A post or comment that negatively criticizes a different religion in a way that is harmful to open ecumenical dialogue. - dUSt[/mod] or politician, impose their wills upon us by violence.

~Sternhauser

Edited September 13, 2010 by dUSt

[Chi Zhuzi]

Stern, I think your choice of word to describe Muslim may be inflammatory. I'm going to post a video or it's link, but I want to make clear to Muslim and non-Muslim alike, I sincerely have no intent or desire to inspire hated or oppression against Muslims in general. I'm sure there are Muslims that are better people than I. I also have more admiration for contemporary Muslim women than I do for contemporary Catholic women in the United States and Europe.

But I want to dispel some myths: (1) All Arabs are Muslims. (2) All Catholics are white. (3) Muslims only bring peace and tolerance. (4) Catholics only bring religious and political persecution and homicides.

Reality: (1) Most Arabs in the United are Christian, of which most of those are Maronite Catholics. (2) Brazil, Mexico, and the Philippines are the largest Catholic countries in the world. Our Lady of Guadalupe is the face of a [i]mestiza[/i]. (3) There are Islamic extremist NGO's in Buddhist Thailand, Hindu India, Orthodox and atheist Russia, and the Catholic Philippines. (4) Sao Paulo, Mexico City, and Milan are hardly bastions of religious intolerance and Catholic jihad.





Brigitte Gabriel is Arab and a Maronite Catholic. Her audience is usually Evangelical Protestant and American Jews, because they are the most receptive to her message (not Catholics in general). She's written a book about her life, and can be found on many videos on youtube. Supposedly, she is terrorist expert, having dedicated her life to studying it.


[media][/media]

[Chi Zhuzi]

Sorry, I thought I could insert that video.

Here's the link for the video of powerful speaker, Brigitte Gabriel: [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21orCM7KkRI&feature=related"]My link[/url]

[Chi Zhuzi]

[quote name='Chi Zhuzi' timestamp='1284231353' post='2171929']
Sorry, I thought I could insert that video.

Here's the link for the video of powerful speaker, Brigitte Gabriel: [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21orCM7KkRI&feature=related"]My link[/url]
[/quote]

Brigitte on CNN: [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIy2L5uI9P8&feature=related"]My link[/url]

[Chi Zhuzi]

[quote name='Chi Zhuzi' timestamp='1284231475' post='2171932']
Brigitte on CNN: [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIy2L5uI9P8&feature=related"]My link[/url]
[/quote]

Finally, for those Catholic women in the United States and Europe who believe the propaganda, that Islam is liberal and extraordinarily gracious upon its women, and Catholicism is conservative form of Islam that oppresses its women by the diabolic veneration of a virgin woman (Eve and Mary suggests a feminist story, where women determine the destiny of mankind, so, she was Virgin, so was Jesus).

Fox news may be subjective, and therefore not good objective news, parroting the Republican position, but it at least had the courage to show something, in my opinion, far more objectionable to me and humanity than a few people burning a few copies of the Quran.

The Stoning of Soraya M: [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Nm8dkD30Gg"]My link[/url]

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Chi Zhuzi' timestamp='1284231251' post='2171927']
Stern, I think your choice of word to describe Muslim may be inflammatory.[/quote]

I've explained before why I do not call them "Muslim." "Muslim" means "One who submits [to God's will]." I do not believe it is God's will that anyone be Muslim. It would be a condescending lie and a contradiction of my own religion to say they were "submitting to God's will."

The Qu'ran is contradictory to Holy Scripture in dozens, if not hundreds of places, and was thus either inspired by man, or inspired by a demon or many demons. There is no case in the Old Testament or New Testament where anyone heard the voice of God and immediately wanted to kill himself by throwing himself off a cliff. Mahomet did. "Allah" of the Qu'ran refers to himself in the plural several times. The[mod]NEGATIVE CRITICISM OF OTHER RELIGIONS - A post or comment that negatively criticizes a different religion in a way that is harmful to open ecumenical dialogue. - dUSt[/mod] are not Trinitiarians. The math is there to be done.

[quote] I'm going to post a video or it's link, but I want to make clear to Muslim and non-Muslim alike, I sincerely have no intent or desire to inspire hated or oppression against Muslims in general. I'm sure there are Muslims that are better people than I. I also have more admiration for contemporary Muslim women than I do for contemporary Catholic women in the United States and Europe.

But I want to dispel some myths: (1) All Arabs are Muslims. (2) All Catholics are white. (3) Muslims only bring peace and tolerance. (4) Catholics only bring religious and political persecution and homicides.

Reality: (1) Most Arabs in the United are Christian, of which most of those are Maronite Catholics. (2) Brazil, Mexico, and the Philippines are the largest Catholic countries in the world. Our Lady of Guadalupe is the face of a [i]mestiza[/i]. (3) There are Islamic extremist NGO's in Buddhist Thailand, Hindu India, Orthodox and atheist Russia, and the Catholic Philippines. (4) Sao Paulo, Mexico City, and Milan are hardly bastions of religious intolerance and Catholic jihad.

Brigitte Gabriel is Arab and a Maronite Catholic. Her audience is usually Evangelical Protestant and American Jews, because they are the most receptive to her message (not Catholics in general). She's written a book about her life, and can be found on many videos on youtube. Supposedly, she is terrorist expert, having dedicated her life to studying it.
[media][/media]
[/quote]

I've no doubt the majority of [mod]NEGATIVE CRITICISM OF OTHER RELIGIONS - A post or comment that negatively criticizes a different religion in a way that is harmful to open ecumenical dialogue. - dUSt[/mod]are non-violent (read: secularized/lukewarm) [mod]NEGATIVE CRITICISM OF OTHER RELIGIONS - A post or comment that negatively criticizes a different religion in a way that is harmful to open ecumenical dialogue. - dUSt[/mod]. Judging by the percentage of Catholic women on chemical contraceptives, the majority of Catholics don't bother following the teachings of Christ and His Church, either.

~Sternhauser

Edited September 13, 2010 by dUSt

[Chi Zhuzi]

[quote name='Sternhauser' timestamp='1284238328' post='2171987']
I've no doubt the majority of Mahommedans are non-violent (read: secularized/lukewarm) Mohammedans. Judging by the percentage of Catholic women on chemical contraceptives, the majority of Catholics don't bother following the teachings of Christ and His Church, either.

~Sternhauser
[/quote]

I see you're going to be intent on using that word.

I don't expect anyone to be saints. It's a worthy goal but most Catholic men and women will never obtain that. Plus, it would be rather hypocritical of me to admonish Catholic women on contraception when I have so many my own flaws that stray far from Catholic morality. I stopped practicing as a Catholic because I became more lost. I'm still not 100% sure what the truth is, but what I do know is that Catholicism and its history, and principles, are no worse than that of Islam. I see a lot of practicing Catholic women that will speak more glowing of Islam than they will of Catholicism. For many different layers of reasons I think, in part because secular media and propaganda has so vilified Catholicism.

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Chi Zhuzi' timestamp='1284254654' post='2172097']
I see you're going to be intent on using that word. [/quote]

I also don't call people who kill babies for a living "doctors."

[quote]I don't expect anyone to be saints. It's a worthy goal but most Catholic men and women will never obtain that.[/quote]

God expects us to be saints. Every single person is called, expected to be a saint. Who are we to argue with God?

[quote]Plus, it would be rather hypocritical of me to admonish Catholic women on contraception when I have so many my own flaws that stray far from Catholic morality.[/quote]

Well, then, knock it off. Pick yourself up, shoulder your cross, and find and follow the narrow path again. You've got nothing to lose. The Bark of Peter needs more steady hands on deck.

[quote]I stopped practicing as a Catholic because I became more lost.[/quote]

No matter how lost you feel, God didn't lose you. He knows right where you are. And he's patient. He loves you more than you could ever love yourself.

[quote]I'm still not 100% sure what the truth is, but what I do know is that Catholicism and its history, and principles, are no worse than that of Islam. I see a lot of practicing Catholic women that will speak more glowing of Islam than they will of Catholicism. For many different layers of reasons I think, in part because secular media and propaganda has so vilified Catholicism.
[/quote]

It has vilified Catholicism. Public opinion has never really been in favor of the Church. And when it is in favor of the Church, it's time to expect trouble. The Church always gets the raw deal when the Church gets cozy with whatever powers might be. Jesus promised us strife. Contention. The Cross. When the Church is loved by the World, something's wrong. We've got to be what's right with the world.

~Sternhauser

Edited September 12, 2010 by Sternhauser

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='Chi Zhuzi' timestamp='1284254654' post='2172097']
I'm still not 100% sure what the truth is, but what I do know is that Catholicism and its history, and principles, are no worse than that of Islam.[/quote]

Really? Did Jesus Christ encourage His followers to spread His message through conquest?

[quote] I see a lot of practicing Catholic women that will speak more glowing of Islam than they will of Catholicism. For many different layers of reasons I think, in part because secular media and propaganda has so vilified Catholicism.
[/quote]

Ship them off to an Islamic country and then we will see how glowingly they speak of Islam.

[ThePenciledOne]

[quote name='HisChildForever' timestamp='1284266660' post='2172160']
Really? Did Jesus Christ encourage His followers to spread His message through conquest?



Ship them off to an Islamic country and then we will see how glowingly they speak of Islam.
[/quote]

Those two statements seem to contradict one another, as in the tone for each.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='ThePenciledOne' timestamp='1284267380' post='2172164']
Those two statements seem to contradict one another, as in the tone for each.
[/quote]

Allow me to enlighten you to how they are not. Christ establish a religion of peace not conquest. Women are better treated in Christian Nations or nations where Christians are the majority than nations under Islamic rule. And if these women who speak so glowingly of Islam were to live under Islamic law and custom it is likely they would soon long for Christian Liberty.

Edited September 12, 2010 by KnightofChrist

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1284267946' post='2172167']
Allow me to enlighten you to how they are not. Christ establish a religion of peace not conquest. Women are better treated in Christian Nations or nations where Christians are the majority than nations under Islamic rule. And if these women who speak so glowingly of Islam were to live under Islamic law and custom it is likely they would soon long for Christian Liberty.
[/quote]

Very well put, thank you.

[ThePenciledOne]

[quote name='ThePenciledOne' timestamp='1284267380' post='2172164']
Those two statements seem to contradict one another, as in the tone for each.
[/quote]


[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1284267946' post='2172167']
Allow me to enlighten you to how they are not. Christ establish a religion of peace not conquest. Women are better treated in Christian Nations or nations where Christians are the majority than nations under Islamic rule. And if these women who speak so glowingly of Islam were to live under Islamic law and custom it is likely they would soon long for Christian Liberty.
[/quote]

What I meant, was not the question of Christanity and Islam. I find the juxtaposition of first saying that Jesus was about peace, and then another statement saying that we should 'ship' them to an Islamic country. I find that second statement very harsh and doesn't honesty sit well with me, I think people even if they are wrong should be entitled to their opinion until they see differently. As Catholics we can do this by either acting in Christ's example or talking to them on a personal level. I am sure HCF, did not mean for her statement to be harsh, but the wording could have been maybe a little nicer. Though this is just my perspective.

[dominicansoul]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1284267946' post='2172167']
Allow me to enlighten you[/quote]

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='ThePenciledOne' timestamp='1284304802' post='2172242']
What I meant, was not the question of Christanity and Islam. I find the juxtaposition of first saying that Jesus was about peace, and then another statement saying that we should 'ship' them to an Islamic country. I find that second statement very harsh and doesn't honesty sit well with me, I think people even if they are wrong should be entitled to their opinion until they see differently. As Catholics we can do this by either acting in Christ's example or talking to them on a personal level. I am sure HCF, did not mean for her statement to be harsh, but the wording could have been maybe a little nicer. Though this is just my perspective.
[/quote]

Perhaps you should focus on what I am saying, rather than how you perceive I am saying it. (I am being sincere about that, by the way.)

When practicing Catholic women "speak more glowing of Islam than they will of Catholicism" then there is something terribly wrong - and not just because women are treated like second-class citizens in Islamic countries, either. Replace "Islam" with "Hinduism" or "Wicca" and my opinion remains the same.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='ThePenciledOne' timestamp='1284304802' post='2172242']
What I meant, was not the question of Christanity and Islam. I find the juxtaposition of first saying that Jesus was about peace, and then another statement saying that we should 'ship' them to an Islamic country. I find that second statement very harsh and doesn't honesty sit well with me, I think people even if they are wrong should be entitled to their opinion until they see differently. As Catholics we can do this by either acting in Christ's example or talking to them on a personal level. I am sure HCF, did not mean for her statement to be harsh, but the wording could have been maybe a little nicer. Though this is just my perspective.
[/quote]

I find that you still don't understand the point. Which is that many women who speak glowingly of Islam in the West who are not Muslim would feel very much oppressed living under Islamic Law. That was the point to illustrate the oppression of women under Islamic Law. Your points have little to do with the topic and more to do with your judging HCF as someone that doesn't live up to your over analyzing projecting perspective. Which is in conflict because you say one is entitled to their beliefs but then flip around and say that she in some way is not entitled because of the harshness of those words from your viewpoint.

Edited September 12, 2010 by KnightofChrist

[ThePenciledOne]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1284306632' post='2172248']
I find that you still don't understand the point. Which is that many women who speak glowingly of Islam in the West who are not Muslim would feel very much oppressed living under Islamic Law. That was the point to illustrate the oppression of women under Islamic Law. Your points have little to do with the topic and more to do with your judging HCF as someone that doesn't live up to your over analyzing projecting perspective. Which is in conflict because you say one is entitled to their beliefs but then flip around and say that she in some way is not entitled because of the harshness of those words from your viewpoint.
[/quote]

Alright, but isn't that how it is with most people? I mean, we obviously don't know exactly how things are until we see them. If women speak glowing of Islam then fine, good for them, they may feel oppressed if they ever experience something under Islamic Law. I was only commenting on the wording used. And yes one is entitled to it, I just don't necessarily understand why a person (in general) has to speak out, and it's not only on this topic and its not only HCF. The wording just struck me funny and I made a comment, which I guess is contradictory of me but then we are human.

I am sorry to HCF for making the assumption.

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='ThePenciledOne' timestamp='1284307480' post='2172255']
I mean, we obviously don't know exactly how things are until we see them. If women speak glowing of Islam then fine, good for them, they may feel oppressed if they ever experience something under Islamic Law.
[/quote]

But we hear and read about numerous atrocities committed in the name of Islam all the time. One does not have to live in an Islamic country to know and understand what is going on. In any event, no, it is not "fine" for a devout Catholic woman to "speak glowingly" of Islam (or any other religion*) because Islam rejects Jesus Christ and the Trinity. There is nothing beautiful about that.

*I believe that Islam is more than a religion but it is not necessary to get into that here.