This Man Is A Hero.

[Winchester]

[quote name='Sternhauser' timestamp='1289956733' post='2187496']

No one, man or woman, is morally obliged to submit to a strip search, physical or imaged, to travel. This is an abomination, but defend it all you like, Winchester. Go ahead. Claim you're only making a semantic point. If not, gut up and say you oppose the naked scanners. Or gut up and say that it's perfectly all right for women to be submitted to such treatment.

[/quote]
Caffeine is not your friend.

[MIKolbe]

WOAH dude.. that hit me!

[Winchester]

[quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1290097855' post='2187851']
WOAH dude.. that hit me!
[/quote]
You're just fine with caffeine. I was talking to internet tough guy.

[MIKolbe]

interent is srs business. srsly.

[Winchester]

It's certainly serious that people are being forced to go through these checkpoints. Apparently, people are getting summoned to air travel. It's just like jury duty, but with molestation.

[MIKolbe]

i know!!

we need to know our place and submit to Caesar's "[url="http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/11/17/national/main7063414.shtml"]love pats[/url]".

Ceasar in health care = das bad!

Ceasar in the skies = das good!

[Winchester]

The real answer is to not fly until it's changed, or for a ton of people to refuse. Good luck stuffing everyone in airport jail.

I wonder how many people who want better security are willing to pay for that better security. A proper security agency using proper techniques will cost money.

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1290100174' post='2187864']
The real answer is to not fly until it's changed, or for a ton of people to refuse. Good luck stuffing everyone in airport jail.

I wonder how many people who want better security are willing to pay for that better security. A proper security agency using proper techniques will cost money.
[/quote]

And the best (if not only way!) to provide for services everyone needs (like food, clothing, housing) is for the State to provide it. How else can we ensure everyone is treated [i]equally [/i]and [i]fairly[/i]?

Nobody could possibly surpass the State in quality and cost when it comes to delivering mail, ambulance services, utilities and other services. So how could they provide better, more competent [i]security[/i] at a lower price?

Yours still in the absence of caffeine but presence of principle,

~Sternhauser

Edited November 18, 2010 by Sternhauser

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' timestamp='1290085948' post='2187825']
I never know if I should believe your specific examples, but you are spot on with your assessment of human nature and how politics and governments work: almost ALWAYS someone claims they had the best of intentions as they set out for some despiciable action.
[/quote]

CMother, of course you should believe the examples. Aliens transmit messages to me about such things in secret codes. <cough> And everyone knows aliens don't lie. [i]Duh[/i].

But seriously: thank you.

~Sternhauser

[Sternhauser]

Glad to see these trained professionals are charged with "providing security." Amazing how often a whole bunch of "bad apples" are able to instantly show up in the same place. [url="http://www.theaustralian.com.au/travel/news/airport-staff-exposed-womans-breasts-laughed/story-e6frg8ro-1225955345734"]Airport Staff 'Exposed Woman's Breasts, Laughed.'[/url]

Welcome to the beginning of the future.

~Sternhauser

Edited November 18, 2010 by Sternhauser

[Lilllabettt]

You know, the Israelis do not use these naked type full body scanners.

And I know for a fact that the Orthodox do not stand for aggressive "touching"

So how do they do it?

Why don't we ask them?

They are the experts.

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' timestamp='1290122000' post='2187939']
You know, the Israelis do not use these naked type full body scanners.

And I know for a fact that the Orthodox do not stand for aggressive "touching"

So how do they do it?

Why don't we ask them?

They are the experts.
[/quote]

Elizabett, it's not about efficacy. It's about turning a buck on the overblown fears of an ignorant, spineless, determinist populace. The pornoscanners are, in great part, about turning Michael Chertoff, former Kapo of the [i]Heimat Sicherheitsdienst,[/i] into a billionaire. [url="http://www.nowpublic.com/world/full-body-scanner-lobby-michael-chertoff-rapiscan-2552674.html"]http://www.nowpublic...an-2552674.html[/url] Funny how his abominations are called "Rapiscans." A fitting name, and not because of their speed.

~Sternhauser

Edited November 19, 2010 by Sternhauser

[Sternhauser]

A must-watch video featuring clips of the TSAtroopers in action.

http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/978.html

~Sternhauser

Edited November 20, 2010 by Sternhauser

[havok579257]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' timestamp='1290122000' post='2187939']
You know, the Israelis do not use these naked type full body scanners.

And I know for a fact that the Orthodox do not stand for aggressive "touching"

So how do they do it?

Why don't we ask them?

They are the experts.
[/quote]


people in america will never go for what isreal does. isreal does profiling which the aclu would be up in arms about as being racial profiling. also to work security for the airports you must have a 4 year bachlors degree. which means costs for us will go up which people will complain about. also the secret service tests the security and if they fail they are fired on the spot in the middle of the airport. the lawyers would have a feild day with that.

it would be ideal if we followed isreal's actions, but it won't happen in america.

[Winchester]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1290273967' post='2188216']
people in america will never go for what isreal does. isreal does profiling which the aclu would be up in arms about as being racial profiling. also to work security for the airports you must have a 4 year bachlors degree. which means costs for us will go up which people will complain about. also the secret service tests the security and if they fail they are fired on the spot in the middle of the airport. the lawyers would have a feild day with that.

it would be ideal if we followed isreal's actions, but it won't happen in america.
[/quote]
They use behavioral profiling and they use former military.

It's been proven that we the people will put up with just about anything. The people who will cry about the Israeli don't really matter and won't do anything but beesh. Because they are wimps.

Here's the thing about the ACLU. Punch them in the stomach and they will go home, cry, and roll up a new fighter character. They are inconsistent liberal swine.

Edited November 20, 2010 by Winchester

[MithLuin]

Also, the number of people moving through Israeli airports each day is [i]much[/i] smaller than the number moving through American airports. I'm not sure behavior profiling is really scalable.

The way it works is that when you arrive at the airport, someone approaches you and asks you a few questions. Some of them may be basic - name, profession, where are you headed today? While others may require more thought or appear random. While some people would be very intimidated by this, the goal is not to see if you answer all the questions correctly. It's to see how you react to being approached by an airport official. If you are nervous/shifty, you raise red flags. There are other checkpoints throughout the airport that you have to pass through, but they try not to let lines build up (since that is an easy target for a suicide bomber). It still takes a good deal of time to reach your gate (just like here), so it's not more efficient by being 'faster' - it's simply more...effective.

I have been on the receiving end of a random question at a checkpoint, and it really freaked out the driver. We were crossing the US/Canadian border at New Years 2000 (it was a time of heightened security prior to 9/11). We were all college students, and one person in the back seat went to University of Maryland. After checking all of our IDs and asking about how long we'd been across the border and where we went to school....the final question was 'And what is a terrapin, anyway?' The driver, who went to RPI, freaked and was like, 'I don't know???' Meanwhile, the people in the back were like, 'It's a turtle!' The driver didn't know it was the UM mascot, and so was thinking it was more like, 'And what is the average velocity of a fully laden swallow?'

It would take a [i]lot[/i] of personnel to have that kind of system at all US airports receiving international flights. However, these new machines must cost a good deal of money, and we are in an economy where people need work. It would be better to train and hire people rather than to have fancy machines, if it is possible.

I know you can say 'don't fly', but some people have to for work. Not all (or anywhere near most) airplane travel is done for pleasure/vacation. And while you [i]could[/i] take a train from DC to Boston rather than fly, you can't really drive to CA in 6 hours from the East Coast. And flying to Europe or Africa is right out.

Personally, I don't want to be groped in order to get onto a plane. Pat downs aren't invasive, and taking shoes off is simply inconvenient (on a few occasions, I have been running through an airport barefoot, carrying my shoes and bag, to reach my terminal on time). Not being able to bring liquids is [i]really[/i] annoying - air travel dehydrates you majorly, because the cabin air has to be recycled during the whole trip. Also, if you are trying to travel with just a carryon, you are very limited in what personal toiletries you can bring along, and will likely have to buy stuff on the other end.

But a great solution is the one Europe is using. Rather than a scan that actually shows the naked body of the passenger (er, victim?), it shows a generic stick figure, and any 'suspicious items' are revealed in more detail. I wouldn't mind someone doing that kind of scan to me.

[Sternhauser]

[url="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40291856/ns/travel-news"]TSA Search Leaves Bladder Cancer Survivor Sobbing, Covered In Urine[/url]

It's only going to get better from here.

~Sternhauser

Edited November 21, 2010 by Sternhauser

[dominicansoul]

...dang it all..


...i've decided i'm going to make a pilgrimmage to the Holy Land next Spring, so guess what???

I'm going to have to go through these scanners and everybody who is around is going to see me nekkid...


...better stay true to my exercise regimen...I want to look good.....

[Norseman82]

Well, it's going to be interesting to see what happens when members of Congress travel back and forth from DC via air. Will they be given a pass? Will they invoke congressional immunity? Or will one congressman be the one that gets upset and calls a congressional hearing?

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Norseman82' timestamp='1290375432' post='2188418']
Well, it's going to be interesting to see what happens when members of Congress travel back and forth from DC via air. Will they be given a pass? Will they invoke congressional immunity? Or will one congressman be the one that gets upset and calls a congressional hearing?
[/quote]

Norseman, they're not like us mundanes. They do not have to go through "enhanced security." Did you not know that?

~Sternhauser

Edited November 21, 2010 by Sternhauser