Communicating With Religious Communities

[BigJon16]

So far in my descernment I've only really contacted one religious order; The Brothers of the Sacred Heart.

Their vocations director contacted me right back right away, and gave me his cell phone number if I wanted to talk to him. I think it was a pretty cool thing to do. It helps me to feel that they are definately open to new "recruits" .

Other than that I've only contacted Brothers from diffferent communities/orders, one from the Legionerries of Christ, and another from a CFR friary in NYC. But i never contacted their orders's vocations director directly.

I'm sure I will have much more experience with this in the future.

[Cherie]

[quote name='HopefulBride' timestamp='1305809521' post='2243555']
Do they do individual retreats Cherie?
[/quote]

For a vocation retreat, or just in general?

In general, sometimes they will accommodate people who would like to make a private retreat. You'd have to contact them and they would work something out, if possible.

For a vocation retreat, they encourage you to come on one of their weekend retreats, because not only is it a good opportunity for you to attend a retreat (because we can all use spiritual refreshment!) but it gives you a great opportunity to see the Sisters and their apostolate "in action," so-to-speak. Sometimes they allow the vocation retreatant to stay a day or two before or after the retreat (because sometimes it works out best for traveling purposes!) and that's a little added "exposure" to the Sisters, if you will. It's great because even on the weekend retreats, (usually you'll be there before the retreat actually starts) the Sisters allow the vocation visitor to eat with them, pray with them, and you get to help prepare for the retreat with them. My FAVORITE retreat for vocation visitors is the Mother/daughter retreat. You get to see so many facets of the Sisters' work in that one weekend, and it's just a BLAST all the way around!!!

[Sarah147]

[quote name='MaterMisericordiae' timestamp='1305733012' post='2243231']
I didn't even think about the possibility of damage to the post office. Perhaps you should shoot them a quick email to Sr. Louise and ask if she received the letter? You don't have to go into detail (I wouldn't want you to disobey your SD), but it might help put your mind at ease.

I sincerely doubt that they discovered you on Phatmass. As Cherie said before, they don't have free access to the internet, so I think you can rest assured that they aren't judging you based on what you write here.
[/quote]





[quote name='CherieMadame' timestamp='1305809270' post='2243554']
At least with the SsEW, I know "snail mail" isn't the best way to contact. The Vocation Directress is also the Sister who schedules the retreats (among other things!), and I know from experience she gets TONS -- and tons and TONS! -- of mail [i]on a daily basis.[/i] Sometimes, because she is so busy, she doesn't open her mail for a while.

If you haven't already, I'd suggest writing an e-mail! You'd get a much faster reply!
[/quote]


Thank you for the encouragement; it just sounds like she is very busy and that snail mail can be delayed very easily.

I will definately email her as soon as I can give her the dates I'm available. There's no point in troubling her if I have to stall her with dates later on. I rather just have it all together and be less trouble. This will teach me to use email in the future...

Edited May 21, 2011 by JoyfulLife

[OnlySunshine]

[quote name='JoyfulLife' timestamp='1305999493' post='2244222']
Thank you for the encouragement; it just sounds like she is very busy and that snail mail can be delayed very easily.

I will definately email her as soon as I can give her the dates I'm available. There's no point in troubling her if I have to stall her with dates later on. I rather just have it all together and be less trouble. This will teach me to use email in the future...
[/quote]

I wouldn't worry about waiting to give dates. I emailed her even though I know I'm not going to be able to get there soon either. She answered some of my questions and we became acquainted. She is really sweet, too.

[Digitaldame]

May I comment from the point of view of the prioress of a small community? We do try to respond promptly to emails and letters but we can get up to 200 emails a day on various subjects and we have only 2 people to answer them. I've often found people fail to take that into account and we can get very irate follow-ups which make one wonder why people wrote in the first place. Replies to vocation enquiries, in particular, can't just be rattled off. They have to be prayed and thought about. It is not unusual for us to get two or three enquiries at a time, which means a large chunk out of an already full day. Add to that some very serious and complicated 'prayer requests' and academic enquiries from research students, and it may be easier for you to see why some communities may need longer to reply than others.

Business correspondence can be time-consuming and can't always be put off. For example, we have just been doing some complicated legal work which has devoured hours of my time and meant I couldn't do other things. We also have an online presence which in itself generates correspondence (we regard that as an important part of Benedictine hospitality but it does make demands on the community). I'm sure other communities could say the same, especially the smaller and poorer ones. Larger/richer communities have more resources at their disposal.

I've posted elsewhere in Phatmass some suggestions about good and bad times to contact communities. For example, many cloistered communities try to keep Lent and Advent as times of greater recollection; the great feasts usually mean less rather than more time available for correspondence, and so on. If you don't get a reply, I'd always suggest the simple approach: did you receive my email? (they can go astray); when would be a good time to write? No one is deliberately trying to be rude: that would be unChristian.

[TeresaBenedicta]

[quote name='Digitaldame' timestamp='1306081304' post='2244479']
May I comment from the point of view of the prioress of a small community? We do try to respond promptly to emails and letters but we can get up to 200 emails a day on various subjects and we have only 2 people to answer them. I've often found people fail to take that into account and we can get very irate follow-ups which make one wonder why people wrote in the first place. Replies to vocation enquiries, in particular, can't just be rattled off. They have to be prayed and thought about. It is not unusual for us to get two or three enquiries at a time, which means a large chunk out of an already full day. Add to that some very serious and complicated 'prayer requests' and academic enquiries from research students, and it may be easier for you to see why some communities may need longer to reply than others.

Business correspondence can be time-consuming and can't always be put off. For example, we have just been doing some complicated legal work which has devoured hours of my time and meant I couldn't do other things. We also have an online presence which in itself generates correspondence (we regard that as an important part of Benedictine hospitality but it does make demands on the community). I'm sure other communities could say the same, especially the smaller and poorer ones. Larger/richer communities have more resources at their disposal.

I've posted elsewhere in Phatmass some suggestions about good and bad times to contact communities. For example, many cloistered communities try to keep Lent and Advent as times of greater recollection; the great feasts usually mean less rather than more time available for correspondence, and so on. If you don't get a reply, I'd always suggest the simple approach: did you receive my email? (they can go astray); when would be a good time to write? No one is deliberately trying to be rude: that would be unChristian.
[/quote]

Well said, and thank you!

[Yaatee]

[quote name='Digitaldame' timestamp='1306081304' post='2244479']
...(excerpt)

I've posted elsewhere in Phatmass some suggestions about good and bad times to contact communities. For example, many cloistered communities try to keep Lent and Advent as times of greater recollection; the great feasts usually mean less rather than more time available for correspondence, and so on. If you don't get a reply, I'd always suggest the simple approach: did you receive my email? (they can go astray); when would be a good time to write? No one is deliberately trying to be rude: that would be unChristian.
[/quote]

...and yet it appears to happen, as a number have described here.

Faced with such an onslaught of emails, snail mail, solicitations, requests for prayer, etc., each house must decide the best way to respond---but they must decide. They should select various appropriate ways to respond and act on them. Not responding at all is really not adequate, and yet appears to happen, and happens fairly often. If a house frequently receives inquiries from unsuitable candidates, usually overage, it is sufficient to state in a printed form, that it has found that candidates beyond -----age do not persevere, and are not considered.

....I have a question of discerners. What do you think about including a small high quality close-up [i]photo[/i] with your inquiry, especially if you're overage? Most unmarried women look far younger than their stated age, I have observed, and a photo shows that you don't have horns! You can sign it on the back, with, 'taken on -----date". Good idea? Bad idea?

[Chiara Francesco]

[quote name='Digitaldame' timestamp='1306081304' post='2244479']
May I comment from the point of view of the prioress of a small community? We do try to respond promptly to emails and letters but we can get up to 200 emails a day on various subjects and we have only 2 people to answer them. I've often found people fail to take that into account and we can get very irate follow-ups which make one wonder why people wrote in the first place. Replies to vocation enquiries, in particular, can't just be rattled off. They have to be prayed and thought about. It is not unusual for us to get two or three enquiries at a time, which means a large chunk out of an already full day. Add to that some very serious and complicated 'prayer requests' and academic enquiries from research students, and it may be easier for you to see why some communities may need longer to reply than others.

Business correspondence can be time-consuming and can't always be put off. For example, we have just been doing some complicated legal work which has devoured hours of my time and meant I couldn't do other things. We also have an online presence which in itself generates correspondence (we regard that as an important part of Benedictine hospitality but it does make demands on the community). I'm sure other communities could say the same, especially the smaller and poorer ones. Larger/richer communities have more resources at their disposal.

I've posted elsewhere in Phatmass some suggestions about good and bad times to contact communities. For example, many cloistered communities try to keep Lent and Advent as times of greater recollection; the great feasts usually mean less rather than more time available for correspondence, and so on. If you don't get a reply, I'd always suggest the simple approach: did you receive my email? (they can go astray); when would be a good time to write? No one is deliberately trying to be rude: that would be unChristian.
[/quote]

Well said I agree. In my early post where I wrote about 5 emails and 2 snail mails to a community who never answered either - this was over a YEAR's worth of time! Surely in a quick email or note somewhere in a year's time is possible! I did wait months in between each communication.

But I do agree communities, especially small ones are busy - I have visited some and do know this. It's just the few who never answer back, and there are a few out there. But I do try to give them the benefit of the doubt that "something came up or happened" but still it is hard to figure them out.

I've also had 2 sad and baffling experiences with 2 different communities where for both of them we exchanged many great emails and even wonderful phone conversations and all of a sudden nothing! No correspondence, no return phone calls and then for one I wrote and asked if all was ok, if they were busy that's fine etc and they wrote a very short and cold-ish email that they were busy and that this sister would write when they could. So I waited about 3 months after no contact and they never answered me - to this day, about 2 yrs later.

The 2nd community was about the same except when I had a visit dates picked out, I wrote to them asking some question and got a very short, unfriendly email. And this sister who was the Mother, was so great on the phone and by email! I had asked something like the amount of days for the length of stay as I didn't see it in prior emails and I got "It was already stated in a previous email." That was it. Hurtful after so many warm and loving emails and phone talks with her! Then where as many orders keep in touch and will check in with you a few days or week before your visit day to make sure all is well and that you are still coming, they never did.

But, thank God, the good communities who try and do answer when they can (even if you are not an acceptable candidate to them) do outweigh the ones who are like this and either don't answer or act strange!

[Yaatee]

[quote name='Chiara Francesco' timestamp='1306100034' post='2244560']
Well said I agree. In my early post where I wrote about 5 emails and 2 snail mails to a community who never answered either - this was over a YEAR's worth of time! Surely in a quick email or note somewhere in a year's time is possible! I did wait months in between each communication.

But I do agree communities, especially small ones are busy - I have visited some and do know this. It's just the few who never answer back, and there are a few out there. But I do try to give them the benefit of the doubt that "something came up or happened" but still it is hard to figure them out.

I've also had 2 sad and baffling experiences with 2 different communities where for both of them we exchanged many great emails and even wonderful phone conversations and all of a sudden nothing! No correspondence, no return phone calls and then for one I wrote and asked if all was ok, if they were busy that's fine etc and they wrote a very short and cold-ish email that they were busy and that this sister would write when they could. So I waited about 3 months after no contact and they never answered me - to this day, about 2 yrs later.

The 2nd community was about the same except when I had a visit dates picked out, I wrote to them asking some question and got a very short, unfriendly email. And this sister who was the Mother, was so great on the phone and by email! I had asked something like the amount of days for the length of stay as I didn't see it in prior emails and I got "It was already stated in a previous email." That was it. Hurtful after so many warm and loving emails and phone talks with her! Then where as many orders keep in touch and will check in with you a few days or week before your visit day to make sure all is well and that you are still coming, they never did.

But, thank God, the good communities who try and do answer when they can (even if you are not an acceptable candidate to them) do outweigh the ones who are like this and either don't answer or act strange!
[/quote]

Very, very difficult. You are well rid of communities that act in such an inconsistent way. It would be very hard, like dating some nice man who drops you like a cold potato.

Fortunately, you have other good choices.

[Nunsense]

Digitaldame - of course, most of us discerners understand that communities are busy - a nun's horarium is very full even without extraordinary things happening, which do every day. And yes, some communities receive hundreds of emails and must prioritise these as well as pray over them.

I think what we are discussing here however, is the communities who fail to respond at all or who have a really bad record of communication of any kind, or who stopped responding suddenly and without warning. These things are unkind and unChristian, even if they don't mean to be. Perhaps, as someone posted on here before, they don't want to hurt feelings by rejecting a person, but it hurts more never to have any response at all, or to suddenly be cut off without explanation.

I personally left two hand-written letters at one Carmel in the US, driving a long distance to hand deliver them. I included a photo, phone numbers, email contact and street address. When I had no response after several weeks from the first letter, I drove this distance again and left another letter at the turn. I never heard back from this community at all -- that was three years ago, so I think they have had plenty of time to pray about it and respond, if they were going to do the Christian thing. Even a quick note saying they were praying for me would have been nice!

The other thing that I do wonder about is what you refer to as the 'online presence' factor. I do accept that perhaps this is considered a necessary part of a community's apostolate - but it will also be instrumental in attracting vocations in this day and age, and although blogs and tweets and FB can be delayed without personally affecting others, email equiries have a real live human being at the other end, who may have had to work very hard to find the courage to even write in the first place and is living in hope/fear/ and expectation of what the reply might be! It is very easy with online communication to dissociate oneself from others and forget that they are not just digital data but people with real human feelings!

I don't think it is simply a matter of impatience either, because most of us know that there are times of less correspondence (or none) during Advent and Lent, and I'm sure we try to be sensitive to the needs of the community as well, but let's face it, not all communities are sensitive to the needs of discerners. This isn't the day of St Benedict, when the applicant is left sitting outside the monastery forever to test their vocation... or it shouldn't be. In St B's day, there was one Church and those who wanted to enter a monastery might have been doing so simply because they wanted a place to live and sleep and eat or because they had no other option, so he had to test them. Today, the testing starts taking place long before one ever gets near the monastery! There are so many options for a person in this world today, and to even consider a religious vocation takes great courage. The sheer effort of will to actually approach communities, even if it turns out that one really isn't called to religious life, requires a leap of faith and trust in God that isn't found in doing anything else because it goes against everything our society preaches today with its attitude of 'self, self, self'.

Of course, I am writing from the perspective of the discerner, and this skews my viewpoint to the receiver's end, not the senders. If I were the one at the other end of the communication chain, perhaps I would also make different decisions but having been in positions of great authority and influence (and very busy) when I worked in the corporate and academic world, I learned that the busiest person has to balance a focus of work vs people. Focusing too much on the work, neglects the people, and vice versa. It's all about prioritising and organisation and certainly not all communities have procedures in place to deal with their vocation enquiries in a timely and courteous manner. Perhaps vocation enquiries need to be regarded as part of the work of the community, to ensure a future?

So, yes, sometimes we do wonder if communities are being truly Christian or not. When the children wanted to come to Jesus and the Apostles thought He was too busy (and important) to be bothered with such as these, He chastised them because He always put people first and He knew what was really important. Personally, I think that there would be less communities in danger of closure if they were more responsive to the needs of discerners. Word of mouth is a powerful thing and most of us on here have either been in community already or have been discerning for a long time - and in this digital age, we share information about communities with each other. When someone says they have been badly treated by a particular community, then others think about this. We all know that what works for one isn't the same as for another, and also that we all have different expeperiences with the same community, but a lot of private emails get exchanged between discerners as a source of information. Those communities that are particularly sensitive to the needs of discerners are widely praised and this can make one consider a possible vocation with that community.

I guess what I'm trying to say in my very longed-winded way (as usual), is that we are human beings, with human feelings. Speaking for myself, I try to use each experience as a way to come closer to God and to try to accept His will but sometimes I say to myself, I wonder what Jesus would have thought of that, or how He would have responded if I had approached Him directly? Interesting thought.

Edited May 23, 2011 by nunsense

[Digitaldame]

Thank you for your responses. I'm sorry that some of you have clearly had bad experiences. I am certainly not trying to defend rudeness (such as not replying in the course of a year or suddenly dropping people), I merely wished to suggest why things might appear worse than I hope they are.

I think communities really do try to put people first but the expectations others have of us can sometimes be a little unrealistic, as I indicated. For example, monasteries are online for various reasons, not [b]just[/b] or necessarily primarily, to attract vocations. One has to make judgements about what is most urgent when one can't do everything one would like. To a discerner, a rapid response is really important and communities are aware of that; but perhaps you should see what also features in a community's inbox as a result of their online presence. Some of that will never be made public, and you will not understand unless/until you become a community member. As I said, vocations enquiries can take a lot of time. Here we try to help [b]everyone[/b] whether they have a vocation to the community or not. I imagine the same applies in other communities.

I agree in theory that work should never come first but if, like us, a monastery is dependent on what it earns in order to exist, there may be times when the need to pay the bills must take precedence. We need to meet deadlines to keep going. Illness in community can also affect things. I only say this to point the difference between what we all agree should happen, and some of the reasons why it may not. Bear in mind also that there may be cultural differences to be negotiated as well — Americans, for example, are usually better at speedy responses than Europeans.

I think I would disagree with Nunsense about St Benedict's recommendation that potential candidates be tested by being kept waiting at the door. Although we've never delayed replying to someone as a way of testing their patience, the way in which some people have written when they have not had a response within three days has been quite revealing! And, I speak from experience here, the candidate who simply wants a quiet home/life of ease has not yet disappeared: we do have to test people, even before they come through the door. Otherwise, the strain on the community and its novitiate can be dreadful.

Finally, I would suggest, don't ask what the Lord Jesus might do, ask what the Lord Jesus IS doing through his humble and inadequate servants, the communities to which you are writing. Sometimes we can be so overwhelmed by the wonderful grace the Lord is offering us when we feel the first stirrings of a vocation that we fail to see him clearly. He is to be sought and found in the most unlikely people and places, even the things that humble us. Just as you have to trust yourself to that grace, you have to trust that a like grace is at work in the people you are corresponding with. I, for one, am very conscious that I will have to answer to God for each and every decision I make and I'm sure (hope? trust?) the same is true of everyone else.

I will definitely pray that you have better experiences and more prompt responses in the future. Please pray for us here, too.

[Nunsense]

[quote name='Digitaldame' timestamp='1306150860' post='2244815']
Thank you for your responses. I'm sorry that some of you have clearly had bad experiences. I am certainly not trying to defend rudeness (such as not replying in the course of a year or suddenly dropping people), I merely wished to suggest why things might appear worse than I hope they are.

I think communities really do try to put people first but the expectations others have of us can sometimes be a little unrealistic, as I indicated. For example, monasteries are online for various reasons, not [b]just[/b] or necessarily primarily, to attract vocations. One has to make judgements about what is most urgent when one can't do everything one would like. To a discerner, a rapid response is really important and communities are aware of that; but perhaps you should see what also features in a community's inbox as a result of their online presence. Some of that will never be made public, and you will not understand unless/until you become a community member. As I said, vocations enquiries can take a lot of time. Here we try to help [b]everyone[/b] whether they have a vocation to the community or not. I imagine the same applies in other communities.

I agree in theory that work should never come first but if, like us, a monastery is dependent on what it earns in order to exist, there may be times when the need to pay the bills must take precedence. We need to meet deadlines to keep going. Illness in community can also affect things. I only say this to point the difference between what we all agree should happen, and some of the reasons why it may not. Bear in mind also that there may be cultural differences to be negotiated as well — Americans, for example, are usually better at speedy responses than Europeans.

I think I would disagree with Nunsense about St Benedict's recommendation that potential candidates be tested by being kept waiting at the door. Although we've never delayed replying to someone as a way of testing their patience, the way in which some people have written when they have not had a response within three days has been quite revealing! And, I speak from experience here, the candidate who simply wants a quiet home/life of ease has not yet disappeared: we do have to test people, even before they come through the door. Otherwise, the strain on the community and its novitiate can be dreadful.

Finally, I would suggest, don't ask what the Lord Jesus might do, ask what the Lord Jesus IS doing through his humble and inadequate servants, the communities to which you are writing. Sometimes we can be so overwhelmed by the wonderful grace the Lord is offering us when we feel the first stirrings of a vocation that we fail to see him clearly. He is to be sought and found in the most unlikely people and places, even the things that humble us. Just as you have to trust yourself to that grace, you have to trust that a like grace is at work in the people you are corresponding with. I, for one, am very conscious that I will have to answer to God for each and every decision I make and I'm sure (hope? trust?) the same is true of everyone else.

I will definitely pray that you have better experiences and more prompt responses in the future. Please pray for us here, too.
[/quote]


Sister - we are all very appreciative that you have taken time to respond here at length to something that actually probably does not really apply to you or your community. Of course, you have seen it from the other side, and have to deal with impatient applicants and those who "feel the first stirrings of a vocation" so your perspective is certainly going to be different than that of those of us who are at this end of the stick - so to speak And since there aren't a lot of other posters in your situation, you probably feel a little against the wall!

I certainly didn't intend for you to feel that you have to defend your community or the way it responds to enquiries - I personally try never to mention a community by name unless I have something really good to say about them, although in the past this has not always been the case. But I have learned over time, that there are always different perspectives to every situation, so maybe I have matured over the years. I certainly hope so. As you say, we all have to answer to God for our actions and decisions, so I hope we are all being as charitable as we can be in doing so.

I think you misunderstood my point about St Benedict, but I will concede that not everyone who applies is doing so out of a sense of true vocation. But one only has to live a little while in religious life to see that it is certainly not a place where one can live "quiet home/life of ease" I think this thread was started, not for the impatient to air their grievances at having to wait for a response (at least this was not my intention when I started it), but more for those of us who have been discerning for several years, and who have perhaps already tested our vocation through the fires to some extent, in an attempt to help each other come to an acceptance of the fact that not all communities are either thoughtful or considerate in their communication practices.

Please do not take any of this personally - perhaps it was more of a call for support from others who have also experience the endless silence of no reply or abrupt cut offs...


it was certainly not directed at any one community in particular and certainly not at a phellow phatmasser!

All of that being said, I actually did manage to make contact with a community on the phone tonight (they are in the UK) and that was a delight for me. This particular community only does snail mail and it had been so long since I sent the letter that I did wonder if it had ever arrived. So I was glad that I found the courage to actually phone, and the response was sweet and also very apologetic - and I was able to understand completely what the delay was, once I had been told. I guess this just proves your point in a way, that there is often a very good reason for a community not to respond in a timely manner. But it certainly is nice to finally know that contact has been established.

And I still think that a year or two is a bit long for any community!! lol

So, I do hope you have not taken offence at this thread. Sometimes we just need to vent to each other.....

[ACS67]

I agree with Sister (Digitaldame) that vocations do need to be tested today. I would say even more so because many people today (myself included) are spoilt, bossy, indecisive, petty, impatient, dreamers,(I could keep going here). So, yes, in my opinion, we need to be tested and the process of purification should already be well underway (because many of us have a LOT to purify), even before entering. Again, just my thoughts and opinion.

[Nunsense]

[quote name='ACS67' timestamp='1306152789' post='2244823']
I agree with Sister (Digitaldame) that vocations do need to be tested today. I would say even more so because many people today (myself included) are spoilt, bossy, indecisive, petty, impatient, dreamers,(I could keep going here). So, yes, in my opinion, we need to be tested and the process of purification should already be well underway (because many of us have a LOT to purify), even before entering. Again, just my thoughts and opinion.
[/quote]


Once again, my comment was misunderstood. I didn't mean that vocations shouldn't be tested at all, only that there should different ways to test them today than in the old days because situation and circumstances are different. I think that sometimes there is an idea that 'testing' has to be some artificial thing that one imposes from without, rather than seeing that everything 'tests' one's vocation, including the way that responses are made, and the reaction to those responses. I guess what I wonder at, are the 'mind-games' that some people think are necessary as part of testing a vocation. Perhaps I can't explain myself well, at least not tonight as I am a bit tired from a full day. Meybe I will try again at some other time....

[Yaatee]

This thread is about the perceived delays in response to inquires about religious communities. Some posters have described what is, to me in this age of communication, inconscionable behavior. Very delayed responses or no responseat all to multiple inquiries over months. This lack of response may be from communities receiving a lot of inquiry, and other communities which are aging and very disorganized and may be dying, although they don’t realize it yet. A delayed response and/or no response is rude and inappropriate.

Unfortunately, it is also very common. My husband does sophisticated computer analysis of medical treatments for HIV and AIDS. He sends in via email the results of his advanced statistical analysis of large data sets of medical research. Often he gets no response whatsoever. He has no idea if the information even arrived. He has to call to confirm.

Two of the fastest growing communities in the US are the Nashville and Ann Arbor Dominicans, have no difficulty with communication. According to the many articles in the lay press and reports of discerners, the vocation team is fully wired with smart phones, and communicates immediately and often with all inquirers. Inquirers are invited to elaborate retreats which are conducted often, offer a lot of exposure to religious life and often a lot of fun. There is a fully orchestrated vocation response. We are all familiar with the results. On the other hand, there is DigitalDame’s community of three, who run an online business and are in the throes of a major capital campaign to build a monastery. And everyone in between.

But most communities are seeking candidates and must try to organize their response to an apparent avalanche of inquiries. A lot of the initial screening can be done with information which can be cut-and-pasted into email or printed cheaply for snail mail. This information can include whether there is a firm upper age limit and what it is, and if candidates are permitted to have annulments, grown children or grandchildren. If there is insufficient sister/nun power, I do think that reliable associates can be recruited to assist with at least the initial responses.

No one is arguing that some sort of testing isn’t involved. And I don’t think that inquirers are less suited than they have ever been. But in Benedict’s day, a man knocked, sat outside, etc., and then was admitted. Now someone inquirers, receives a response (maybe) and then undergoes a long process [i]as an inquirer[/i] which may stretch on for years--before she’s even permitted to apply! Basically, you have to apply to apply. In addition there are all the required psychological and medical tests for the formal application process.

BTW, I do not recommend that inquirers write just to satisfy their curiosity. This is an abuse of a community’s time. There are plenty of former community members here on VS who can answer such questions privately.

In addition, in snail mail, I think that including a self-addressed stamped envelope is a good idea. It shows industry and consideration. Especially if the postage is the correct amount for transatlantic airmail!

[Nunsense]

[quote name='Yaatee' timestamp='1306158619' post='2244845']
This thread is about the perceived delays in response to inquires about religious communities. Some posters have described what is, to me in this age of communication, inconscionable behavior. Very delayed responses or no responseat all to multiple inquiries over months. This lack of response may be from communities receiving a lot of inquiry, and other communities which are aging and very disorganized and may be dying, although they don't realize it yet. A delayed response and/or no response is rude and inappropriate.

Unfortunately, it is also very common. My husband does sophisticated computer analysis of medical treatments for HIV and AIDS. He sends in via email the results of his advanced statistical analysis of large data sets of medical research. Often he gets no response whatsoever. He has no idea if the information even arrived. He has to call to confirm.

Two of the fastest growing communities in the US are the Nashville and Ann Arbor Dominicans, have no difficulty with communication. According to the many articles in the lay press and reports of discerners, the vocation team is fully wired with smart phones, and communicates immediately and often with all inquirers. Inquirers are invited to elaborate retreats which are conducted often, offer a lot of exposure to religious life and often a lot of fun. There is a fully orchestrated vocation response. We are all familiar with the results. On the other hand, there is DigitalDame's community of three, who run an online business and are in the throes of a major capital campaign to build a monastery. And everyone in between.

But most communities are seeking candidates and must try to organize their response to an apparent avalanche of inquiries. A lot of the initial screening can be done with information which can be cut-and-pasted into email or printed cheaply for snail mail. This information can include whether there is a firm upper age limit and what it is, and if candidates are permitted to have annulments, grown children or grandchildren. If there is insufficient sister/nun power, I do think that reliable associates can be recruited to assist with at least the initial responses.

No one is arguing that some sort of testing isn't involved. And I don't think that inquirers are less suited than they have ever been. But in Benedict's day, a man knocked, sat outside, etc., and then was admitted. Now someone inquirers, receives a response (maybe) and then undergoes a long process [i]as an inquirer[/i] which may stretch on for years--before she's even permitted to apply! Basically, you have to apply to apply. In addition there are all the required psychological and medical tests for the formal application process.

BTW, I do not recommend that inquirers write just to satisfy their curiosity. This is an abuse of a community's time. There are plenty of former community members here on VS who can answer such questions privately.

In addition, in snail mail, I think that including a self-addressed stamped envelope is a good idea. It shows industry and consideration. Especially if the postage is the correct amount for transatlantic airmail!
[/quote]


Excellent post Yaatee! I do question the self addressed [u]stamped[/u] envelope just because the stamp needed in one country isn't usually available in another one, and although I vaguely recall something about international postage, I dont' know how this works anymore or how one would calculate the postage required from another country back to one's own! Perhaps there is a solution to this or perhaps just a self addressed envelope would suffice? Perhaps I should research this more.

Tonight I also learned the value of a follow-up phone call after sending a snail mail. It was a lovely phone conversation and I felt so good afterwards. And yes, they did get my letter and they apologized for the delay in responding, so it was good that I phoned - I think it made it easier for them as well as for me!

Thanks for your post - good points about the Nashville and Ann Arbor Domincans. I did send an email to a community in the US that never responded and have now sent a snail mail as follow-up but I think it is a good point in case that communities who do not check their email probably should not advertise it!!

[Yaatee]

[quote name='nunsense' timestamp='1306159634' post='2244849']
Excellent post Yaatee! I do question the self addressed [u]stamped[/u] envelope just because the stamp needed in one country isn't usually available in another one, and although I vaguely recall something about international postage, I dont' know how this works anymore or how one would calculate the postage required from another country back to one's own! Perhaps there is a solution to this or perhaps just a self addressed envelope would suffice? Perhaps I should research this more.

Tonight I also learned the value of a follow-up phone call after sending a snail mail. It was a lovely phone conversation and I felt so good afterwards. And yes, they did get my letter and they apologized for the delay in responding, so it was good that I phoned - I think it made it easier for them as well as for me!

Thanks for your post - good points about the Nashville and Ann Arbor Domincans. I did send an email to a community in the US that never responded and have now sent a snail mail as follow-up but I think it is a good point in case that communities who do not check their email probably should not advertise it!!
[/quote]

Of course they shouldn't advertise their email if they don't answer.

Excellent point about the stamps. You'd need the stamps of the host country (so to speak)--well, talk to the postmaster. There's gotta be a way....

I am very glad that the phone call worked, time change and all!

BTW Nashville has 4 Aussies entering. [i]They[/i] don't have any trouble communicating! CFR has had two Scots postulants-[i]-they [/i]managed to get through!

[ACS67]

I guess I disagree Yaatee (that seems to be all I am doing lately ). Why assume these communities who don't respond are "rude"? They didn't respond for whatever reason (God knows, and he is the final judge) so I say the inquirer should just move on. It seems to me when an inquirer is harping on why they didn't receive a reply, it borders on an attitude of entitlement and if that is the case, than that can only hurt the inquirer were they ever to become a postulant. I'm not accusing nunsense or anyone here of this; however, I do think it is something to consider because this "sense of entitlement" is very prevalant in our society today and often times I'm not so sure we are aware of it, We believe we are entitle to just about anything and everything. I guess I have read too much Eastern Theology and believe as the early Desert Fathers and monks did, and that is, in comparison to God and his glory, and all that He has given to us and continues to give to us, we are all entitled to very little if anything at all. I believe we have to keep our desires in check and should always keep our mortality and sinful condition ever in mind, again a teaching from the early Desert Fathers. We often convince ourselves that our desires are those of God's. That may or may not be the case. Humilty is advised to discern which is which.

In the end only God knows what we are truly entitled to and He will give us that and only that which will bring about salvation to our souls...If we trust Him we will respond accordingly to all that He brings us, the good, the bad, the ugly... That's what I believe.

[ksterling]

I started my discernment by identifying 50 communities that had apostolates that I could fit into. This was before I knew anything about what I really wanted in a community. Once I began to learn, I actively communicated with about 20 communities. I did the same thing as other posters on VS - sent a lengthy, respectful snail mail letter with a photo, a bio and a description of why I thought I had a vocation and where I was in my discernment. My SD reviewed my letter first. Of those, a few didn't respond in a timely manner - some never. I don't know why but if they weren't interested in me, I crossed them off my list. There were about a dozen communities who wrote back or emailed. They were all friendly, interested, encouraging and genuinely happy to have heard from me. Some I crossed off my list after visiting (some readers will recall a disastrous visit I had to a community that had had no new entrants in many years - they were very anxious that I should join but most lived in apartments, prayers at the motherhouse were optional and they had no habit at all - not even an official community pin or cross.) I had a few wonderful visits and got to know some sisters who lived in convents not to far from me. My list is now down to 3 communities, all of which I will be visiting or revisiting over the next few weeks. First impressions are lasting and you don't get a second chance to make a first impression - cliches, but true. Frankly, I don't understand why any community would not promptly respond to a potential entrant. Even if it was Advent or Lent, a short note explaining when a more lengthy response would be forthcoming would be nice - then a follow up at the promised date. I would think that most communities would be thrilled to find that young women are interested and would want to begin to get to know them. The communities I continue to discern with all had that attitude - they were so inviting - I feel like they want me to become their sister. It's much easier to think that a certain community is the right one for you when you feel welcome - not as though you're breaking in. And that starts with the first communication. I know some communities like the NDs and Ann Arbors have lots of applicants but they were both very quick and very nice in communicating with me. Just my 2 cents!

Kat.

[Yaatee]

[quote name='ksterling' timestamp='1306164034' post='2244870']
I started my discernment by identifying 50 communities that had apostolates that I could fit into. This was before I knew anything about what I really wanted in a community. Once I began to learn, I actively communicated with about 20 communities. I did the same thing as other posters on VS - sent a lengthy, respectful snail mail letter with a photo, a bio and a description of why I thought I had a vocation and where I was in my discernment. My SD reviewed my letter first. Of those, a few didn't respond in a timely manner - some never. I don't know why but if they weren't interested in me, I crossed them off my list. There were about a dozen communities who wrote back or emailed. They were all friendly, interested, encouraging and genuinely happy to have heard from me. Some I crossed off my list after visiting (some readers will recall a disastrous visit I had to a community that had had no new entrants in many years - they were very anxious that I should join but most lived in apartments, prayers at the motherhouse were optional and they had no habit at all - not even an official community pin or cross.) I had a few wonderful visits and got to know some sisters who lived in convents not to far from me. My list is now down to 3 communities, all of which I will be visiting or revisiting over the next few weeks. First impressions are lasting and you don't get a second chance to make a first impression - cliches, but true. Frankly, I don't understand why any community would not promptly respond to a potential entrant. Even if it was Advent or Lent, a short note explaining when a more lengthy response would be forthcoming would be nice - then a follow up at the promised date. I would think that most communities would be thrilled to find that young women are interested and would want to begin to get to know them. The communities I continue to discern with all had that attitude - they were so inviting - I feel like they want me to become their sister. It's much easier to think that a certain community is the right one for you when you feel welcome - not as though you're breaking in. And that starts with the first communication. I know some communities like the NDs and Ann Arbors have lots of applicants but they were both very quick and very nice in communicating with me. Just my 2 cents!

Kat.
[/quote]
Excellent post, Kat and from the horse's mouth! [i]An actual discerner [/i]who sounds close to becoming a candidate! Wow! Good luck, and we hope you share with us what the denouement is!--er--where you enter (assuming you do! )