Let's Begin At The Very Beginning...

[organwerke]

[quote name='Yaatee' timestamp='1306004242' post='2244245']
In support of everyone, I must say that the English Carmels aren't making it easy to keep up with them. Perhaps this is deliberate, as things appear to be in such flux.

That said, I can understand a reluctance simply to call them up on the phone. First of all, you may be interrupting them. Then there are the awkward questions.

"Hello. Are you still open? Are you taking candidates? What are you like? What's your horarium? Are you 1990 or 1991?"

It's common politeness to answer email and especially, snail mail. If necessary, a printed response is adequate ( preferably signed!)
[/quote]

I said "call" and could have said "contact" but the problem isn't this, what I was trying to say is that there is the first hand experience of two persons who had contacts with Darlington (very close contacts) and were directed to Preston. You can't say an information is false if you don't know that.
beatitude said "The best source of information on British Carmels are the British Carmels themselves", well: the information of Studium is of a person who had the infromation directly from the Carmel, not internet or other: personal contact.
Hope this is now clearer.

[faithcecelia]

Although the site mentioned has a seperate section for communities that are no longer accepting aspirants, so maybe that would be the best place to put Darlington as it is still open.

I have personally been in touch with 9 of the UK Carmels this year (inc both Preston and Darlington) and have had no problems getting a response from any of them, even if the response was in one case 'heres a reply to tell you I don't have time to reply'!

The only community I personally have had no reply at all from was the Benedictines at both Stanbrook Abbey and Tyburn, although I found out that at that time Tyburn had been told not to accept aspirants so that might have explained it. Either way, I took it as a sign I wasn't meant to be a Benedictine!

[Yaatee]

[quote name='faithcecelia' timestamp='1306005070' post='2244250']
Although the site mentioned has a seperate section for communities that are no longer accepting aspirants, so maybe that would be the best place to put Darlington as it is still open.

I have personally been in touch with 9 of the UK Carmels this year (inc both Preston and Darlington) and have had no problems getting a response from any of them, even if the response was in one case 'heres a reply to tell you I don't have time to reply'!

The only community I personally have had no reply at all from was the Benedictines at both Stanbrook Abbey and Tyburn, although I found out that at that time Tyburn had been told not to accept aspirants so that might have explained it. Either way, I took it as a sign I wasn't meant to be a Benedictine!
[/quote]

Ha! That brings [i]me[/i] up short! It also will make [i]you[/i] the [i]de facto [/i]expert on English Carmels (or most of them!).

...I am sure that you know that Stanbrook has moved into a modern, LEEDS certified monastery --this may explain their non-response --tho' that's a feeble excuse!

Arne you su-ure you aren't called to be a Benedictine?


...why is Tyburn not accepting aspirants? Have they run out of room?

[faithcecelia]

[quote name='Yaatee' timestamp='1306005534' post='2244252']
Ha! That brings [i]me[/i] up short! It also will make [i]you[/i] the [i]de facto [/i]expert on English Carmels (or most of them!).

...I am sure that you know that Stanbrook has moved into a modern, LEEDS certified monastery --this may explain their non-response --tho' that's a feeble excuse!

Arne you su-ure you aren't called to be a Benedictine?


...why is Tyburn not accepting aspirants? Have they run out of room?
[/quote]


Its 6yrs since I was contacting the benedictines. I didn't know the full details re Tyburn, hopefully the problems have been resolved now. Yes, I have seen some lovely photos of the new Stanbrook - Quidenham and Stanbrook have been closely linked for many years with Q's prioress and S's abbess visiting the other community for some weeks back in the 70s I think - there is a lovely photo somewhere of the abbess in a Carmelite habit after her own got caked in mud on a walk!

Yes, definately sure - I go to mass most weekdays at St Cecilia's and while I like their liturgy to some extent, I have no desire to look further there - in spite of their attempts to get me to.

[Studiumecclesiae]

Ok I'll try to explain the situation from what I know. I contacted Darlington when they were facing enclosure and refuse to take me to visit them. T'was when I was after Carmel.

Darlington suffered a number of deaths in a short space of time which dramatically reduced their numbers, at the same time they couldn't replace their chaplain and were forced to go out for Mass.

It was ok for a while, but difficult as the public always wanted to talk to them for ages afterwards. The Parish Church had no grille to protect them, so they couldn't make their thanksgiving and protect their Carmelite separation in peace.
Some sisters found that having to go out into public so much, was not what they believed their Carmelite vocation to be and felt that they couldn't continue. The community seperated.

Some sisters of Darlington decided to transfer to other convents. A small group of about four sisters, decided to remain in a small house in Darlington and continue to go out for Mass.
But the thing to remember is that the community, as it was at Darlington, is not simply living at another address. The community has split and the small house in Darlington is not in a position to accept aspirants. Discerners are now told to contact Preston.

Pax +
StudiumEcclesiae

Edited May 22, 2011 by Studiumecclesiae

[Yaatee]

[quote name='Studiumecclesiae' timestamp='1306089725' post='2244495']
Ok I'll try to explain the situation from what I know. I contacted Darlington when they were facing enclosure and refuse to take me to visit them. T'was when I was after Carmel.

Darlington suffered a number of deaths in a short space of time which dramatically reduced their numbers, at the same time they couldn't replace their chaplain and were forced to go out for Mass.

It was ok for a while, but difficult as the public always wanted to talk to them for ages afterwards. The Parish Church had no grille to protect them, so they couldn't make their thanksgiving and protect their Carmelite separation in peace.
Some sisters found that having to go out into public so much, was not what they believed their Carmelite vocation to be and felt that they couldn't continue. The community seperated.

Some sisters of Darlington decided to transfer to other convents. A small group of about four sisters, decided to remain in a small house in Darlington and continue to go out for Mass.
But the thing to remember is that the community, as it was at Darlington, is not simply living at another address. The community has split and the small house in Darlington is not in a position to accept aspirants. Discerners are now told to contact Preston.

Pax +
StudiumEcclesiae
[/quote]


Very sad situation. I hope it can be resolved soon.

[beatitude]

Hi Studium,

I'm sorry for being snappish with you. I didn't realise that you were speaking from personal experience - I thought you were just going from what you'd read on the Internet. Of course, this is no excuse for irritability on my part.

During my illness I was treated at a hospital in Darlington and I got to know the Carmel then. One of the other patients had a cousin who was considering entrance with them, and I prayed for her and for more vocations to the community. The sisters were preparing to downsize at this point, and her enquiry was definitely being considered - she said nothing to me about being asked to contact Preston instead. Sadly my fellow patient died, and I lost contact with her cousin after that. Maybe I will bump into her in Carmel one day.

Hi Nunsense,

When I wrote about the need to rely on the Carmels themselves for information, I meant personal contact with nuns (letter, phone call, e-mail). There is quite a bit of contradictory information online, which is why I never trust it absolutely. The contact details on UK Carmel's main website are kept very up-to-date, which is the most important thing for me - I see the photos as an attempt to provide a flavour of Carmelite life, not a precise visual representation of who is in the community at any given moment. I know some of the bigger American communities publish current photos of all their postulants and novices, amending them if people leave, but that's not something that's important to me - I don't consider it essential that I know the comings and goings of the monastery.