sixpence Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 I have never heard of LifeTeen... but this article seems relevant... [url="http://catholiceducation.org/articles/history/world/wh0105.html"]Link[/url] A snippet: "What made the Church attractive in the third century can make it just as attractive in the twenty-first. In the ancient world and in ours, young people want a challenge. They want to love with their whole being. They're willing to do things the hard way — if people they respect make the big demands. These are distinguishing marks of youth. You don't find too many middle-aged men petitioning the Marines for a long stay at Parris Island. It's young men who beg for that kind of rigor."
Ash Wednesday Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Good article. (though I don't mind a good nature hike but I know they're just more or less saying things shouldn't be watered down.) In the end, I think history will be the judge and will determine what will work with youth and what won't. Strong parents, family values and family units come into play as well. Parents can't just dump their kids off at religious education classes or youth ministries and leave it all up to them. I don't know how it is with teens now, but with my peers and the kids I knew in the past, for the most part, it was the parents that really laid down the law in the home (but with love) and lived the faith 24/7 whose kids have grown up and more or less stayed with the Church. But a lot of times classmates were just dumped off at the youth group to "keep them out of trouble" but the parents didn't always take them to mass and I don't think religion was actually discussed much in their homes otherwise (my home was a bit of a mixed bag...). And with so many broken families, that makes it hard, too. Prayers for our families and youth...
Brother Adam Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 [quote name='sixpence' timestamp='1308240786' post='2254603'] I have never heard of LifeTeen... but this article seems relevant... [url="http://catholiceducation.org/articles/history/world/wh0105.html"]Link[/url] A snippet: "What made the Church attractive in the third century can make it just as attractive in the twenty-first. In the ancient world and in ours, young people want a challenge. They want to love with their whole being. They're willing to do things the hard way — if people they respect make the big demands. These are distinguishing marks of youth. You don't find too many middle-aged men petitioning the Marines for a long stay at Parris Island. It's young men who beg for that kind of rigor." [/quote] Thank you, I think that article promotes Life Teen. Remember, St. John Bosco juggled for the youth in the streets of his city. You do not have to be a stick in the mud to be a passionately faithful Catholic.
Cam42 Posted June 17, 2011 Posted June 17, 2011 [quote name='Steve' timestamp='1307778980' post='2252302'] First: Thank you tinytherese. Those are some very good points and I do agree to an extent.[color="#7D7D7D"][font="Tangerine, serif"] [/font][/color] QUOTE FROM CAM42: [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"][color="#000080"]"No, do worry about clothes...Clothes have been and will be an important aspect of morality and modesty. The more you cover the less you have to worry about. There are times and places for shorts and t-shirts...Mass isn't one of them. IF we are a "Eucharistic People" (whatever that means) and the Eucharist is the source and summit of our Faith (which it is), wouldn't it only make sense that you would want to put your best foot forward in EVERYTHING? That would include dressing appropriately. Shorts and a t-shirt might be ok for a baseball game or some sporting event, but Mass? Really? It's too much to ask that "the youth" own a pair of slacks, an oxford shirt, and a pair of dress shoes/a nice knee length dress or skirt with sleeves and a pair of flats or some other appropriate footwear? It isn't. Even the poorest kid in America can come up with that....but we're not talking about that extreme are we? We're talking about suburban-ites....How we dress is important...it conveys the seriousness in how we will worship. If you dress in a more serious manner, then the liturgical action lends itself to a more serious atmosphere...and sadly, as has been shown in several youtube videos, vice versa.... I'm not sorry I got that in, it is important. What is some of the "great material" that Life Teen provides. I'd like to see some of it. Is it online? Does it encompass the whole of the Catholic Faith or just the last 40 years? Does it teach about the great patrimony of Holy Mother Church or does it focus solely on the last 40 years? I'd like to know. It provides effective models for ministry... You live in a small town. I don't think so...try coming to where I live. I grew up in a [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humboldt,_IA"]town of 4500[/url]; my brother-in-law grew up in a [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sargeant,_MN"]town of 61[/url]. The towns around mine average anywhere from [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer,_IA"]21[/url]to [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pocahontas,_IA"]1900[/url]. You don't live in a small town. You live in a small city, there's plenty to do... See, that's the problem...Life Teen is about Protestant ideals...social issues and personal relationship with God. How about Life Teen being about promoting and embracing Catholic teaching and catechizing the youth on that? The wheel doesn't have to be re-invented. Young people aren't going to Life Teen. They are going to the Traditional Latin Mass. It's a proven fact. Tradition is winning the day...Life Teen is blase and it is a dated and flawed way of looking at how to minister to the youth. They don't like it. They want tradition. You don't need to "take it down" for your youth, you need to challenge them. We live in the most advanced society in the world. Our youth can handle being taught Catholicism authentically. [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juventutem"]Juventutem[/url] might be a valid option, since Life Teen apparently didn't work. And even though you're giving Life Teen the credit, it isn't going to be in your "small" town next year... Life Teen is flawed and deficient. It runs on a Protestant model and it doesn't work. It does not speak to Catholic mentalities, it speaks to pop culture...that is not a model to base upon, especially when the target is a Church that has outlasted 2000 years of pop culture..." /End Quote[/color][/size][/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"] [/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"]On the topic of dress code: I'm all for showing reverence and respect at mass. I agree that it is important to do so. BUT......[/size][/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"] [/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"]But #1) I brought up the discussion about dress code into response to someone complaining about the dress code at there youth mass, saying that the T-shirts and shorts are specifically a problem. My response to that is that if you're going to call it a YOUTH mass, let it be a LITTLE youth friendly at least. A youth mass should not be just a kid or two doing the readings, bringing up the gifts, collecting and TADA you have a youth mass. Our youth these days tend to not like to dress up. We are dealing with kids who often A)Taught by the world and other Christian churches that there is something wrong with the Catholic Church B) Do not believe in Jesus Christ C) Do not even believe in God. Now I'm not sure if you know this, but the Catholic Church has a certain feeling of unwelcomingness (for lack of a better word) for non-Catholics and heck, even for many Catholics. Part has to do with the fact that to a newcomer the Catholic mass is intimidating. When you add the stuffiness and [/size][/font][font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"]judgmental attitudes present it is a HUGE turn-off for kids that I finally am able to get to come experience the mass. I believe that deep down inside they come in search of God's love and are often met with nothing but judgement by his people. [/size][/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"] [/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"]But#2) In a perfect world, clothes should be the last of our worries when coming before the Eucharist. It would be so much nicer if instead of worrying about clean clothes we should first worry, "Do I have a clean soul for mass?" You are about to receive Jesus when you go to mass. Does he have a nice place to reside? Do you go to confession immediately before receiving the Eucharist? The fact is you can do nothing but impress your fellow parishioners with nice clothes, if that's your goal great. But if you are planning on impressing God I don't think nice clothes are going to cut it. For some reason I don't think that clothes are on any priority list of Jesus'. [/size][/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"] [/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"]Great Material: [/size][/font][url="http://www.lifeteen.com/"]http://www.lifeteen.com/[/url], Website has just about everything they have to offer, and can answer all of your questions for you, if you take the time to look over the resources. I'm sorry, Small city. All I know is that it's big enough to have major gang problems, and small enough to where the "good kids" go hang out at Baskin robins and Mcdonalds. I'm sorry[font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"][color="#595959"] I didn't know that having a personal relationship with God was a protestant thing. I guess I must be at least part protestant than. [/color][color="#0000ff"]"[/color][/size][/font][font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"][color="#0000ff"]Life Teen is about Protestant ideals...social issues and personal relationship with God." [/color][/size][/font][font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"]If you'll remember correctly I said that the Life Teen is all about promoting the Catholic faith and Catechizing the teens. In fact the reason why we are dropping it is because they do so. Our youth can't handle a lot of that stuff. (And for those who can we do have options for them). You'll have to introduce me to these young people who go to the traditional latin mass. I'm sure there are many out there, but it is not our youth.[/size][/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"] [/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"][color="#0000ff"]"especially when the target is a Church that has outlasted 2000 years of pop culture... " [/color]Not sure if you've looked at any statistics lately, but the Catholic Church isn't on an upward slope or even staying constant in numbers. I have faith in God's church, and I know it will prevail, but if the trends WERE to stay constant, I would say the Church would not outlast 2200 years of pop culture. [/size][/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"] [/font] [font="arial, verdana, sans-serif"][size="4"]Lastly, I'm curious.....you know mine, but what are YOU'RE experiences and qualifications with Life Teen, and youth ministry in general.[/size][/font] [/quote] Hi Steve. I'm sorry that I took so long in responding to you, but I've been away. I won't do that again. I will make sure that I am here to respond to your questions and statements toward me going forward. You make a very compelling argument and I must say, I love you. You're right. I was wrong in everything that I said. There is no need to stand on any type of formality when going to Mass. We should just come to Jesus just as we are...it doesn't matter if we spend 15 hours in a bean field, we should come with our dirty boots, and matted down hair. It doesn't matter if we've been swimming, we should just come to Jesus in our swimsuits. Jesus don't care, he loves us as we are. And you're right...at a Youth Mass, the youth should reign supreme. The kids shouldn't feel tied down by all the traditions of the Church. That doesn't make them feel loved. That makes them repress feelings that will come back to haunt them later in life...so I say let's bring out the t-shirts and shorts. I say that tube tops and flip flops should be the norm. You're right Steve. We don't need regression, we need progression in the Church. And dressing up is forcing the youth to be something they are not...so no more I say, no more!!!! You're also right that clothes should not matter when we do Eucharist. Doing Eucharist is about being with Jesus. It isn't about the clothes we wear. I mean when Jesus was crucified, in all likelihood he was either naked or in a loin cloth, so there is no need for the people of God to dress up when they celebrate the Mass alongside the priest!!! They should just come as they are. I was wrong to insist that people show a formal respect by dressing up, because dressing up is so 1950s. It is outdated. Like I said, we shouldn't worry if our boots are dirty or if we are all sweaty from being in the fields toiling over soybeans. We shouldn't worry if we're coming right from a baseball game and are all dusty. Jesus don't care, he loves us as we are... Doing Eucharist is about loving our neighbors...it isn't about making sure our part is perfect in our hair. Loving our neighbor means that we don't worry if the farmer next to us reeks of anhydrous ammonia or UAN. It means that we don't worry about the girl in the tube top and flip flops...we should just hold her hand as we both journey while doing the Eucharist. As for Lifeteen, I've had a change of heart. Lifeteen is a wonderful way for the youth to do God. Doing God with friends and doing Eucharist with friends is important. And learning about God makes them happy, so we should make sure they have a good time....kids relate better when they can do God in their own way. The Church did it for 2000 years, but the youth of today don't understand all that stuff, so we should make sure that we're innovative and that we don't worry about the past. We don't need that to lean on, we're moving forward. Lifeteen is amesome and I think that kids needs to have an amesome time at church....so they can go to their friends and tell them how amesome it was....then when they get confirmed they can take that amesome feeling out into the world in whatever manner they see fit. Because we shouldn't label Jesus...Jesus don't care, he loves us as we are.... Thanks for thinking of me when starting this thread....I love you for that....
Brother Adam Posted June 17, 2011 Posted June 17, 2011 [quote name='Cam42' timestamp='1308325071' post='2255052'] Hi Steve. I'm sorry that I took so long in responding to you, but I've been away. I won't do that again. I will make sure that I am here to respond to your questions and statements toward me going forward. You make a very compelling argument and I must say, I love you. You're right. I was wrong in everything that I said. There is no need to stand on any type of formality when going to Mass. We should just come to Jesus just as we are...it doesn't matter if we spend 15 hours in a bean field, we should come with our dirty boots, and matted down hair. It doesn't matter if we've been swimming, we should just come to Jesus in our swimsuits. Jesus don't care, he loves us as we are. And you're right...at a Youth Mass, the youth should reign supreme. The kids shouldn't feel tied down by all the traditions of the Church. That doesn't make them feel loved. That makes them repress feelings that will come back to haunt them later in life...so I say let's bring out the t-shirts and shorts. I say that tube tops and flip flops should be the norm. You're right Steve. We don't need regression, we need progression in the Church. And dressing up is forcing the youth to be something they are not...so no more I say, no more!!!! You're also right that clothes should not matter when we do Eucharist. Doing Eucharist is about being with Jesus. It isn't about the clothes we wear. I mean when Jesus was crucified, in all likelihood he was either naked or in a loin cloth, so there is no need for the people of God to dress up when they celebrate the Mass alongside the priest!!! They should just come as they are. I was wrong to insist that people show a formal respect by dressing up, because dressing up is so 1950s. It is outdated. Like I said, we shouldn't worry if our boots are dirty or if we are all sweaty from being in the fields toiling over soybeans. We shouldn't worry if we're coming right from a baseball game and are all dusty. Jesus don't care, he loves us as we are... Doing Eucharist is about loving our neighbors...it isn't about making sure our part is perfect in our hair. Loving our neighbor means that we don't worry if the farmer next to us reeks of anhydrous ammonia or UAN. It means that we don't worry about the girl in the tube top and flip flops...we should just hold her hand as we both journey while doing the Eucharist. As for Lifeteen, I've had a change of heart. Lifeteen is a wonderful way for the youth to do God. Doing God with friends and doing Eucharist with friends is important. And learning about God makes them happy, so we should make sure they have a good time....kids relate better when they can do God in their own way. The Church did it for 2000 years, but the youth of today don't understand all that stuff, so we should make sure that we're innovative and that we don't worry about the past. We don't need that to lean on, we're moving forward. Lifeteen is amesome and I think that kids needs to have an amesome time at church....so they can go to their friends and tell them how amesome it was....then when they get confirmed they can take that amesome feeling out into the world in whatever manner they see fit. Because we shouldn't label Jesus...Jesus don't care, he loves us as we are.... Thanks for thinking of me when starting this thread....I love you for that.... [/quote] There are so many things wrong at the root of this post it really needs no defense from Catholics here and it is a waste of a great mind, the person behind which has done and could do so much good for the Church. The worst part about this post is the injustice it does to those who love the Traditional practices of the Catholic faith, like those who run Life Teen parishes. I will pray that it does not turn more people away from the Extraordinary Form or the Catholic faith.
Cam42 Posted June 17, 2011 Posted June 17, 2011 [quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1308330482' post='2255095'] There are so many things wrong at the root of this post it really needs no defense from Catholics here and it is a waste of a great mind, the person behind which has done and could do so much good for the Church. The worst part about this post is the injustice it does to those who love the Traditional practices of the Catholic faith, like those who run Life Teen parishes. I will pray that it does not turn more people away from the Extraordinary Form or the Catholic faith. [/quote] You're absolutely right!!! There are so many things wrong at the root of this post. But I need to be more accepting of other's views, so I am being more accepting of other's views. That is what was intimated to me, so that is EXACTLY what I am doing. Thanks for pointing that out. You're a scholar (pun intended) and a gentleman.
Cam42 Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 Regarding how we are to dress whilst assisting at Holy Mass, I would have you look to Bishop R. Walker Nickless and what he has to say: [quote] We can be immodest in our [b]dress[/b],trying to be fashionable and trendy. We sometimes wear clothes that are dirty or too revealing and immodest even to Mass. Our casual daily summer attire is not appropriate for this great celebration of our faith. Coming to Mass should always be special and we need to dress appropriately for this special time of worship.In our reverence for Christ our Lord,and in our respect for one another,[b]we must not settle for the vice of immodesty as the norm[/b]. The virtues of humility and modesty are gifts of the Holy Spirit,part of what we celebrate this Sunday on the Solemnity of Pentecost. Let us be grateful for these gifts and all the gifts of the Holy Spirit. The gifts of the Holy Spirit are rich blessings;let us use them always for the greater honor and glory of God. [/quote] I think that pretty well backs up my position on how we should be viewing attire for Holy Mass. T-shirts and shorts are not appropriate for "this great celebration of our faith." [url="http://www.courageouspriest.com/category/bishop-r-walker-nickless"]source[/url]
MithLuin Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='MithLuin' timestamp='1307998446' post='2253306'] Certainly, people should be encouraged to dress up for mass. And there are places where it can be enforced - good luck getting into a church in Rome wearing shorts or a sleeveless shirt! Even as a tourist, you will be turned away at the door. But in general, I don't think it's appropriate for us to play fashion police with each other. We don't know if someone was traveling, en route to work, had no clean clothes except this outfit, had to change right before mass because someone threw up on their dress clothes, etc. They made their choices...and then came to mass. They're here now. Great! For daily mass especially, I feel very strongly that it's a 'come as you are' invitation. Dressing up for Sunday mass is nice, and I make the effort to unless circumstances conspire against me. But if someone doesn't think my hair is neat enough...that's kinda sorta their problem. If someone wants to emphasize the importance of respect at mass, including in how we dress, from the pulpit or in a religious ed class, that's fine and good. But what we come to mass for are the sacraments. As long as people understand that...they'll accept the reason for the hoopla of dressing up whether they like it or not. So, there's no need to put the cart before the horse there. Enforcing the details of reverence without encouraging the spirit of reverence in the first place would be...silly. [/quote] No one's disagreeing that's it's a good idea to dress up for mass. The question is...what do you do about it when people show up wearing something else? If everyone in the church is dressed nicely, they'll feel out of place in casual clothes and either won't wear that again or won't come back. If it's widespread, you need catechesis, which this bishop is addressing. If there's a lack of reverence...you have a bigger problem than t-shirts and jackets with sports team logos, and should address [i]that[/i].
homeschoolmom Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 I believe there is a difference between immodest and informal. I agree that immodest clothing-- halter tops, bikinis (sad I even need to mention them in this context), short shorts, etc are immodest and not appropriate. A polo shirt and long cargo shorts are not immodest. You may argue that they are informal, but they aren't immodest.
Archaeology cat Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1307814230' post='2252382'] I do not buy into this. There is and will always be a time and a place for dressing up. Youth still dress up for proms, formals, dances, graduation, special occasions and holidays, going out to dinner, and to impress each other when going out on dates. How important is the mass in comparison to things like this? Now I'm not saying that it's necessary to wear a prom dress or that expensive clothing is necessary for mass, but I don't think putting a little effort into looking nice for an hour out of our week is too much to ask for if we can help it. Taking care into our dress and appearance for mass and worrying about ourselves on the inside does not have to be mutually exclusive. If you are dressing up NOT out of impressing parishioners but to show love, respect and reverence to God, his house of worship, and his mass, then yes, I do think that is pleasing to God. We don't need to dress sloppy, wear shorts and flip flops to mass to be welcoming and attractive to newcomers. I think on the flip side, if someone wants to dress nicely for mass or wear chapel veils or what have you, don't judge them by assuming they are stuffy people that judge you in return for what you are wearing. [/quote] Agreed. And of course here the kids all wear uniforms to school and look nice, so why not look nice for Mass? Obviously I wouldn't think poorly of a person who isn't dressed up - I've definitely worn jeans to daily Mass (and Sunday Mass when I was pregnant). [quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1307890839' post='2252760'] I absolutely agree that kids to view it as graduation, and this is sad. Much of this I blame a combination of things, a combination of both sins and weaknesses in the Church and the darkness and folly of the times in general, like how much we are bombarded with mental consumerist Lady Caca junk food in our day to day lives outside of the brief moments we spend at our parish. As the problem is caused by multiple things, the solution will probably have to involve multiple things. I think as time goes by the Church may undergo what JP2 called a qualitative renewal rather than quantitative for the time being. But it will be interesting to see what happens, as more and more I think the world is becoming hostile and at odds with authentic Christianity. [/quote] I'm really liking that my diocese is putting Confirmation before First Communion again. Maybe it won't be seen as a graduation as much, I don't know.
MissScripture Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='Archaeology cat' timestamp='1308585159' post='2256319'] Agreed. And of course here the kids all wear uniforms to school and look nice, so why not look nice for Mass? Obviously I wouldn't think poorly of a person who isn't dressed up - I've definitely worn jeans to daily Mass (and Sunday Mass when I was pregnant). I'm really liking that my diocese is putting Confirmation before First Communion again. Maybe it won't be seen as a graduation as much, I don't know. [/quote] Where I live I think they do it in about 8th grade, and even that is nice, because they still do religious ed and youth ministry stuff for the kids afterwards, so they are kind of saying, "Hey, you're not finished, yet!" Where I grew up, confirmation was in 11th grade and after that, while they still had some youth ministry things for all the high schoolers in general, any religious ed stuff was just supposed to be with the adults, so it was kind of saying, "Okay, you're an adult now, do what you want."
Cam42 Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='homeschoolmom' timestamp='1308579544' post='2256306'] I believe there is a difference between immodest and informal. I agree that immodest clothing-- halter tops, bikinis (sad I even need to mention them in this context), short shorts, etc are immodest and not appropriate. A polo shirt and long cargo shorts are not immodest. You may argue that they are informal, but they aren't immodest. [/quote] Why would you not want to stand on formality for the King of the Universe? Would you go to a wedding in shorts and a polo? Would you go see the President? Would you go see the Pope (I can answer that one for your already....)? Yet, it's ok to be informal at Mass.....IDGI.
MissScripture Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='Cam42' timestamp='1308589315' post='2256334'] Why would you not want to stand on formality for the King of the Universe? Would you go to a wedding in shorts and a polo? Would you go see the President? Would you go see the Pope (I can answer that one for your already....)? Yet, it's ok to be informal at Mass.....IDGI. [/quote] I can't speak to the Pope and the President, but I have seen people dress very informally for weddings. I do think there are some people who genuinely don't find a problem with the informal thing, and would only dress up more for the Pres. or Pope because it would be required of them, not because they would willingly chose it on their own. I'm not saying that it makes it acceptable for Mass, just that this line of reasoning wouldn't work with a lot of people, because they wouldn't dress up for those other things.
Cam42 Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1308589583' post='2256337'] I can't speak to the Pope and the President, but I have seen people dress very informally for weddings. I do think there are some people who genuinely don't find a problem with the informal thing, and would only dress up more for the Pres. or Pope because it would be required of them, not because they would willingly chose it on their own. I'm not saying that it makes it acceptable for Mass, just that this line of reasoning wouldn't work with a lot of people, because they wouldn't dress up for those other things. [/quote] Shouldn't they be required to dress up for Holy Mass? What would be so wrong with putting that stipulation out there? I don't think any, unless of course, it would cause people to stop going to Mass and if that is the reason they stop going; well the issue is bigger than proper attire for Mass, isn't it? Informality with regard to the Mass is another direct result of the hermeneutic of discontinuity. Bottom line.
MissScripture Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='Cam42' timestamp='1308590004' post='2256342'] Shouldn't they be required to dress up for Holy Mass? What would be so wrong with putting that stipulation out there? I don't think any, unless of course, it would cause people to stop going to Mass and if that is the reason they stop going; well the issue is bigger than proper attire for Mass, isn't it? Informality with regard to the Mass is another direct result of the hermeneutic of discontinuity. Bottom line. [/quote] I don't disagree that people shouldn't be dressing informally. I'm just not sure how practically one could put into effect a measure of formality that wouldn't end up being more of a hindrance to many people. And I'm not sure how that could be objectively applied. I don't think it's just a Catholic thing. I think society in general has a hard time with formal dress, in particular formal dress that is also modest.
Cam42 Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1308590420' post='2256344'] I don't disagree that people shouldn't be dressing informally. I'm just not sure how practically one could put into effect a measure of formality that wouldn't end up being more of a hindrance to many people. And I'm not sure how that could be objectively applied. I don't think it's just a Catholic thing. I think society in general has a hard time with formal dress, in particular formal dress that is also modest. [/quote] If it has to be grass roots, then it should be started by the parishoners of like mind. Find those who are supportive, ask Father to preach about it. Then start to change the culture. It can be done...the culture was changed to the bad, so why not start a change back? Sometimes it comes down to us making the change....when I am not in a cassock, I am a tie and suit coat.
Nihil Obstat Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='Cam42' timestamp='1308591072' post='2256352'] Sometimes it comes down to us making the change....when I am not in a cassock, I am a tie and suit coat. [/quote] Is it a bow tie? [img]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-vsEk8uDcNsM/TffaG7OL9jI/AAAAAAAAAZI/deZ9fcP-6BE/s1600/IMG_0336.JPG[/img]
Cam42 Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1308591400' post='2256354'] Is it a bow tie? [img]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-vsEk8uDcNsM/TffaG7OL9jI/AAAAAAAAAZI/deZ9fcP-6BE/s1600/IMG_0336.JPG[/img] [/quote] Prolly not...I don't look good in bow ties....
Nihil Obstat Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 [quote name='Cam42' timestamp='1308591522' post='2256356'] Prolly not...I don't look good in bow ties.... [/quote] That's a shame.
kujo Posted June 20, 2011 Posted June 20, 2011 Some of ya'll sound like Pharisees when it comes to how austere you expect everyone to be.
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