Us Little 'uns And Our Vocations

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

Okay, so it honestly depends on the person, COMPLETELY. One 12 year old can be a lot more mature than another 12 year old. The sister I just visited with knew when she was in 2nd grade (just like I did), but I've also heard of others who have discerned for a very long time the religious life and then realized they are called to the married life.

I would NEVER push marriage away, EVER. That is the criticism I get a lot from people, and I just want to make sure that everyone knows that I would never push that away.

When I talked to Sister, she told me that the biggest problem that the younger sisters she has seen have encountered is that they have certain ideals in their heads that are not the reality. But lucky for me, I have not set those ideals, the reason I loved it so much when I visited is because I did not get my hopes up and I did not set an expectation, and I came in with the Will of God in my mind.
[quote name='Pax_et bonum' timestamp='1327986919' post='2378124']
I'm writing this as one who was in your position a few years ago; know you have my empathy.
I agree with you that you, as a 12 year old, can be as certain as a 20 year old in your vocation. The 20 year old is not absolutely certain, therefore neither is the 12 year old. Some people say you can't be certain of a religious vocation until you make your final vows, but I think an argument could be made that you can't be absolutely certain until you die. There is a difference between reasonable certainty and absolute certainty, though, so the nun making her final vows can say with reasonable certainty that her vocation is to the religious life. (What we can know with absolute certainty is Aristotle's principle of non-contradiction.)
That having said, there is also a wisdom and maturity that comes with age. I'm not saying just because someone is older, he is wiser or more mature. It doesn't happen automatically; one has to be open to it and cultivate it. I know I'm very different at 18 than I was at 13 which is when I began my discernment, and I'm sure--I hope!--I'll be different at, lets say, 30. You get to know yourself better, and religious life, and you grow in your relationship with God. Time is on your side for this. I always said God gave me the grace to start discerning young because I had, and have, so much work to do!
Remember, dating isn't a bad thing. I personally never felt called to date, but if I had found the right guy, I hope I would have been open to discerning with him. As it was, I don't think the opportunity ever arose.
[/quote]
I agree with this a lot.

[brandelynmarie]

I love our young'uns on here.

[Feankie]

Okay, I'm going to chime in here. As a spiritual director, I would never ever divulge anything. I consider the time I spend with my directees just as private as the confessional -- no absulution of course! I simply can't imagine the SD of a young person divulging information about their time together to her parents. Bad, bad, bad. And unethical.

[i<3LSOP]

[quote name='mysisterisalittlesister' timestamp='1327976836' post='2378021']
I'm 12... etc.[/quote]
Almost thirteen! I can't believe you're getting "so growed up!" I met you in "real life" when you were maybe nine. I'll be thirteen in June too!!!!!!!! Yay for teens!


[quote name='Francis Clare' timestamp='1328026459' post='2378297']
Okay, I'm going to chime in here. As a spiritual director, I would never ever divulge anything. I consider the time I spend with my directees just as private as the confessional -- no absulution of course! I simply can't imagine the SD of a young person divulging information about their time together to her parents. Bad, bad, bad. And unethical.
[/quote]

I know. I don't know how someone could do that... but I've heard of it happening.







.

Edited January 31, 2012 by i<3LSOP

[InPersonaChriste]

[quote name='i<3LSOP' timestamp='1328027030' post='2378301']
Almost thirteen! I can't believe you're getting "so growed up!" I met you in "real life" when you were maybe nine. I'll be thirteen in June too!!!!!!!! Yay for teens!.
[/quote]

My birthday is in June as well. We should have a June party!

[i<3LSOP]

[quote name='InPersonaChriste' timestamp='1328027503' post='2378303']
My birthday is in June as well. We should have a June party!
[/quote]

Yes totally!!!!!!!!!!!!!! JUNE PARTY!

Maybe (I said maybe) that would be a good thread and we could have PMers post the months of their b-days and have dance parties and cake on the threads.


[quote name='brandelynmarie' timestamp='1328024370' post='2378272']
I love our young'uns on here.
[/quote]

Aw, thank you. We love you.

Edited January 31, 2012 by i<3LSOP

[Divine Mercy 9999]

I am so very, very old. I'm not saying what year it was when I was thirteen, although Jimmy Carter was president.

[cmaD2006]

[quote name='Divine Mercy 9999' timestamp='1328034533' post='2378358']
I am so very, very old. I'm not saying what year it was when I was thirteen, although Jimmy Carter was president.
[/quote]

You are old ... I was 5.

[mysisterisalittlesister]

[quote name='Deus_te_Amat' timestamp='1327981312' post='2378085']
No offense, but I will believe you after puberty. Just wait until you get hormones and baby-fever.

That being said, I have been, and will continue to, keep you in prayer.
[/quote] thank you for your prayers, but are saying I shouldn't consider religious life until I'm around 15? Well, it's too late now.

[Deus te Amat]

No, that's not what I said.

Let me put it this way. If my 12 year old cousin came up to me and said she had this guy friend and she loved him and he loved her and they were going to get married, I would smile and get a box of Kleenex ready for the break-up. If my eighteen year old sister wanted to get engaged right out of high school without going to college, I would sit down with her and make her really think about her decision, because at eighteen, there is so much life she has not yet lived, and she cannot possibly understand the consequences such a rushed choice will have.


This is not to say that the two couples mentioned could not end up married. Thats not for me to say. But it is usually the case that such situations either 1) change or 2) end poorly.

Religious life is a seemingly different scenario. This is GOD of whom we speak. I love seeing the zeal you all have, and am so thankful that there are youth like you in the world. But I remember what it was like at your age. I probably would have wanted the religious life then, too, had I known what it was. As it stands, I started discerning at 15, and am now 21. I've been all over the US, to Australia, and to 13 European countries. I've kissed a boy, climbed a mountain, and lived in Rome for four months. I'm about to graduate from college with a Bachelors of Science and some of the best friends in the world.

Yes, it's been seven years since I started discerning and I am finally applying to a community. I would not trade these seven years for anything. God has been with me at every step... But I have come close to losing myself many times in this tumultuous world.

He has given me choices. The choice to date. The choice of a science major. The choice to travel abroad. He's giving me another choice now. Graduate school or Convent? Both are good. Both possess the ability to bring God to the world. Both are very tempting. I could very easily take the "easy way" of graduate school. Believe it or not, it is a VERY tempting option.

Who knows what the next 6 years will hold for you? Who knows what God has in store? There will be boys and trips and pretty things and growth and joy and sorrow.... These will be some of the best years of your life. I implore you [u] Do not close yourself off to God's will because you think you know what it is.[/u] He is waiting to surprise you, if only you can see.

God bless you.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Deus_te_Amat

[i<3LSOP]

[quote name='Deus_te_Amat' timestamp='1328152579' post='2379390']
No, that's not what I said.

Let me put it this way. If my 12 year old cousin came up to me and said she had this guy friend and she loved him and he loved her and they were going to get married, I would smile and get a box of Kleenex ready for the break-up. If my eighteen year old sister wanted to get engaged right out of high school without going to college, I would sit down with her and make her really think about her decision, because at eighteen, there is so much life she has not yet lived, and she cannot possibly understand the consequences such a rushed choice will have.


This is not to say that the two couples mentioned could not end up married. Thats not for me to say. But it is usually the case that such situations either 1) change or 2) end poorly.

Religious life is a seemingly different scenario. This is GOD of whom we speak. I love seeing the zeal you all have, and am so thankful that there are youth like you in the world. But I remember what it was like at your age. I probably would have wanted the religious life then, too, had I known what it was. As it stands, I started discerning at 15, and am now 21. I've been all over the US, to Australia, and to 13 European countries. I've kissed a boy, climbed a mountain, and lived in Rome for four months. I'm about to graduate from college with a Bachelors of Science and some of the best friends in the world.

Yes, it's been seven years since I started discerning and I am finally applying to a community. I would not trade these seven years for anything. God has been with me at every step... But I have come close to losing myself many times in this tumultuous world.

He has given me choices. The choice to date. The choice of a science major. The choice to travel abroad. He's giving me another choice now. Graduate school or Convent? Both are good. Both possess the ability to bring God to the world. Both are very tempting. I could very easily take the "easy way" of graduate school. Believe it or not, it is a VERY tempting option.

Who knows what the next 6 years will hold for you? Who knows what God has in store? There will be boys and trips and pretty things and growth and joy and sorrow.... These will be some of the best years of your life. I implore you [u]Do not close yourself off to God's will because you think you know what it is.[/u] He is waiting to surprise you, if only you can see.

God bless you.
[/quote]

Avvesome. Thank you it was a great post. I am always open to God's will and would llooovvveee to hopefully get married someday...


I've been and done lots of things for being twelve years old: (Sorry about spelling and grammar mistakes)

I've been kissed by a boy when I gave him a "hello hug" and a young Sister was walking by and just shook her head at me and later told me to wear a habit like her and no one bothers you.

I've been to Rome, Venice, Florence, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Hawaii, Flordia, Texas, Montreal, Illinois, Maine, Vermont, Colorado, England, NYC, and a few other places. Oh and I will be going to Canada, Arizona and [i]maybe[/i] Switzerland or France.

I've been to an audience with the Pope, I've surfed on Waikiki beach, I've seen a monk seal, I have sat on a roof watching the sunset, I have been to dance offs and kids parties, I'm known as the fastest girl roller blader at our nearby roller skating arena, I have been on an airplane twenty times in the past four years, I have stood looking up at the Sistine Chapel, I've stayed at a hotel that used to seriously be a castle, I've been to Fatima, I have been to Pipeline where the Beach Boys surfed, I've swum in a waterfall in Hawaii, I've had cow tounge and octopus legs, I have modeled, I have been pickpocketed by gypsies in Europe, I've held a monkey, I've seen a baby seaturtle in a submarine, I've tried many sports and crafts.

I don't want to make it like I'm bragging... but I have been to many different places and done many things.

Edited February 2, 2012 by i<3LSOP

[LaPetiteSoeur]

[quote name='i<3LSOP' timestamp='1328197608' post='2379571']
Avvesome. Thank you it was a great post. I am always open to God's will and would llooovvveee to hopefully get married someday...


I've been and done lots of things for being twelve years old: (Sorry about spelling and grammar mistakes)

I've been kissed by a boy when I gave him a "hello hug" and a young Sister was walking by and just shook her head at me and later told me to wear a habit like her and no one bothers you.

I've been to Rome, Venice, Florence, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Hawaii, Flordia, Texas, Montreal, Illinois, Maine, Vermont, Colorado, England, NYC, and a few other places. Oh and I will be going to Canada, Arizona and [i]maybe[/i] Switzerland or France.

I've been to an audience with the Pope, I've surfed on Waikiki beach, I've seen a monk seal, I have sat on a roof watching the sunset, I have been to dance offs and kids parties, I'm known as the fastest girl roller blader at our nearby roller skating arena, I have been on an airplane twenty times in the past four years, I have stood looking up at the Sistine Chapel, I've stayed at a hotel that used to seriously be a castle, I've been to Fatima, I have been to Pipeline where the Beach Boys surfed, I've swum in a waterfall in Hawaii, I've had cow tounge and octopus legs, I have modeled, I have been pickpocketed by gypsies in Europe, I've held a monkey, I've seen a baby seaturtle in a submarine, I've tried many sports and crafts.

I don't want to make it like I'm bragging... but I have been to many different places and done many things.
[/quote]

And I'm sure you'll do many other really fun and exciting things. Just don't waste these years hoping and pining for the convent. There is so much in life to experience--even more than what you have done already.

Still praying, and always will.

[beatitude]

[quote name='i<3LSOP' timestamp='1328197608' post='2379571']
Avvesome. Thank you it was a great post. I am always open to God's will and would llooovvveee to hopefully get married someday...


I've been and done lots of things for being twelve years old: (Sorry about spelling and grammar mistakes)

I've been kissed by a boy when I gave him a "hello hug" and a young Sister was walking by and just shook her head at me and later told me to wear a habit like her and no one bothers you.

I've been to Rome, Venice, Florence, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Hawaii, Flordia, Texas, Montreal, Illinois, Maine, Vermont, Colorado, England, NYC, and a few other places. Oh and I will be going to Canada, Arizona and [i]maybe[/i] Switzerland or France.

I've been to an audience with the Pope, I've surfed on Waikiki beach, I've seen a monk seal, I have sat on a roof watching the sunset, I have been to dance offs and kids parties, I'm known as the fastest girl roller blader at our nearby roller skating arena, I have been on an airplane twenty times in the past four years, I have stood looking up at the Sistine Chapel, I've stayed at a hotel that used to seriously be a castle, I've been to Fatima, I have been to Pipeline where the Beach Boys surfed, I've swum in a waterfall in Hawaii, I've had cow tounge and octopus legs, I have modeled, I have been pickpocketed by gypsies in Europe, I've held a monkey, I've seen a baby seaturtle in a submarine, I've tried many sports and crafts.

I don't want to make it like I'm bragging... but I have been to many different places and done many things.
[/quote]

LSOP, I don't think this was Deus_te_Amas's point either.

Her point was that God has [i]surprised[/i] her with the many experiences he has opened up to her. She is advising you to be open to the possibility of surprise, because things rarely go as we plan, and knowledge is rarely as firm as it seems. Oscar Wilde once famously said, "I am no longer young enough to know everything," and he makes a valid point. Age doesn't bring doubt, exactly, but it does teach you that the world is more nuanced than it appears sometimes.

It's not that there is a checklist of experiences, and if you can tick lots of the boxes, that means you are very experienced person and you are better placed to make momentuous decisions at a young age. What is important is how we reflect on those experiences and how they shape us. In this sense, a person who has never left their hometown might actually have more wisdom and maturity than someone well-travelled, if they have the capacity to reflect well on the experiences of every day. C.S. Lewis titled one of his marvellous works on Christianity [i]Surprised by Joy[/i], and that cuts to the heart of it - we have to be open to that surprise.

You could die soon. So could I. So could any one of us. A mountaineer who is going up a densely forested mountain doesn't think, "I know that I'm going to reach this summit." All he knows is what he must do for that day, or even that hour - follow the compass, rest, lace and re-lace his boots, put on another layer of clothes, stop and go back, turn, try another route, or keep going forward. Vocational discernment is a lot like this. God gives us tasks in the present moment, and it is fulfilling those well that carries us very naturally into the next stage of our lives, whatever that might be.

Older people on this forum are giving you this advice because they were once in your position and it might be possible for you to benefit from what they say.

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

I really dislike talking about this topic because the whole thing causes confusion on both ends of the spectrum. That is the problem with the internet. I would never push anything away and I am very open, and thanks to the wise older people on this board and the NM of my convent I have learned that waiting is the best thing, not only for me, but for pretty much everyone. You can learn so much in waiting, and I already have.

[mysisterisalittlesister]

[quote name='FutureCarmeliteClaire' timestamp='1328212562' post='2379701']
I really dislike talking about this topic because the whole thing causes confusion on both ends of the spectrum. That is the problem with the internet. I would never push anything away and I am very open, and thanks to the wise older people on this board and the NM of my convent I have learned that waiting is the best thing, not only for me, but for pretty much everyone. You can learn so much in waiting, and I already have.
[/quote]

You just summed up what I was thinking, thank you (:

I still don't think it's wrong to respond to a calling to religious life at a young age. I just can't help loving God and wanting to be a nun (:

[Chiquitunga]

FCC, Praised be Jesus Christ! That is a wise comment. Also, I wanted to apologize for posting in your Carmelite visit thread asking if they'd let you enter earlier/not wait so long. After I posted that I regretted it, as that is really something personal for you.

I've just seen a few women who entered at 17/18 and made their Solemn Profession by 22 or 23 and I think that is pretty great. And a number of Carmelite saints have reached the final goal (Heaven!) by around that age .. eg St. Teresa Margaret entered at 17, died at 21. So I sometimes get slightly annoyed when Carmels deny that to young women today when it used to be pretty common, even until fairly recently (know a few Prioresses who entered in the 70's just after high school)

But yeah, again, it's something totally personal. And personally for me I am having to wait now for a very unique reason, and I've grown and learned a lot from this .. So again God's will in everything!

edit for grammar errors I've been out of school too long!

Edited February 2, 2012 by Chiquitunga

[i<3LSOP]

I understand all of your responses to my earlier post... I don't like talking about this subject, it confuses everyone and makes me walk away from the computer in tears of discouragment.

I love all of you on VS, try and live out your advice seriously, and don't mind waiting. I feel that every day I am growing closer to the Lord, and it's funny because when reading my YouCat... I'll realize something about Religion or the like that I hadn't thought of before and I thank God for giving me that tiny bit of insight.

Religious life is an option for me. It's not a set mode and I am so enjoying my life as much as any 12 y.o! I LOVE LIFE!

I don't dwell on Religious life or anything, actually I don't think about it much. I usually just pray, "Lord, help me to do whatever you want me to do, and grant that I may fufill my vocation now of being a single girl and a good student joyfully."



[b]"God gives us tasks in the present moment, and it is fulfilling those well that carries us very naturally into the next stage of our lives, whatever that might be."[/b]
[b] [/b]
Right now my task is to be a twelve year old girl who obeys her parents, strives for holiness, and does her school work well. I really don't think about the future much, if you look in my journal, it is all about what happened that day, and about funny things in the past that have happened.

Always remember the poem:

I was regretting the past
and fearing the future.
Suddenly my Lord was speaking:
"My name is I AM"
He paused.
I waited. He continued,
"When you live in the past
with its mistakes and regrets,
it is hard. I am not there.
My name is not I WAS.
When you live in the future,
with its problems and fears,
it is hard. I am not there.
My name is not I WILL BE.
When you live in this moment
it is not hard. I am here,
My name is I AM."


God is here now, not in the future or past.

I love ya'll. Thank you for all of the advice and wisdom you give us young 'uns! *hugs for everyone*

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

[quote name='Chiquitunga' timestamp='1328215455' post='2379721']
FCC, Praised be Jesus Christ! That is a wise comment. Also, I wanted to apologize for posting in your Carmelite visit thread asking if they'd let you enter earlier/not wait so long. After I posted that I regretted it, as that is really something personal for you.

I've just seen a few women who entered at 17/18 and made their Solemn Profession by 22 or 23 and I think that is pretty great. And a number of Carmelite saints have reached the final goal (Heaven!) by around that age .. eg St. Teresa Margaret entered at 17, died at 21. So I sometimes get slightly annoyed when Carmels deny that to young women today when it used to be pretty common, even until fairly recently (know a few Prioresses who entered in the 70's just after high school)

But yeah, again, it's something totally personal. And personally for me I am having to wait now for a very unique reason, and I've grown and learned a lot from this .. So again God's will in everything!

edit for grammar errors I've been out of school too long!
[/quote]
Thank you so much. And I did not think anything about your question in my visit thread. Don't worry about it!

[mysisterisalittlesister]

[quote name='Chiquitunga' timestamp='1328215455' post='2379721']
FCC, Praised be Jesus Christ! That is a wise comment. Also, I wanted to apologize for posting in your Carmelite visit thread asking if they'd let you enter earlier/not wait so long. After I posted that I regretted it, as that is really something personal for you.

I've just seen a few women who entered at 17/18 and made their Solemn Profession by 22 or 23 and I think that is pretty great. And a number of Carmelite saints have reached the final goal (Heaven!) by around that age .. eg St. Teresa Margaret entered at 17, died at 21. So I sometimes get slightly annoyed when Carmels deny that to young women today when it used to be pretty common, even until fairly recently (know a few Prioresses who entered in the 70's just after high school)

But yeah, again, it's something totally personal. And personally for me I am having to wait now for a very unique reason, and I've grown and learned a lot from this .. So again God's will in everything!

edit for grammar errors I've been out of school too long!
[/quote] thank you for encouraging us! And I completely agree with i<3LSOP

[mysisterisalittlesister]

Ok, let me just clear this up

All I want to do is follow God's will. AT THE MOMENT it looks like like religious life. I really strongly feel that I'm called, but if thats not God's will, I will not be a sister.

End of story.