Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330392011' post='2393822'] If you are not a Catholic or an Orthodox Christian, then you are a Protestant. Unless you are Anglican, as many Anglicans don't like to be called Protestants. I am an Eastern Christian, an Orthodox hopeful, hoping to become part of the Antiochian Orthodox Church one day. [/quote] I am a Christian...plain and simple...no need for any labels...I have disagreements with Protestants as well as Catholics...I am a follower of Jesus Christ...a born again Bible believing Christian!
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote]I once was a catholic so yeah I can make that claim [/quote] Then you need to fire the person who catechized you...because not too long ago you told me that Catholicism and Santeria are one in the same.
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote]I am a Christian...plain and simple...no need for any labels...[/quote] You say that, yet... [quote].I am a follower of Jesus Christ...a born again Bible believing Christian! [/quote] [img]http://druffhabler.de/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/mass-effect-series-talizorah-appreciation-society-trollface_animation.gif[/img]
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330392260' post='2393826'] ...My philosophy? Really? My leaders? The Sacred Scriptures aren't just something you read in leisure. to understand it, you need the guidance of the Church, who alone is able to interpret it. You don't just sit down and say, "hey, I think that's what it means!" You need guidance to understand it, otherwise, you lead yourself and others astray. [/quote] Where in the bible does it say this? I believe it is the Spirit that guides not the church. Can you back up your claim biblically...I can Edited February 28, 2012 by Louie
Archaeology cat Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330392073' post='2393824'] I once was a catholic so yeah I can make that claim [/quote]Unfortunately, being raised Catholic doesn't guarantee that one truly knows Catholic beliefs any more than being raised in the US guarantees that one knows American history. Misinformation abounds, and is sometimes even taught by those who are in a teaching position. Many Catholics have been taught incorrect information, and this saddens me. But it also means that being raised Catholic doesn't guarantee that one knows the faith. We all benefit from examining things. God bless
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330392406' post='2393829'] You say that, yet... [img]http://druffhabler.de/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/mass-effect-series-talizorah-appreciation-society-trollface_animation.gif[/img] [/quote] I don't get your humor...mockery is not very kind or loving
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote]Where in the bible does it say this? [/quote] .....*headsteeringwheel* Did you just disregard the whole Scripture verse....compilation that I posted? Sigh.[quote]I don't get your humor...mockery is not very kind or loving [/quote] [img]http://www.reactionface.info/sites/default/files/imagecache/Node_Page/images/1310675759912.jpg[/img]
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330392344' post='2393828'] Then you need to fire the person who catechized you...because not too long ago you told me that Catholicism and Santeria are one in the same. [/quote] I said I had family who practiced both...never said they were one in the same...don't go twisting my words around...once again
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote]I said I had family who practiced both...never said they were one in the same...don't go twisting my words around...once again[/quote] I wasn't twisting your words.
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330392788' post='2393835'] .....*headsteeringwheel* Did you just disregard the whole Scripture verse....compilation that I posted? Sigh. [img]http://www.reactionface.info/sites/default/files/imagecache/Node_Page/images/1310675759912.jpg[/img] [/quote] Where did it speak as the church being the only way to interpret the bible..,sorry did not get that from those verses...it's just not there...I'll read over it again and again to see if I can find that there...I'll be back
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote]Where did it speak as the church being the only way to interpret the bible..,sorry did not get that from those verses...it's just not there...I'll read over it again and again to see if I can find that there...I'll be back [/quote] My point was that, as the Ethiopian Eunuch demonstrated, we cannot interpret the Sacred Scriptures on our own. How can we understand, unless someone teaches us? Furthermore, I am not Sola Scriptura. I don't rely on the Sacred Scriptures 100% for all my doctrine. I rely on the Church, the Church Christ founded, not on flawed and false interpretations by people who reject Her. You cannot have Christ without the Church. You can't, period. You cannot be a solitary Christian. The Church is a body, not an amputated limb here and there.
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330393149' post='2393842'] My point was that, as the Ethiopian Eunuch demonstrated, we cannot interpret the Sacred Scriptures on our own. How can we understand, unless someone teaches us? Furthermore, I am not Sola Scriptura. I don't rely on the Sacred Scriptures 100% for all my doctrine. I rely on the Church, the Church Christ founded, not on flawed and false interpretations by people who reject Her. You cannot have Christ without the Church. You can't, period. You cannot be a solitary Christian. The Church is a body, not an amputated limb here and there. [/quote] If I was stranded on an island with no one around...how can I get to heaven? Can I confess with my mouth and believe in my heart or do I need to go to church first? I know you don't believe in the bible as the final authority...that's where you fault...like it or not you are wrong and confused...sorry but the truth at times hurts but it also sets you free...something you need to really really pray about...in spirit and truth...not deceiving yourself...relying on the church is not biblical either...rely on the Lord and His Spirit...not on man made traditions Edited February 28, 2012 by Louie
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) [quote]If I was stranded on an island with no one around...how can I get to heaven? Can I confess with my mouth and believe in my heart or do I need to go to church first?[/quote] In such a situation, to a Catholic, you would recieve baptism by desire. God's grace is truly amazing and you, by no fault of your own, being apart from the body of Christ, seek Him. Yes, you will find Him. But, if you are near and know of the Church, yet reject it, you simply condemn yourself, because you knowingly push the truth away from yourself. [quote]I know you don't believe in the bible as the final authority...that's where you fault...like it or not you are wrong and confused...sorry but the truth at times hurts but it also sets you free...something you need to really really pray about...in spirit and truth...not deceiving yourself [/quote] 1. Bible verse that states that the Sacred Scripture is the final authority 2. Historical evidence that the early Church relied only on the Sacred Scripture as their final authority Edited February 28, 2012 by Selah
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Isaiah 22 is talking about the Messiah not Peter...don't know where or how you got that from this...where you taught that by man or by the spirit of God...answer honestly
BG45 Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330393839' post='2393847'] 1. Bible verse that states that the Sacred Scripture is the final authority [/quote] You know, even as a Baptist I never really got Sola Scriptura. I mean, Deuteronomy 4:2 commands that the word not be added to or taken away from, yet that would invalidate a lot of the Old Testament and the entirety of the New Testament. 2 Timothy 3:16 likewise tells us that all Scripture is God-breathed, but then we come to the argument that recurs in this thread over who decides what Scripture is, because there was still Scripture to be found in the Bible that was written after 2 Timothy. Then Paul says in 2 Thessalonians 2:15, "hold fast to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter", which implies there is tradition alongside the written word (which had yet to be compiled into the Bible). Paul also cites a letter we don't have in the Bible, in 1 Corinthians 5:9-11, talking about his previous letter about not associating with those who are sexually immoral. Let alone other, smaller things, like the word Trinity never appearing in the Bible, nor the word Bible. Or that Luther threw out entire books of the Bible in his Reformation. Luther even seems to acknowledge this problem of relying exclusively on Scripture in correspondence with [url="http://www.archive.org/stream/grisarsluther05grisuoft/grisarsluther05grisuoft_djvu.txt"]Chancellor Bruck in January of 1524[/url], when a prince was asking if it was permissible to take a second wife(due to certain circumstances I can't recall and don't want to skim the letter to see if Luther mentions it); Luther reluctantly said that civil law should have no recourse in the matter, because Scripture did not forbid it. Rather, that the man should examine Scripture and ask his conscience if it was in line with God's will. Edited February 28, 2012 by BG45
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Revelation 3 Â Â Â Â 7Â "And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write, 'These things says He who is holy, He who is true, "He who has the key of David, He who opens and no one shuts, and shuts and no one opens":*Â 8Â "I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it;* for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My name. Â 9Â Indeed I will make those of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie - indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you. Â 10Â Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. Â 11Â Behold,* I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. Â 12Â He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.Â
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='BG45' timestamp='1330395525' post='2393855'] You know, even as a Baptist I never really got Sola Scriptura. I mean, Deuteronomy 4:2 commands that the word not be added to or taken away from, yet that would invalidate a lot of the Old Testament and the entirety of the New Testament. 2 Timothy 3:16 likewise tells us that all Scripture is God-breathed, but then we come to the argument that recurs in this thread over who decides what Scripture is, because there was still Scripture to be found in the Bible that was written after 2 Timothy. Then Paul says in 2 Thessalonians 2:15, "hold fast to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter", which implies there is tradition alongside the written word (which had yet to be compiled into the Bible). Paul also cites a letter we don't have in the Bible, in 1 Corinthians 5:9-11, talking about his previous letter about not associating with those who are sexually immoral. Let alone other, smaller things, like the word Trinity never appearing in the Bible, nor the word Bible. Or that Luther threw out entire books of the Bible in his Reformation. Luther even seems to acknowledge this problem of relying exclusively on Scripture in correspondence with [url="http://www.archive.org/stream/grisarsluther05grisuoft/grisarsluther05grisuoft_djvu.txt"]Chancellor Bruck in January of 1524[/url], when a prince was asking if it was permissible to take a second wife(due to certain circumstances I can't recall and don't want to skim the letter to see if Luther mentions it); Luther reluctantly said that civil law should have no recourse in the matter, because Scripture did not forbid it. Rather, that the man should examine Scripture and ask his conscience if it was in line with God's will. [/quote] Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ.  9 For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily;  10 and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all principality and power. Colossians 2
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 LOL. That's it, Louie. You are officially a self-parody.
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