Gays In Military

[Groo the Wanderer]

thats the point of DADT....oh wait. der fuhrer did away with that huh?

[kujo]

[quote name='Groo the Wanderer' timestamp='1337979422' post='2434810']
thats the point of DADT....oh wait. der fuhrer did away with that huh?
[/quote]

That was not the point of DADT.

[CatherineM]

I remember my dad saying that he didn't care if the guy next to him was wearing lace panties as long as he covered him under fire. That was a pretty big statement for my very old school dad who being gay was practically a contagious illness. I think a gay guy must have been an army buddy or saved his life or something. Now my husband had a really bad experience in the Canadian army with seeing some guys doing stuff, and being propositioned. It shook him up pretty bad.

[kujo]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1338044417' post='2435131']
I remember my dad saying that he didn't care if the guy next to him was wearing lace panties as long as he covered him under fire. That was a pretty big statement for my very old school dad who being gay was practically a contagious illness. I think a gay guy must have been an army buddy or saved his life or something. Now my husband had a really bad experience in the Canadian army with seeing some guys doing stuff, and being propositioned. It shook him up pretty bad.
[/quote]

No offense to your husband, but I really don't understand why that sort of thing would shake anyone up. As a woman, have you ever been traumatized by the advances of a man that you were not interested in? Doubtful, since all you have to do is say "No thank you," and the person will walk away. Same with gay men--I've been "propositioned" by a gay man at a bar once, and all I did was smile and say that I wasn't gay. He said "okay" and moved on.

As for the "seeing some guys doing stuff," I don't know. I wouldn't really want to see any of my heterosexual friends having sex together. Don't really see the distinction.

[thessalonian]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1337794205' post='2434009']
We are talking about the military, correct? Not the Papal Army, or some sort of privately-funded morality police force. I have family and friends in the armed forces, and I've seen and read enough to know that activities that you pious folk would consider "gravely disordered" occur all.the.time.
[/quote]

Everybody does things that are gravely disordered. I have you have. Your "pious folk" comment is simple prejudice. I hardly see myself as pious in the way that you use the term. Many planks in my eye. I admit to grave disorder in my life. Those who don't are doomed to hurt themselves and others. When God's laws are broken we are too. Do you think that those who are in the military and cheat with wives of others in the milatary should be discipled. Why? Are you more pious than them? Things aren't gravely disordered in Catholicism and not gravely disordered outside of Catholicism no matter how much you may think so.

[CatherineM]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338045662' post='2435133']


No offense to your husband, but I really don't understand why that sort of thing would shake anyone up. As a woman, have you ever been traumatized by the advances of a man that you were not interested in? Doubtful, since all you have to do is say "No thank you," and the person will walk away. Same with gay men--I've been "propositioned" by a gay man at a bar once, and all I did was smile and say that I wasn't gay. He said "okay" and moved on.

As for the "seeing some guys doing stuff," I don't know. I wouldn't really want to see any of my heterosexual friends having sex together. Don't really see the distinction.
[/quote]

Yes I have been traumatized by an unwanted advance. You'll have to read my book for details. As to my husband, whatever happened was so traumatic he won't discuss it, and was diagnosed with PTSD from it.

[kujo]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1338093301' post='2435612']
Yes I have been traumatized by an unwanted advance. You'll have to read my book for details. As to my husband, whatever happened was so traumatic he won't discuss it, and was diagnosed with PTSD from it.
[/quote]

Am I reading this correctly: your husband was diagnosed with PTSD after witnessing gay men having sex? That must have been some epic sex!

[Winchester]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338045662' post='2435133']
No offense to your husband, but I really don't understand why that sort of thing would shake anyone up. As a woman, have you ever been traumatized by the advances of a man that you were not interested in? Doubtful, since all you have to do is say "No thank you," and the person will walk away. Same with gay men--I've been "propositioned" by a gay man at a bar once, and all I did was smile and say that I wasn't gay. He said "okay" and moved on.

As for the "seeing some guys doing stuff," I don't know. I wouldn't really want to see any of my heterosexual friends having sex together. Don't really see the distinction.
[/quote]
I don't think she's talking about ordinary "Hey, wanna go out" advances. There are aggressive forms of sexual advances; not all end in rape if the answer is "no".

[CatherineM]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338095797' post='2435636']


Am I reading this correctly: your husband was diagnosed with PTSD after witnessing gay men having sex? That must have been some epic sex!
[/quote]

It was obviously more than that.

[AnneLine]

Catharine, I'll take your word for it.

There are lots of ways to be traumatized, and I'm sorry it happened to him.

Details aren't needed; respectfully, I will pray for your husband and the guys involved

[Anomaly]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338095797' post='2435636']


Am I reading this correctly: your husband was diagnosed with PTSD after witnessing gay men having sex? That must have been some epic sex!
[/quote]I don't think you meant this to sound as bad as it did.

[PhuturePriest]

My goodness, this debate is still going on? I thought we all agreed Kujo and I are right, as always.

[kujo]

[left]I[font="lucida grande, tahoma, verdana, arial, sans-serif"][color="#333333"][size=2] [/size][/color][/font][color=#282828]meant no disrespect, Catherine. I tend to have a sort of [/color][color=#282828]macabre sense of hu[/color][color=#282828]mor, but [/color][color=#282828]making light of your husband's trau[/color][color=#282828]ma was bad for[/color][color=#282828]m. I apologize.[/color][/left]

[CatherineM]

In the scheme of things, his having PTSD is the slight runny nose in his complicated psyche. it is possible though that the trauma was the trigger that brought on his schizophrenia. He had the genetic predisposition, obviously, but it takes a trigger on top of the genes.

No worries. I would have wondered about him too if it was just seeing two guys making out. It's one of the few things he won't discuss with me, so I really don't know what exactly happened.

[Winchester]

Kujo reminds me of me, but hairier.

[EmilyAnn]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338045662' post='2435133']
As a woman, have you ever been traumatized by the advances of a man that you were not interested in? Doubtful, since all you have to do is say "No thank you," and the person will walk away.
[/quote]

I don't know what planet you live on but it sure ain't the same one that I'm on. That works like 0.5% of the time. More often than not they won't take "no" for an answer. I've had bouncers kick guys out of clubs because they wouldn't take "no" for answer.

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1338044417' post='2435131']
I remember my dad saying that he didn't care if the guy next to him was wearing lace panties as long as he covered him under fire.
[/quote]

That's pretty much the general consensus in the military. There are going to be a few that push the limits one way or the other on the issue, but the majority of what I've seen/heard is that as long as people are doing their job right and personal lives aren't interfering no one really cares what goes on in that personal life.

So, to the original questions. Yes and yes. Everyone, no matter their belief system or sexual orientation, has the right to earn a living (a has been stated previously by other posters). The military provides a pretty good one. I don't think believing that someone should be allowed to have a job makes you a bad Catholic.

[4588686]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1338218150' post='2436339']
Kujo reminds me of me, but hairier.
[/quote]

So he's the bear and your the cub?

[kujo]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1338227971' post='2436440']


So he's the bear and your the cub?
[/quote]

I've been told by my gay friends that I would make for a very highly sought after "bear" if I were gay.

Btw, the difference between "bear" and "cub" in the gay world is the same as the difference between the 2 in the wild--age.

[kujo]

[quote name='EmilyAnn' timestamp='1338218160' post='2436340']


I don't know what planet you live on but it sure ain't the same one that I'm on. That works like 0.5% of the time. More often than not they won't take "no" for an answer. I've had bouncers kick guys out of clubs because they wouldn't take "no" for answer.
[/quote]

Really? 0.5% of the time? You sure you don't want to amend that statistic, since it means that if 100 guys hit on you at a bar, less than 1 of them would respect your wishes not to be bothered?