Winchester Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='qfnol31' timestamp='1349743693' post='2491432'] Yeah, that attitude'll fly with those teaching... [/quote] I didn't say it would. It's a the essence of cow rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye' timestamp='1349743815' post='2491433'] How is this advice irresponsible, your telling her lying is ok, as long as it isn't a grave matter. Thats so hollywood. I explained the reason it is a grave matter already, scroll up. [/quote] Please point out where I said it was ok as long as it was not grave matter. Then after that please demonstrate how this particular lie did grave damage to the virtues of justice and charity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 (edited) That, ToJEsusMyHeart couldn't attend class because she was late is not nescisarily her fault, but his or her choice to lie about it was. Edited October 9, 2012 by Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye' timestamp='1349744153' post='2491437'] That, ToJEsusMyHeart couldn't attend class because she was late is not nescisarily her fault, but his or her choice to lie about it was. [/quote] Yes, and that does not demonstrate grave matter. That demonstrates deliberate consent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 I hate hollywood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 there are no double meanings for sin as hollywood tries to twist. Pride is pride and is wrong and is a sin, Anger is wrong and is a sin,Jealousy is worng and a sin, Lying is wrong and a sin. There is no holy lie just as there is no holy lust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [img]http://trollscience.com/image/f/full/431968f7885f69cdf3c02ba8b8b209f0.jpg[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye' timestamp='1349745832' post='2491461'] there are no double meanings for sin as hollywood tries to twist. Pride is pride and is wrong and is a sin, Anger is wrong and is a sin,Jealousy is worng and a sin, Lying is wrong and a sin. There is no holy lie just as there is no holy lust. [/quote] Do you know what grave matter is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToJesusMyHeart Posted October 9, 2012 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 Thank you, everyone who replied. I really appreciate your insights and advice. I ran out of "props" for the day, but I wanted to give a few more to Nihil for his (?) persistence in figuring out why Tab'le thinks the lie was grave matter. I think my sin was only venial, but I wanted to get others' honest opinions too. I especially appreciate the warnings against scrupulosity, since that is something from which I already suffer acutely. Next time, I'll do my assignments ahead of time to avoid the near occasion of this sin. I do certainly plan on confessing this in my next confession (hopefully tomorrow). [quote name='Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye' timestamp='1349743815' post='2491433'] your telling her lying is ok, as long as it isn't a grave matter. Thats so hollywood. [/quote] Tab'le, thank you for your concern, but I did [b]not[/b] get that impression at all. I know lying is sinful. I know I have sinned. The question wasn't if it was a sin or not, but whether I had mortally wounded my soul, severing my relationship with God. The consensus among those here and others I have asked seems to be that my sin was not grave matter, but sinful nonetheless. Thank you all for your help. Pax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToJesusMyHeart Posted October 9, 2012 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 And thanks to Winchester for the laughs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1349746519' post='2491471'] Do you know what grave matter is? [/quote] Dirt from a burial site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1349746938' post='2491477'] Dirt from a burial site. [/quote] No, that is grave sediment. Grave [i]matter[/i] is the partially decomposed stuff inside the coffin. It is considered grave matter up to and including the point of liquefaction, after which it becomes grave juice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 i still don't know how concenting to lying is not a grave matter, like did you say to yourself well i'm going to lie to my teacher and concuct up the lie to tell the teacher, or did you just blurt it out. There is your grave matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye' timestamp='1349747660' post='2491489'] i still don't know how concenting to lying is not a grave matter, like did you say to yourself well i'm going to lie to my teacher and concuct up the lie to tell the teacher, or did you just blurt it out. There is your grave matter. [/quote] You have completely confused grave matter with deliberate consent. You should go back to your catechism and re-read the section on mortal sin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 (edited) so maybe there are various levels of gravety, and i say again that the catechism as far as i'm aware is not an infallible doctrine of faith and morals. Is it ? Concocting up a lie to decieve sounds pretty grave to me maybe not the worst of the worst but to me still grave, as opposed to an assumption or say you accidently just blurt out a lie and realise when you get home you just lied to someone, and even than habitual blurting out a lie could become a grave matter due to frequency or a matter for a medical professional. Edited October 9, 2012 by Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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