I Am Proud Of Myself

[Lilllabettt]

Taking a page out of Icey's book and giving to every half decent post you see eh?

 

 

I take offense sir

 

my posts are wholly decent

Edited April 5, 2013 by Lilllabettt

[Roamin Catholic]

:| what's it to ya? 

 

Don't be so loose with your propping. 

[Slappo]

Maybe they aren't actually engaging in immoral activity, but cohabitating out of financial reasons? Maybe they deny it because they're afraid if they told anyone, everyone would automatically assume the worst? 

 

Sure, they could be doing all sorts of immoral things.  But it sounds like a really gossipy situation.  

 

Whatever the reason may be "someone in a position of authority in the diocese*" cohabitating outside of marriage is scandalous to the faithful of the diocese, especially the young adults.

 

 

 

*I would assume that "someone in a position of authority in the diocese" would either be a volunteer minister active in the diocese in some way, or a diocesan staff member.

[Lil Red]

Don't be so loose with your propping. 

 

you might say that I'm a shameless PDA-showing hussy with my props. . :|

Edited April 6, 2013 by Lil Red

[Basilisa Marie]

Whatever the reason may be "someone in a position of authority in the diocese*" cohabitating outside of marriage is scandalous to the faithful of the diocese, especially the young adults.

 

 

 

*I would assume that "someone in a position of authority in the diocese" would either be a volunteer minister active in the diocese in some way, or a diocesan staff member.

 

Yeah, it's definitely a problem that it's happening...

 

But I think the other side of it that usually gets ignored is WHY is everyone so obsessed with gossiping about it? People have asked them about it and they've denied it, which should be the end of it.  Why are their "friends" who know the truth telling other people? This should be something that's worked out between them and their priest.  

 

And I thought scandal was more like, "oh, look, Good Catholic Chrissy is sleeping with her boyfriend, that must mean it's okay for good Catholics to sleep with their boyfriends!"  That's hardly ever what happens.  What happens is "OMG Good Catholic Chrissy is sleeping with her boyfriend and she won't even own up to it! How terrible is she! Insert more juicy gossip!"  You'd think Christians would be the ones who should be most willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.  

[Lilllabettt]

offtopic.

 

I don't drink (doctors orders) so I have had occasion to be in a bar exactly once.

a couple posts referred to the fact that this happened in a bar as a factor mitigating against it being socially offensive.

So. Am I to take it that people are generally more "hands on" in a bar than they would be in say, an ihop?

 

[beatitude]

I agree with what Basilia and HCF have said here.

I lived with my boyfriend for over a year (back when I had a boyfriend, before I realised my vocation). We told other people it was for financial reasons, and that was true enough - he had a part-time minimum wage job and he could never have rented his own place with that. What we didn't say was why he had taken that part-time job in my area to begin with. I had mental health difficulties at the time, and I needed help. I needed help not just from the paid support worker who helps me with my practical day-to-day living stuff (I have neuro disabilities too), but from someone who could reassure me and sit with me if I felt awful in the night and take me to the supermarket at weird hours (I was often too scared to go out of the apartment when there were lots of people about) and get me to my shifts at work on time so I could still have some semblance of a normal life. He volunteered for all of that and more, and he did a wonderful job. Our relationship was chaste, but I know non-Catholics took it for granted that we were sleeping together and Catholics assumed. I resented that, but I was too ill to make a fuss, and I certainly wasn't going to out myself as being mentally unwell in order to justify myself to people who were gossiping. I shouldn't have needed to. You can't know why people are doing what they do. As Catholics our place is not to look down on anyone, but always give the benefit of the doubt and to lead as far as we can through example.

 

Tufsoles, your list of possible reactions to what you saw - urges to overeat, to have a tantrum, to cut contact with these people - would not have been great reactions even if the couple had been doing something really terrible. They suggest that the couple didn't just offend your moral sensibilities, but they touched a raw nerve somehow. Now, I hate witnessing PDA too - even if it's well within the bounds of what's acceptable in public. Once I was on the train and I saw the guy sitting opposite me rest his hand on his girlfriend's knee. He wasn't passionately fondling her or anything, he only did it for a couple of seconds, but it still made me feel quite anxious and even a little angry at them. The prospect of being stuck in the train with them when they might touch each other again at any moment made it worse. But that was not their problem, it was mine, and I was at least able to see that. Next I had to ask myself why I felt this way. I'm uncomfortable with any suggestion of sexual or romantic contact. I do have some legitimate reasons for that, but I need to be sure that I don't impose my own irrational ideas - however rational they might be as a response to my own personal experiences - on other people. If I feel anxious or angry enough for it to be a problem, I need to remove myself from the situation until I calm down. This is the only way forward.

[Basilisa Marie]

offtopic.

 

I don't drink (doctors orders) so I have had occasion to be in a bar exactly once.

a couple posts referred to the fact that this happened in a bar as a factor mitigating against it being socially offensive.

So. Am I to take it that people are generally more "hands on" in a bar than they would be in say, an ihop?

 

Yes.  Lots of people go to bars specifically to meet people in a super casual atmosphere.  Lots of times on the weekend there can be live music at a bar and people listen and talk over it and do whatever.  It's a little bit different when you're there for a presentation and discussion, but not super different.  TOT happens in bars because they want to take advantage of a super casual atmosphere where people feel comfortable to lower their guard a bit.  Usually that lowering of your guard happens in order to find a date, but it can also happen to get people to talk about things they wouldn't normally talk about, like religion.  

Edited April 6, 2013 by Basilisa Marie

[Tufsoles]

Maybe they aren't actually engaging in immoral activity, but cohabitating out of financial reasons? Maybe they deny it because they're afraid if they told anyone, everyone would automatically assume the worst? 

 

Sure, they could be doing all sorts of immoral things.  But it sounds like a really gossipy situation.  

 

From what I understand they are both well to do but I have no clue.
 

[Tufsoles]

Tufsoles, the fact that you struggle not to have a public meltdown is concerning. It's great you didn't do it this time but are you getting help from a doctor for this problem?

 

It happens but it is due to lot of times that people say that they will help me out esp.my dad. and they fail on their end. I do get counseling for it.

[the171]

He works for the diocese. That can't be "well off."

[Tufsoles]

They run their own business along with the diocesan job that is well to do.

[GeorgiiMichael]

darnit, i'm out of props. but props to Basilisa and HCF. 

 

Props given.

[Roamin Catholic]

They run their own business along with the diocesan job that is well to do.

 

Not all business even make money, especially a lot of it. The fact that they hold second jobs is probably a good indicator that they don't have a large net income off of the business. 

[Tufsoles]

actually it is the other way around in this situation. I know that not all businesses make a ton of money but this person primary job is the diocesan job.  What you stated is usually the case but not this one.

[Roamin Catholic]

actually it is the other way around in this situation. I know that not all businesses make a ton of money but this person primary job is the diocesan job.  What you stated is usually the case but not this one.

 

So the business is making them a large amount of money?

 

I'm just curious on how you know their particular financial situation so well or if we are going off of hearsay. 

[HisChildForever]

They run their own business along with the diocesan job that is well to do.

 

Dude, you're giving us a ton of private information about these people - so let's see that E-mail.

[homeschoolmom]

Tufsoles, it seems to me that this thread was not all that well thought-out. I'm not one to close threads for no reason. Can we all just agree that this was not a good idea and stop talking about these people, please?

[Roamin Catholic]

Tufsoles, it seems to me that this thread was not all that well thought-out. I'm not one to close threads for no reason. Can we all just agree that this was not a good idea and stop talking about these people, please?

 

This I can agree with. Many props to you. 

[MarysLittleFlower]

hmm... here are just my two cents :)

 

Tuf, if in the past you got upset easily and showed it, and in this situation you didn't show it, that's a good thing and an area of growth for you :) I think it's good to remember for all of us that we all have our own struggles and that something can be easy for one person or difficult for another. For example, if a number of people don't get upset at such things, it might be hard for them to imagine what it's like if you do get upset. Personally, I'd feel uncomfortable if it's something unchaste, like if a couple is kissing passionately, and being unmarried: even for the married, I'd say that's not really for the public to see. It seems like this wasn't like that, which is good, - as for what happened, I wasn't there and can't comment. Maybe some would feel comfortable and some would not.

 

I wanted to say something else though... here's an approach that helped me :) Often in the past, when someone was doing something wrong, I'd really feel like I NEED to correct them. I certainly think that there are times when it's an act of charity to correct someone: for example, a priest would be good to correct his parish if something was going wrong. Or to correct a person in Confession, of course this would all be secret and private. However, I think that other times, - for us lay people - it's good to just pray. If we think someone is doing something wrong, just pray for them. (I'm not saying the couple was doing something wrong at this point, I don't know). If they're not doing something *wrong* but it's annoying and bothers you, then pray for your own peace of mind. I'm still learning this.. and it takes a lot to not look at the lives or actions of others - but I think this point was something Mother Teresa talked about :) if you see something that REALLY bothers you, as in something seriously wrong, then pray for the person and offer a sacrifice for them, that would do much more good :) don't talk about them, which could easily be turned into gossip. If you can say a correction calmly and simply, and if it's from charity and not from a sense of pride or annoyance, then pray about doing that well. :)

 

Friends I think maybe it might be best if we don't ask questions about the couple, if they are cohabitating, and how we know this, etc, - imagine if they walked into this conversation! :( if they are not living chastely, then those who know for sure can pray for them or give them some information on Church teaching if they are unaware of it. Sometimes in our day, as we know, people are unaware.

 

Tuf, it's helped me to keep more of my peace of mind, and be less tempted to judge others or criticize them or get openly upset, to simply focus on praying for the person and showing them charity. I'm really still learning this btw. I fail a lot. But I think - try to see God in each person, and that would give you more peace, - if something upsets you, pray and continue following God in your life, if you can say a suggestion charitable and our of charity with good intentions (I realize we never truly know our full intentions, neither do I, even right now, but we can will certain things and not will others) - then do so very gently. Speak to them with love and they will see it. Maybe ask a priest about doing this and whether or when it's appropriate. Many times, it's good to pray - for our own reaction, or for the person if they are sinning. If they're not sinning, pray for your own peace of mind more and to not get distracted. Certain actions mignt be imperfect but we are not perfect either, and still sin :) we can be patient with each other, and with ourselves too.

 

God bless :)

Edited April 6, 2013 by MarysLittleFlower