Transgender Woman Prepares To Enter Carmelite Convent

[Hemma]

Please note that the Deaconesses of the early church are not to be understood as female Deacons. As far as I'm informed.

 

@Rose: I would be interested in the name of the German ex-carthusian nun or the original title of her book! Thank you:)

[MarysLittleFlower]

I'm also a bit confused as to whether the article means that Tia is a transgendered person, or intersex. There's a difference between someone being born as a male and then trying to obtain female characteristics through surgery etc,, and someone who was born with characteristics of both genders, assigned a male gender just out of custom, and then it turned out that she's actually female and went through hormone therapy as a treatment. I'm not going to say anything about Tia particularly though - I don't know the situation, and I'm not her spiritual director, and only God knows the soul. I hope that everything will work out the way it should according to God's Will. :)

 

am I correct in understanding that if someone is intersex and decides to join a religious order, that would not be an impediment if the gender they describe themselves to be, is their true gender? My understanding is that the impediment is if someone tries to say they have another gender than the one they physically have..? (because of the relation of body and soul and because gender has a physical component and is not only interior, as many modern people seem to think).. any thoughts on this? (not commenting on Tia here, only in general)

Edited August 10, 2014 by MarysLittleFlower

[mantellata]

If you look at the article you will see that she is the one who wrote the article... so there can't be media "spin" only her own view...

[DemonSlayer]

Looks like she has a Youtube channel, not intending to watch any of the videos, but she calls herself a transexual and there are time lapse videos of her turning male to female...  :unsure:

https://www.youtube.com/user/TSLittleMermaid/videos

Edited August 25, 2014 by DemonSlayer

[dairygirl4u2c]

so what if someone is born half female and half male? can they pick whether to be a priest or a nun?

[veritasluxmea]

No one is born half male or half female. You either have a XY or an XX chromosome pair. DNA testing can tell which one. 

[CrossCuT]

Nah, some people have XXY, XYY, XXYY...etc. Im being Serious.

Edited August 25, 2014 by CrossCuT

[veritasluxmea]

Nah, some people have XXY, XYY, XXYY...etc. Im being Serious.

Yep, you're right, but they still are male/female, because those disorders can only affect males or females. For example, all the ones you listed affect only males.

[Ice_nine]

Yep, you're right, but they still are male/female, because those disorders can only affect males or females. For example, all the ones you listed affect only males.

 

says you? your initial claim was wrong, why should I believe this one?

[Clare Brigid]

No one is born half male or half female. You either have a XY or an XX chromosome pair. DNA testing can tell which one. 

 

Say hello to the guys.  Every one of these ladies is XY.  They have Complete Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome (CAIS):

 

Edited August 26, 2014 by Clare Brigid

[veritasluxmea]

says you? your initial claim was wrong, why should I believe this one?

You should take it at face value; please do your own research. I recommend online medical sources backed by universities. As an example from another source,

 

 

Because people with an XXY chromosome arrangement have a Y chromosome, they are considered genetic males. ... And a small proportion will develop as intersex (between male and female) or female. 

 

  http://learn.genetics.utah.edu/content/disorders/chromosomal/klinefelter/

 

Say hello to the guys.  Every one of these ladies is XY.  They have Complete Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome (CAIS):

 

Thank you for directing me towards that syndrome as well.

 

Reading back over my post, I want to apologize for my off-the-cuff remark. It was incorrect and I was thoughtless to post it without thinking or researching further over the matter.

 

I still believe, and so far I have not encountered anything that scientifically contradicts my belief, that people are born with male or female chromosomes and are genetically male or female. (Personally I believe it may be better for some people, at their and their doctor's discretion, to live a more female-oriented lifestyle in society, although that does not make them female.)

 

The discussion that has followed has been enlightening and I'm glad to learn more about chromosome disorders beyond Down's syndrome. Thank you Phatmass for turning ignorance into an enlightening thread :) 

[Gabriela]

So far as I'm aware, there are still several Carmelite houses that take the vow of consecrated virgins together with the other vows.

 

I discerned with the Carthusians and was told that sisters have the option to take the vow of consecrated virgins, but that it is a personal choice. I was told nothing about the deaconess bit, and no sister in the house I was in (for three weeks) ever read the Liturgy of the Word or gave a homily. Priests were brought in for homilies (delivered outside of Mass). This of course doesn't mean that these things don't happen, but I'm pretty confident they don't. The Carthusian houses are quite uniform, and they have changed A LOT since VII. I was frankly shocked by how much had changed...

Edited September 4, 2014 by curiousing

[savvy]

 

Correct me, If I am mistaken, but an intersex person could become a religious brother or a sister, but not a priest, since Holy Order is a physical sacrament. Religious life on the other hand, is a deeper participation in our baptismal vows through the Evangelical counsels, that one day we will all share in.

 

 

[superblue]

This is the longest running debate and I am wondering what if anything anyone is taking from it,  I appreciated the responses to my questioning the mental aspect of transgender / homosexuality,  in that what I found out from the answers is at one point in history there was a medical classification which eventually was ditched for what ever reason one might want to speculate.

 

At this point in time is this particular debating dancing around why genders can only either become A or B in service to the Roman Catholic Church in regards to Religious Orders and the priesthood, or is it going to morph into can an artificial intelligence that becomes self aware and acknowledges that there is the God we all know and acknowledge , that in turn can that A.I being become a Religious or Priest ?  Or better yet, since there might be intellectual ETs some where in our own Galaxy and beyond, and in turn if we manage to bridge space travel, and those beings know of God/ Christ, and if they agreed and believed in the Roman Catholic Church and the Holy Fathers authority over the Church as successor of Peter, can these ETs  thusly become Priests and Religious and serve in a Parish here on earth an beyond ?And also what if those ETs do not have a set gender of male and female as we know or do not reproduce as we do but reproduce Asexually, does that mean that being can not be a Priest ?

 

More over, with the Mars one project underway, to colonize Mars,  What if one wants to Worship Christ in the form of the Mass here on Earth, does the Vatican thus need to send a Priest to Mars, to serve and  perform the Mass for those colonists or are the Catholic Colonists who might end up on Mars if this project actually works, is it just too bad so sad for them ?

 

 

 

Edited September 6, 2014 by superblue