Your Office Is Calling: Learning The Do

[BarbTherese]

Here is a question I never thought of before: Are we to be praying the Office aloud? I'm usually alone & so that wouldn't be a problem & I can imagine in public places one would pray silently out of charity...but I just realized I always read/pray it silently...thoughts? :bible:

 

Hi BM.........I pray it aloud and alone seated in front of my little prayer space 'altar' with candle lit.  Personally I have found that praying the Office aloud does mean that I keep my concentration better - but this would vary I would think from person to person.  For a few years it was the opposite and I found praying the Office silently worked for me with no problems re concentration.

In public places and still praying alone, I carry with me always the Little Office of Our Lady as it fits easily into handbag etc.  I pray it then silently.  Travelling by bus always, I very often have time to pray an Hour from the Little Office with a Rosary and sometimes even a Chaplet of Mercy.   I try always to remember too to bless myself if the bus passes a Catholic Church keeping in mind "whoever proclaims Me before men, I will proclaim him before My Father in Heaven"............I will need all the Merciful proclaiming I can Hope for, I know.

[marigold]

I know, but I'm quite serious. There is a swelling of anti-religious feeling here, spurred on by the "religion of peace"'s antics and generic secularism. "Fighters" returning from Syria &c. are being arrested; there is talk in government of taking away their passports, their families' passports (the vast majority of them are 1st or 2nd generation immigrants) and there are moves to remove children from such families and place them into state care (which I would not wish on anyone, even with my disgust of Islam).

 

Now people are generally unable to make distinctions because every religion is like the other, so if I'm praying on a train I make sure a 'secular' book is also visible. And, Heaven help me, I've noticed I sometimes bob my head back and forth whilst praying the psalms.

 

I used to cover my head all the time, but there's no way I'd do that now. Life is pretty weird here.

 

:offtopic:  (sorry)

 

I know how you feel, PP. But the current situation has had the opposite effect on me - where I used to feel slightly embarrassed about praying, for example, pre-communion prayers on the train to Liturgy, these days I think '**** it!' and whip my prayer book out with boldness. And I used to hate covering my head anywhere outside the church building, but now I do it gladly because it is a sign that Christ IS the victor - and if I'm honest, because part of me that used to shy away from 'evangelising' is now prepared to do so because I have courage from those of us being martyred as we write. Rather than feel that people can't distinguish between religions, I feel that now that Islam has 'shown its true colours' we have a greater and better opportunity to be different. Perhaps this is how radicalisation happens...

 

As to the passport confiscation - no, it's not brilliant on a human rights level, but I think if you're hopping on a plane to go chop up some minorities then you've sort of already waived your right to being treated like any other law-abiding citizen.

[brandelynmarie]

I know, but I'm quite serious. There is a swelling of anti-religious feeling here, spurred on by the "religion of peace"'s antics and generic secularism. "Fighters" returning from Syria &c. are being arrested; there is talk in government of taking away their passports, their families' passports (the vast majority of them are 1st or 2nd generation immigrants) and there are moves to remove children from such families and place them into state care (which I would not wish on anyone, even with my disgust of Islam).

Now people are generally unable to make distinctions because every religion is like the other, so if I'm praying on a train I make sure a 'secular' book is also visible. And, Heaven help me, I've noticed I sometimes bob my head back and forth whilst praying the psalms.

I used to cover my head all the time, but there's no way I'd do that now. Life is pretty weird here.

:offtopic: (sorry)

My apologies, I thought you were half-joking. :blush: It sounds...surreal & scary.

However, y'all feel free to go "off topic" as needed. I don't mind at all. :)

[puellapaschalis]

A woman got beaten up because she hung an Israeli flag in her window.

Jews have had to move, and their synagogues have been vandalised.

People walk around here with ISIS flags and shirts, and give them to young kids to wave about.

So far five people have been arrested for recruiting young men (and probably some women too) to go and fight in Syria; they're also the people who organise marches - pretty close to where I live - where they chant things about sending Jews back to the sewer where they came from.

A seminarian went to Mass wearing a Ù† t-shirt and was verbally abused by some Moroccans.

 

There is bravery, and there is prudence.

[brandelynmarie]

:ohno:

[brandelynmarie]

Ok, I'm throwing out a question for anyone to answer...why is the Office of Readings movable? I always thought of it as a preview of the next day, so to speak & was done late at night...

Edited September 16, 2014 by brandelynmarie

[puellapaschalis]

In St. Benedict's Rule, and in the pattern of the breviary in the West that developed so heavily upon it, Matins (or Vigils) is done at night. It's the night office and has a separate structure from the day offices, etc. It later became acceptable for Vigils to be anticipated on the evening of the day before, i.e. Tuesday Vigils would actually be sung on Monday evening after Compline.
 
Then the post-Vatican II changes came, and with it the innovation (amongst others) of 'Readings'
 

....while retaining its nocturnal character for those who wish to celebrate a vigil, is now of such a nature that it can be said at any time during the day... Ap Const, The Canticle of Praise §2

Since

 

 

As expressly required by the Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy account has been taken of the circumstances in which these days priests have to perform their work of the apostolate. CoP §1

 

That, I think, is the short answer. The citations are taken from the Apostolic Constitution which is in the front of Volume I of my copy of The Divine Office (yeh, you made me dig it out from the back of a bookcase!), where the General Instruction on the Liturgy of the Hours is also included, replete with references to Scripture and various Vatican II documents.

 

Does this help?

[brandelynmarie]

Omgoodness, yes! Fascinating info :). You are very knowledgeable & this is a good explanation...thank you :blush:

[CountrySteve937]

Just though I'd share this http://www.lulu.com/us/en/shop/rev-samuel-f-weber-osb/hymnal-for-the-hours/paperback/product-21799513.html

 

Its the official Latin hymns of the LOTH translated into English, set to chant and is approved. 

 

Unfortunately, in the US our Breviary doesn't have them, but has replacements.

 

Pax

 

 

[CountrySteve937]

Another post, I wish I could afford this :(

 

http://www.paracletepress.com/antiphonale-romanum-ii.html

 

Sunday Vespers in Latin Gregorian Chant!! Maybe someday!

[puellapaschalis]

The Solesmes books really are beautiful. I hope you can get a bunch someday and get Sunday Vespers up and going soon!

[CountrySteve937]

The Solesmes books really are beautiful. I hope you can get a bunch someday and get Sunday Vespers up and going soon!

 

Thanks! I've tried talking to my Priest about it in the past, maybe I should try again!  Though I can't chant worth nothing  :hehe:  

Do you use any of the Solesmes books for Office/ Mass?

 

 

 

Pax 

[puellapaschalis]

Thanks! I've tried talking to my Priest about it in the past, maybe I should try again!  Though I can't chant worth nothing  :hehe:  

Do you use any of the Solesmes books for Office/ Mass?

 

 

 

Pax 

 

Before I became a trad I used the Solesmes books for Office, and their Graduale for Mass if it was being done properly (yea, I'm a snob and say it's not being done properly if it's not Gregorian or Palestrina) and I was singing.

 

These days if I sing the Office I use the Antiphonale that Solesmes published in 1934, but it's not often that I'm able to: on my own I use the Diurnal or Breviary, and if there's Vespers at church then they use the Romanum, not Monasticum, and there are slightly differences. If I'm singing at Mass then I just grab one of the Graduales from church, and they seemed to get published by various places.

 

I will say, though, that it's easier to get Vespers up and running, sung or no, with the newer LOTH than the old pattern. You just get a group, hand them out books or booklets or whatever, make sure there's at least one person on each side who knows what's going on and whom everyone else can follow, and away you go! The rubrics are a little more involved with the older books.

Edited September 18, 2014 by puellapaschalis

[marigold]

I loved Sunday Vespers at the monastery. Everyone would go off and read/nap/walk/pray after Liturgy and the whole afternoon would be blissfully silent and relaxed. Then the bell would go for Vespers and it'd be short and sweet (no long sections of psalms as during the week) and everyone would be singing and focusing better because we were all rested. Slice o' heaven.

[CountrySteve937]

Before I became a trad I used the Solesmes books for Office, and their Graduale for Mass if it was being done properly (yea, I'm a snob and say it's not being done properly if it's not Gregorian or Palestrina) and I was singing.

 

These days if I sing the Office I use the Antiphonale that Solesmes published in 1934, but it's not often that I'm able to: on my own I use the Diurnal or Breviary, and if there's Vespers at church then they use the Romanum, not Monasticum, and there are slightly differences. If I'm singing at Mass then I just grab one of the Graduales from church, and they seemed to get published by various places.

 

I will say, though, that it's easier to get Vespers up and running, sung or no, with the newer LOTH than the old pattern. You just get a group, hand them out books or booklets or whatever, make sure there's at least one person on each side who knows what's going on and whom everyone else can follow, and away you go! The rubrics are a little more involved with the older books.

 

Can't go wrong with the Benedictine Office! I wish there was one set to the OF calendar (nothing against the EF Mass/Office, I love them dearly, just can't attend the EF regularly) 

[CountrySteve937]

Before I became a trad I used the Solesmes books for Office, and their Graduale for Mass if it was being done properly (yea, I'm a snob and say it's not being done properly if it's not Gregorian or Palestrina) and I was singing.

 

These days if I sing the Office I use the Antiphonale that Solesmes published in 1934, but it's not often that I'm able to: on my own I use the Diurnal or Breviary, and if there's Vespers at church then they use the Romanum, not Monasticum, and there are slightly differences. If I'm singing at Mass then I just grab one of the Graduales from church, and they seemed to get published by various places.

 

I will say, though, that it's easier to get Vespers up and running, sung or no, with the newer LOTH than the old pattern. You just get a group, hand them out books or booklets or whatever, make sure there's at least one person on each side who knows what's going on and whom everyone else can follow, and away you go! The rubrics are a little more involved with the older books.

 

Can't go wrong with the Benedictine Office! I wish there was one set to the OF calendar (nothing against the EF Mass/Office, I love them dearly, just can't attend the EF regularly) 

[puellapaschalis]

There is though - that's what the Solesmes houses use (the ones that have the NO, I mean). You'd need those three books I mentioned upthread, the Congregation's Ordo, and a bit of patience. A Novice Mistress/Master helps ;)

[marigold]

Do any of you sing when you pray the offices privately?
If so, are there standard melodies (e.g. in Gregorian chant) and if so, how did you find them, learn them, etc.? Are they similar to things you would sing in church during mass?
If not, how do you choose what melodies to use? Are there guidelines or is it a free for all?

*liturgical music spree*

PP I already read your remarks about singing - would love to read more. (Basically you can't go wrong for me today because you said Torygraph.)

[puellapaschalis]

Do any of you sing when you pray the offices privately?
If so, are there standard melodies (e.g. in Gregorian chant) and if so, how did you find them, learn them, etc.? Are they similar to things you would sing in church during mass?
If not, how do you choose what melodies to use? Are there guidelines or is it a free for all?

*liturgical music spree*

PP I already read your remarks about singing - would love to read more. (Basically you can't go wrong for me today because you said Torygraph.)

 

You flatter me, marigold....

For the psalms, there are various modes - chanting patterns - a psalm can be sung to. There are eight, but many have slight variations in the endings so there are a few more than that. Attached is the pdf I use as a crib sheet; I originally found it on the musica sacra website here.

 

Which tone you chant a psalm to depends on the antiphon that accompanies the psalm at that moment. If the melody of the antiphon is in mode I, the psalm will be chanted in mode I, &c. The antiphons are found in the books, and the age of the melodies ranges: could be 8th century, could be the 1950s. 

 

Hymns have their own melodies. Chapters (short readings) are chanted to a simple pattern, as are the collects. The openings and endings have their own simple melodies that you memorise after having done it about twice.

 

It's tricky to do it all fully, especially if you're on your own. Singing everything on a very simple recitation tone is fine. Singing is good.

[CountrySteve937]

Do any of you sing when you pray the offices privately?
If so, are there standard melodies (e.g. in Gregorian chant) and if so, how did you find them, learn them, etc.? Are they similar to things you would sing in church during mass?
If not, how do you choose what melodies to use? Are there guidelines or is it a free for all?

*liturgical music spree*

PP I already read your remarks about singing - would love to read more. (Basically you can't go wrong for me today because you said Torygraph.)

 

I usually chant Matins recto tono.  Lauds I chant using Gregorian chant  and sometimes Vespers. There is the Mundelein Psalter which gives simply Psalm tones. Though English chant is beautiful, it still can't compare to the Latin! I remember reading something from a carthusian monk about the reasons why they still observe choir rubrics and chant when praying in private. The reason is simple; the rubrics and chant are not for the congregation, its for God. Rather we are in community or private, the Opus Dei should be prayed with as much reverence as possible.

 

 

Pax