MarysLittleFlower Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 JessieL, I don't think you're a troll but the views you have expressed about religious life seem to come from a lack of experience of knowing orders or Sisters. I've met various Sisters and they are actually among the kindest and most joyful people I've ever met. As for St Dominic - corporal mortification (causing bodily discomfort) is simply part of our Catholic tradition. There are lay Saints who did this too. Its not some creepy thing where you like how pain feels like. Its an attempt to share in Christ's suffering or to learn to control the passions without them controlling you. Same reasons you fast by the way. Tgere are also tons of restrictions placed on it.. Like it needs to be done with the advice of a spiritual director who moderates it so it doesn't ruin health or lead to pride. Its also not as graphic as you'd hear about from uninformed sources. Most people would just do this for moderate discomfort not intense pain or anything. St Dominic did a lot of penance more than most people like he also prayed at night and fasted a lot. And he was one of the most joyful gentlest people - others were uplifted just looking at him. He was the type of person you'd want to know if you just saw them on the street. Any disagreement with penance comes more from our day and age than anything else. If St Dominic was harsher with someone who did something wrong that was to help them repent. I read in detail how he was described by others as a joyful charitable man. And the thing to remember about penance is that it should only be done with direction and to grow in love for God, not pridefully or wrongly. Many directors told the Saints to do less penance to not ruin their health but how can we judge the Saints. They were people inflamed with love for God. And God only asks for love. A lot of things get less scary as we grow in love but He doesn't even ask for extreme penances, just for our love and our will. So do people do these penances today? Some do. Some nuns do too. Most don't. Nashville Dominicans probably don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarysLittleFlower Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Just to add... Does God ever ask for penances? Its not as if He likes to see us suffer. But He wants us to learn to love. He doesn't want any penance without love. He asks us all for certain things... Accepting and offering to Him the suffering that we get in life. Spiritual penances like being joyful and kind with people we dislike. He asks for fasting through the Church. He might ask for little penances from Christian souls in general. Really He cares about the love in it not so much the penance itself. So many Saints did more extreme things because they had so much love that they wanted to offer more suffering for souls and to understand Christ's suffering more. Their love was from Him and that's what pleased Him in this. Its not about the pain itself at all. If they wanted to do too much then their priest would usually tell them to do less so they don't ruin their health. But most people are not asked of such things and again God only cares about how our penances help with virtue because that is what they are ordered to, so its not about the amount but how its done. Perhaps this is a common thing to struggle with today because of modern ideas on suffering and also because people associate it with other non virtuous types of inflicting discomfort or pain. That's very different. If you give up a chocolate bar you want and offer the sacrifice to God for an unbelieving friend, think of St Dominic doing same thing just more extreme. But the reasoning is the same. And it has nothing to do with liking pain. If it still bothers you, just remember that most are not drawn to this at all, and more importantly that in the end God looks for love and virtue and we can use small penances for this too like giving up things we want or spiritual penances. Sometimes that can be even harder! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarysLittleFlower Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Well, I'm not even sure what 'troll' means so I hesitate to declare that I am not one. But for the record, I have not always been Catholic so I may have gotten this bad attitude that way. I probably am sounding too harsh...but from my POV, it feel like I am losing someone I care about. So a lot of this is probably selfishness on my part and trying to find a good reason for her not to go off somewhere that I just can't imagine going. Don't understand why she can't 'love Jesus' and still stay around here where all the people she loves and who love her are. Going to confession on Tuesday BTW... Hi Jessie if it helps I'm a convert too How long have you been Catholic? I'd encourage you to keep learning about the Church. I started off thinking Catholics are not Christian and worship Mary and believe in earning salvation without grace. So I had much to learn more than you. I saw that... all the things I didn't like in the Church came from misunderstanding of them. Anyway I'll try to explain it from the point of view of someone who wants to be a nun too. If I was entering an order and someone asked me why can't I just love Jesus and stay in the world with my friends I would say this: "God made us for Himself and to do His Will because that is what is best for us. He made me for a specific purpose. I want to fulfill this and do His Will. I love my friends but we are ALL called to love God first - with all our and mind and strength. If He wants me in a convent then that is how my soul can love Him best. That is then how I was created. If I stayed here I wouldn't be able to love Him more, even if you can. Anyway I would only suffer. My heart wants to go and be alone with Him and to listen to Him alone. Like Mary, I want to sit at His feet and listen. These things I'm giving up I love too and they are good things but at the same time, it causes me suffering to remain here. Its like wanting to be alone with your Beloved. If you married a man and your house was further away wouldn't you still go? Would you choose your husband or your friends? If you wouldn't choose your friends over an earthly husband how could I choose my friends over God?" That would be my response but what is in her heart might be similar... Being drawn to religious life might be difficult to understand if you don't feel it yourself. I probably wouldn't understand it if I wasn't discerning too. Its something very interior. But you can still try to understand it in ways even if you have another vocation Edited June 14, 2015 by MarysLittleFlower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarysLittleFlower Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Hi Jessie if it helps I'm a convert too How long have you been Catholic? I'd encourage you to keep learning about the Church. I started off thinking Catholics are not Christian and worship Mary and believe in earning salvation without grace. So I had much to learn more than you. I saw that... all the things I didn't like in the Church came from misunderstanding of them. Anyway I'll try to explain it from the point of view of someone who wants to be a nun too. If I was entering an order and someone asked me why can't I just love Jesus and stay in the world with my friends I would say this: "God made us for Himself and to do His Will because that is what is best for us. He made me for a specific purpose. I want to fulfill this and do His Will. I love my friends but we are ALL called to love God first - with all our and mind and strength. If He wants me in a convent then that is how my soul can love Him best. That is then how I was created. If I stayed here I wouldn't be able to love Him more, even if you can. Anyway I would only suffer. My heart wants to go and be alone with Him and to listen to Him alone. Like Mary, I want to sit at His feet and listen. These things I'm giving up I love too and they are good things but at the same time, it causes me suffering to remain here. Its like wanting to be alone with your Beloved. If you married a man and your house was further away wouldn't you still go? Would you choose your husband or your friends? If you wouldn't choose your friends over an earthly husband how could I choose my friends over God?" That would be my response but what is in her heart might be similar... Being drawn to religious life might be difficult to understand if you don't feel it yourself. I probably wouldn't understand it if I wasn't discerning too. Its something very interior. But you can still try to understand it in ways even if you have another vocation Typo - love God with all your *heart and mind and strength. My phone skips words sometimes when I type on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marigold Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Thought about posting this on the vocation side but didn't want to insult anyone. A very good friend of mine said she wants to be a nun and frankly I think she is crazy. I mean I'm Catholic but not like that. The whole thing where you couldn't see your family and had to give up all your stuff and do ANYTHING they tell you to do always kind of rang cult warning bells in my head. And I'm worried that my friend isn't getting the whole story from the nuns that she's talking to. I'm willing to reconsider my ideas but could someone explain to me why religious orders aren't cults when other groups that do the same things are? Hi Jessie, welcome to Vocation Station! I'm pleased you take so much concern for your friend and are trying sincerely to understand what she is doing. Go you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessieL Posted June 14, 2015 Author Share Posted June 14, 2015 Well...actually...I would like to visit. When I looked at the website I did think it was really nice and I started to want to go to the retreat. But then I started thinking I would get brainwashed and my dad would freak out if he knew I wanted to go and the whole thing seemed so insane that I convinced myself that there was something wrong with them. So it turns out that this thread wad purely selfish and I am not the nice concerned citizen that I seemed like. Going to spend about anhour in Confession...won't be bothering anybody again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarysLittleFlower Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Hi Jessie, welcome to Vocation Station! I'm pleased you take so much concern for your friend and are trying sincerely to understand what she is doing. Go you! I think its an honest concern for a friend too. Jessie I hope the responses people have made have maybe helped some of your fears about your friend? If not don't be afraid to ask more questions or keep seeking more info on this. Honestly its not as it might look you might love the Sisters if you get a chance to meet them! I'd encourage you to Edited June 14, 2015 by MarysLittleFlower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarysLittleFlower Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Well...actually...I would like to visit. When I looked at the website I did think it was really nice and I started to want to go to the retreat. But then I started thinking I would get brainwashed and my dad would freak out if he knew I wanted to go and the whole thing seemed so insane that I convinced myself that there was something wrong with them. So it turns out that this thread wad purely selfish and I am not the nice concerned citizen that I seemed like. Going to spend about anhour in Confession...won't be bothering anybody again Jessie I like your courage in admitting this but you're not bothering if you ask questions. Don't feel like you're unwelcome here now. Come and ask any questions! I do think though the Sisters themselves would be more ideal to help sort out any concerns. Just meeting them could help. I've met several orders and there was 0 brainwashing, no one tried even a little to 'get me' to join, a Mother Superior even said she would still help me discern if I'm called to some other order. The same goes if someone might have another vocation. If your dad is scared maybe you could just reassure him that you want to understand what your friend is choosing and just be there for her. I mean if *you* were discerning yourself it might be a different answer but if you wanted to see it for your friend, thats something else. I have married friends who love going to monasteries for prayer retreats and things. Its not even all vocational retreats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luigi Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Jessie - See the thread (also in Vocation Station) called "15 Warning Signs." It does a good job of explaining the difference between a cult and a religious order. It also acknowledges that orders, if not set up and run according to the ancient traditions of the Church, can become cult-like. But I doubt that you or your friend will find any of those Warning Signs associated with the Nashville Dominicans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheresaThoma Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Don't feel like you are bothering us at all with your questions. As you may have notice we like answering questions (I think the biggest issue around here is to get us to "shut up"). It is hard when you have a friend doing something that you don't quite understand. I have friends in religious life and a friend who is serving as an overseas missionary. We don't see each other very often and sometimes even letters are limited. This does change our friendship a bit but for me it has deepened those friendship because it is something we both have to work at. The relationship becomes more intentional. As an added bonus when you need prayers you practically have a whole army of prayer warriors praying for you! Also FYI a troll is someone who posts a question just to cause trouble and controversy. (Kind of like a sibling teasing/tormenting you just to get a big response from you). From what you have said I really don't think you fall into that category. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marigold Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Hi Jessie if it helps I'm a convert too How long have you been Catholic? I'd encourage you to keep learning about the Church. I started off thinking Catholics are not Christian and worship Mary and believe in earning salvation without grace. So I had much to learn more than you. I saw that... all the things I didn't like in the Church came from misunderstanding of them. Anyway I'll try to explain it from the point of view of someone who wants to be a nun too. If I was entering an order and someone asked me why can't I just love Jesus and stay in the world with my friends I would say this: "God made us for Himself and to do His Will because that is what is best for us. He made me for a specific purpose. I want to fulfill this and do His Will. I love my friends but we are ALL called to love God first - with all our and mind and strength. If He wants me in a convent then that is how my soul can love Him best. That is then how I was created. If I stayed here I wouldn't be able to love Him more, even if you can. Anyway I would only suffer. My heart wants to go and be alone with Him and to listen to Him alone. Like Mary, I want to sit at His feet and listen. These things I'm giving up I love too and they are good things but at the same time, it causes me suffering to remain here. Its like wanting to be alone with your Beloved. If you married a man and your house was further away wouldn't you still go? Would you choose your husband or your friends? If you wouldn't choose your friends over an earthly husband how could I choose my friends over God?" That would be my response but what is in her heart might be similar... Being drawn to religious life might be difficult to understand if you don't feel it yourself. I probably wouldn't understand it if I wasn't discerning too. Its something very interior. But you can still try to understand it in ways even if you have another vocation Just get thee to a nunnery already! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marigold Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Well...actually...I would like to visit. When I looked at the website I did think it was really nice and I started to want to go to the retreat. But then I started thinking I would get brainwashed and my dad would freak out if he knew I wanted to go and the whole thing seemed so insane that I convinced myself that there was something wrong with them. So it turns out that this thread wad purely selfish and I am not the nice concerned citizen that I seemed like. Going to spend about anhour in Confession...won't be bothering anybody again I hope you have a good confession! And also that you come back and chat to us because I think a lot of us are interested in this conversation and helping you work things out. Not in a brainwashy creepy way, mind but I've been quite freaked out by nun stuff from time to time, and still am occasionally. It is a way of life that is radical and turns things upside down, that's why it's so vital to Christianity. So come and air your concerns! We're much better than the rest of the internet for this kind of stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sr.christinaosf Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Wow...I'm sorry such misconceptions are out there about religious life! It's a joy to "give up stuff" and obey (do "what they tell you") - obviously nothing that is sinful. Say, I'll throw something out there in case you're interested. I started a blog about our life (I am a Franciscan sister) and it has some reflections on religious life that might give you a little insight. You can check it out - for what it's worth in your journey of coming to terms with your friends decision: https://ourfranciscanfiat.wordpress.com/. Also, why not talk to her about her decision and ask her to explain where she's coming from. I can speak for myself that as I learned more about this life of total dedication to Christ, I saw the beauty of it and my desire for it blossomed. One more thing, you can pray for your friend and for yourself. Edited June 14, 2015 by sr.christinaosf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessieL Posted June 14, 2015 Author Share Posted June 14, 2015 Don't have a friend...no sense in you guys praying for a nonexistent person. So I guess I am a troll; one with psychological problems some of which stem from the fact that being a nun was my dream until I discovered all this stuff. I am furious and I feel cheated and betrayed. Don't worry this will be the last time I come here and you can delete my logon if you want. Or even delete this thread. That's probably the best option. I am seriously going to go to Confession and then I will try to get my life back together. Hope the nun thing goes well for you guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabriela Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 You exist, so we will pray for you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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