What Is The Most Important Thing?

August 27, 2003

The solution is the Holy Catholic Church. I'm a part of it, Bush isn't. Therefore Bush isn't part of the solution, he's part of the problem.

Well, Bush's little brother Jeb is Catholic I think. I'm pretty sure I read that in the newspaper today.

August 27, 2003

Iron Monk,

According to the U.S. Department of Labour's website (an agency of the Bush administration) unemployment has risen every month since March of this year. I'm afraid that Good Friday was right on this point (and others, I suspect). This is not a ploy of the "liberal media" or of the "democrooks". Its a fact. Does it mean Bush is evil? No, but he's not perfect either. I think that Good Friday's central point is right on: neither party is more the "catholic" party than the other. Please, use your faith to inform your politics. Conservative economics is not neccessarily "Catholic". Pro-life is good. Truly Pro-life is better.

peace...

Unemployment has been declining....

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t07.htm

The bottom line... if someone votes for someone other than a prolifer who actually has a chance to win then you might as well have voted against prolife....

-ironmonk.

August 27, 2003

Jobs have been increasing? HA! No way!

The economy is awful and I know many talented, educated people who are out of work right now.

If jobs are increasing in your area, let me know. I'll move.

An added thought: With the child tax rebates Bush gave, the low income families did not receive any of that. Low income families need the money, therefore they buy things, putting the money back into circulation, which in turn strengthens the economy. I think it's amusing that higher income people were given the money instead...they are more likely to put it in the bank, where it helps noone.

Show us some data...

August 28, 2003

Makes you wish the Catholic church would just rule the world. B)

August 28, 2003

Makes you wish the Catholic church would just rule the world. B)

Yes.... If there was a real Catholic country (I can't move to the Vatican), I would save up for the move.... Maybe I should search south america? Once I find one, I'll learn the language, then move.... it should be developing, so my computer skills would come in handy

Guys,

sorry if I was a bit harsh... but I think the most important thing in the world right now is to stop abortion... Nothing on earth makes me more angry than abortion. If the Church sanctioned it, I would be a one man crusade against them all...

Everything else falls into second... once the babies are safer, then we worry about the best way to handle the small stuff.

God Bless, Love in Christ & Mary,

ironmonk

August 28, 2003

Iron Monk,

I am a bit confused, your link clearly shows that the unemployment rate is climbing, slowly yes, but climbing.

Please explain.

peace...

August 28, 2003

GO IRONMONK!!!!!!!!!!!

i don't do my hw like him, im just like, yeah he's right... he'll prove the point and i can go to sleep happy

Pax et Amo Christi!

August 28, 2003

Bush's tax cuts do help the majority of Americans... They stimulate the economy... It takes years to see the effects of presidential tax policies... our poor economy is due to clinton.

I'm willing to drop the tax cut issue for two reasons: 1) I don't know enough about it; 2) it's not my main problem with Bush. I didn't even mention Bush's tax cuts in my original post, on a different thread, which had nothing to do with tax cuts. It had to do with unjust war. So I simply won't be discussing the tax cuts anymore. But I do disagree with you.

We ARE NOT destroying the earth... The earth is not some fragile egg... 30 volcano's erupt every year... One volcano puts more CFC's in the air than we can do in 10,000 years... The hole in the ozone has ALWAYS been there... New Ozone is created EVERY second, the Sun's UV rays create Ozone when they hit oxygen.

I'm sorry, Ironmonk, but I tend to trust scientists a bit more than you and the Bush Administration. If you can give me a wealth of scientific information proving that the environment is not at risk (and not just an article or two), then I will re-evaluate my position. Otherwise, I will not. Nevertheless, my original post had nothing to do with the environment, it had to do with unjust war.

Bush is not an idiot. Anyone who says that he is, is a fool.... and is comparable to Jack Chick because they say things without checking.

Would you like me to cite his many grammatical errors? How about his many geographical errors? He is a total idiot, I've read the errors he's made.

C'mon Speech, you mean to tell me that Democrats don't lie? They lie just as much as the Republicans. Me thinks you have an ideology that aligns itself with the Democratic Party, which causes you to be blind to the truth. The fact is this country is going straight down the crapper and both the Dem's and Repub's are to blame. Both sides point fingers at who is to blame yet they can't ever reach an agreement about anything. There has to be compromise from both sides and at this point is our countries history it aint happenin. Both sides have agendas, and those agendas are killing this country.

MP, I'm fairly sure this was the point I was driving home. As I have stated many times in this thread and others, I do not (under any circumstances) support the democrats or their agenda. I would sooner abstain from voting than vote for one of them. But my point in this thread and in the other thread I started pertaining to this issue is that I refuse to vote for the republicans either, because I believe they too are working for agendas that will destroy this country and/or the world.

I think both parties are horribly corrupt, and like Dorothy Day (who is pretty much my inspiration for all of my social and political views) I refuse to vote for members of either party, unless an outstanding member from one party or the other presents himself/herself. I definitely do not subscribe to democrat ideologies. There are many, many things I disagree with the democrats over. But my point with this thread is that there are also many, many things I disagree with the republicans over. And both are killing people.

The bottom line... if someone votes for someone other than a prolifer who actually has a chance to win then you might as well have voted against prolife....

Can I see a Church document to this effect? I'm not prepared to take your word for it, Ironmonk, since you are a self-professed republican. Again, I do not believe Bush is pro-life. He kills Iraqis and our soldiers in an unjust war.

sorry if I was a bit harsh... but I think the most important thing in the world right now is to stop abortion... Nothing on earth makes me more angry than abortion. If the Church sanctioned it, I would be a one man crusade against them all...

And of course this is the most important thing in the world, I don't deny that. But Bush and the republican party have done nothing to stop abortion, and despite my many requests for proof to the contrary, you have provided none. Their lip service to the pro-life cause simply doesn't impress me anymore. I also don't see how people who are more than willing to commit murder in other circumstances can truly be interested in preventing murder in different circumstances. Murder is murder. Period.

Everything else falls into second... once the babies are safer, then we worry about the best way to handle the small stuff.

Do you call an unjust war that has killed at least hundreds of people the small stuff??? I agree that abortion must be stopped, but I also think Bush's reign of terror over the international community needs to be stopped as well.

I also don't consider the many people standing in a bread line in Marietta, OH that I saw on 60 Minutes tonight "the small stuff." I think they're very important.

August 28, 2003

Here is a better link:

http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/surveymost?ln

Click the Employment Level - Civilian Labor Force

Then click the button at the bottom that says RETRIEVE DATA.

There are more jobs now than when clinton was in office.

-ironmonk

Edited August 28, 2003 by ironmonk

August 28, 2003

gf...

stop being lazy, you look it up yourself... you've listened to one side.

You are a fool for your basis of calling someone an idiot.

You really need to learn how to study.

-ironmonk

August 28, 2003

Iron Monk,

How convienent to change the subject. We were discussing the unemployment rate, suddenly you want to talk about total numbers of jobs. Not fair.

Secondly, the Gospel warns us against going to the temple and offering a sacrifice while in our hearts we call our brothers geniuses. I suggest that it would be possible for you to engage in civilized debate with Good Friday, without resorting to name calling. If you cannot, perhaps this topic is too sensitive for you.

peace...

August 28, 2003

stop being lazy, you look it up yourself... you've listened to one side.

I've listened to the side I think is right... with such personalities as the Holy Father, the United States Bishops, many Bishops of the world, and many theologians the world over in my corner. (I'm speaking now of the unjust war issue, which you have yet to address in any way, probably because you know I'm right). I have no need to listen to the "other side," since I think the other side must be seriously misinformed if they are opposing the Pope and most of the world's Bishops. If you want me to see the other side, present it. If not, get off my case. This is the debate forum. I'm not obliged to go find your side of the story. Since this is a debate forum and you're on the other side of the issue, you're the one who needs to provide your side of the issue. When you do, I will read it and respond.

You are a fool for your basis of calling someone an idiot.

Ironmonk, the same man who proposes extremely difficult literacy and proficiency tests as a prerequisite for graduation from high school has demonstrated in his speeches that he cannot pass them. I will post direct quotes for you, if you'd like, but I believe they've been posted on this forum before. His lack of grammatical skills are beside the point, though, as Jimmy Carter wasn't extremely proficient in that area either. My point is that we need to call a spade a spade. If he lacks skills in grammar, geography, and many other intellectual areas, let's not try to paint it the other way.

You really need to learn how to study.

I have studied. I have studied the position that the war on Iraq was unjust, and I have studied it extensively. I have briefly studied the position that it was a just war, and the reason that it was a brief study is because I'm extremely uninterested in the opposition because the opposition happens to be opposing the very well-informed position of the Holy Father and most of the world's Bishops.

On a side note, you may have the studying thing down, but you need to learn how to respond to arguments like a Catholic.

August 28, 2003

Iron Monk,

How convienent to change the subject. We were discussing the unemployment rate, suddenly you want to talk about total numbers of jobs. Not fair.

Secondly, the Gospel warns us against going to the temple and offering a sacrifice while in our hearts we call our brothers geniuses. I suggest that it would be possible for you to engage in civilized debate with Good Friday, without resorting to name calling. If you cannot, perhaps this topic is too sensitive for you.

peace...

Here here!

August 28, 2003

What they said.

August 28, 2003

Show us some data...

your own link proved my point

August 28, 2003

Would you like me to cite his many grammatical errors? How about his many geographical errors? He is a total idiot, I've read the errors he's made.

I'm not too good at grammer, if you haven't noticed. And I can tell you up front I don't know squat about any other continent but the Americas (well only a little).

Does that make me a TOTAL idiot?

Sorry, I don't think so. I graduated pretty close to the top of my class. I have an understanding of MANY things. I have a directional block and a grammatical block. Big friggin deal. Basing idiocy on those two things is pretty idiotic.

GW doesn't deserve to be called an idiot... yet...

August 28, 2003

Yes.... If there was a real Catholic country (I can't move to the Vatican), I would save up for the move.... Maybe I should search south america? Once I find one, I'll learn the language, then move.... it should be developing, so my computer skills would come in handy

Iron,

I heard that the philippines are 97 % Catholic. Check it out.

:blink:

Edited August 28, 2003 by Damien

August 28, 2003

Sorry looked it up. Christianity is 91% and Catholic is 83% of that. So more like 75.53 %, but thats still a lot more Catholic %'tage than here. (1995 est)

:blink:

Ohh Yeah looked up United States too 28 % Catholics. (1989 est)

A little closer to home. Mexico 89% (1990 est)

Italy is 98 % wow. The things you learn if you look. (1995 est)

All sources from Dictionary.com

Edited August 28, 2003 by Damien

August 28, 2003

I'm not too good at grammer, if you haven't noticed. And I can tell you up front I don't know squat about any other continent but the Americas (well only a little).

Jake, you're not the President of the United States. You also didn't go to Yale (did you?). The President needs to know proper grammar, and he needs to know geography. I doubt he should be judging serious international issues and geo-political affairs when he doesn't know the location of the country he's talking about.

Sorry, I don't think so. I graduated pretty close to the top of my class. I have an understanding of MANY things. I have a directional block and a grammatical block. Big friggin deal. Basing idiocy on those two things is pretty idiotic.

I don't think there's any need to take it so personally. I called George Bush an idiot, not you. It is a "big friggin deal" for the President of the United States not to know how to speak properly and not to know where the countries of the world are. What's okay for you is not necessarily okay for the man entrusted with the leadership of our country. He needs to be more intelligent than other people, or at least as intelligent as most people.

Edited August 28, 2003 by Good Friday

August 28, 2003

The more I think about it, the more I realize, that in order to be a good Catholic, you must distance yourself from political parties.

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What Is The Most Important Thing?