Why Most Of You (i Think) Are Lucky

[Norseman82]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' date='Jun 21 2004, 12:33 PM'] I will also mention that even though many of us come from Christian families, there is often the cross to bear that many don't go to Church or practice the religion anymore... [/quote]
EXACTLY! Many people think that persecution is the Roman soldiers throwing Christians to the lions or Communists in China sending priests loyal to the Pope to re-education camps, but today in the USA and other western countries it is more often than not the everyday harassment and family/society pressures against the faith.

[daugher-of-Mary]

Wow. All I can say is I'm praying for ya, dear. Ask St. Monica to help you with your parents. She spent 17 years praying for the conversion of her son, who became one of the greatest Saints of the Church!

[master_alterserver]

Maybe your parents will convert!

[justfran]

[quote]Then it almost sounds to me like the "full consent of the will" may not have been present, if you were physically overpowered.
[/quote]

Well when my Dad told me to bow, out of the panic and indecision I clasped my hands together and lowered my head, I was that scared. I'm pretty sure that would count as full consent of the will and since i really believe it to be a mortal sin, I'm praying that I get baptised, as soon as I go through RCIA. Hopefully this will be next Holy Saturday, as I'd prefer to start a clean slate so then I have a clear enough mind to start uni.

Now I try and pray the Rosary every day, I try and not think of the 15 Promises that BVM to those who pray it, because praying for that alone just seems to cheapen it. Mainly I pray the Rosary, and carry it around with me, ever day just for support.

This morning I told my mum that I can't bow to Buddha or anything like that anymore, because my heart tells me it's not right to (I figured I'd get it over and done with, since she's the Buddhist and not Dad). She was pretty hurt, but in the end she told me that she was concerned my conversion would interfere with my schoolwork. I guess I'll have to arrange RCIA by e-mail (since I've already signed up for it) and go to Youth mass on Sunday nights, so it'd be more convenient for me (I got a 51% in my maths test today so I don't think my parents will let me lose study time)...




BTW Norseman, I'm 17.

Edited June 23, 2004 by justfran

[zwergel88]

Woah, this all sounds totally familiar, my dad is all into like new age spirituallity and yoga, and I also think he practices some aspects of Buddism. He didn't use to but his girlfriend got him into it. I try just to not get involved, and we don't talk about religion much. My advice would be to just be respectful of your parents faith, but still share your beliefs with them, and continue to pray for their conversion. It is totally great that you are going to start RCIA by the way, Congradulations!

[justfran]

okay I sent an email to Fr telling him what some of you have said, and he admits that maybe he's misunderstood what I said. He says that it IS a sin for a Catholic to bow to Buddha, and that he would be willing to give me a lesson on the Catholic faith if I gave him a signed note from my parents saying that they approved of my desire to be Catholic. He also wanted to clarify some things for me.

I asked my parents and they won't sign the note. I don't feel as upset as I thought I would be, it's more sort of like a calmness, because I feel that this will be a test of my faith, a challenge that I am willing to accept. I also prayed the Rosary just before I asked and said that I would accept whatever God's decision would be. I never specified an exact time for my parents to sign the note, after all.

My parents will keep letting me come to Church, but they want me to focus on my studies before I study on the Catholic faith and they don't want me baptised. Dad wants me to have a think about what I really want first before I make any decisions. After I have really thought about what I want and have reached what Dad believes to be a suitable age, then he's going to let me go ahead whether he likes it or not.

So I've made a promise to myself that I will try my best to keep.

I will respect my parents' wishes for the time being. I do not know God's plan for me and my family, and I will trust in His Providence for us. I think that perhaps I am too impatient, so I will use this time to keep building on my faith (I only really started learning about Catholicism just a month or so ago, I think). I will keep up devotion to the Rosary, and will not stop praying for my parents' conversion and asking for intercession of the Saints. I'll still defend my faith to the best of my ability (though I am not good in debate, a lot of things escape me when I need it, and I never know what to say, let alone say it in Cantonese!). And I won't bow down to any idols. (I hope Mum remembers what I told her!)



So please! PLEASE! Keep praying for me and my family!!! I know I will!

Edited June 24, 2004 by justfran

[justfran]

please, I need all the support I can get here

[cmotherofpirl]

Ask they people to pray for you

[url="http://www.catholic-forum.com/saints/define0b.htm"]http://www.catholic-forum.com/saints/define0b.htm[/url]

Here is stuff on Our Lady of Sheshan:

[url="http://www.hsstudyc.org.hk/CBMAY04.html"]http://www.hsstudyc.org.hk/CBMAY04.html[/url]

Edited June 24, 2004 by cmotherofpirl

[jasJis]

justfran,
You are officially on my prayer list. I will think of you, and pray for you at every mass I attend. I keep the list short so I can remember them and keep to my promises to pray for them.

Back to the bowing down thing. It's one thing to bow with your body, another to bow with your heart or mind. We are also to obey God's commandments to respect our parents, especially while we are under their authority. Raphael's comment about the status of your faith is a little harsh. I don't think he realized how new in faith you are. Also, you don't have some of the Graces we recieve from the Sacraments, such as Baptism, Confirmation, and Communion.

How's this for a suggestion? Decide beforehand that you will honor and respect your parents because you choose to honor and obey God's commandment. Decide beforehand, that if you are taken to a temple and asked to bow before an idol, you will close your eyes and say a prayer to God such as: "Glory be to Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. As it was in the beginning, is now, and ever shall be, World without end. I bow my head to honor my parents in obdience to You, O Lord, but lift my head and heart and soul to You my God!"

Keep this thought and prayer in heart heart as often as you can.

Remember, you are being prayed for. Please come to us whenever you need help.

May the Grace of God strengthen your heart and soul, bring spriritual nourishment to your young faith, and help you become the person God desires you to be. O my Jesus, forgive us our sins. Lead all souls to heaven, especially those most in need or your mercy, especially justfran and her family.
May the peace of Christ be with you.
jas

[Jake Huether]

justfran,

Wow! you are awesome. I am so inspired by such faith. VeraMaria, another person on this phorum is in somewhat of the same situation. You both stand out to me as true Living Saints. I just cannot believe that such young people are so strong in faith! You are right, I am lucky. I've never had to deal with what you are going through. And for this reason I am totally and completely inspired by you. God will bless you BIG TIME for the struggle that you are enduring. I will pray for you. But promise to pray for us too. God will hear you. He knows your desires.

Thanks for being a part of this phorum and please stay with us.

[theculturewarrior]

Keep in mind that the Holy Father himself kissed a Koran. Just showing respect for other religions doesn't mean compromising or worshipping false gods. As far as mortal sin goes...I think a Christian of conscience would know whether he was in that state. That's because for a sin to be mortal, it requires full knowledge and full consent. Sometimes I have been in situations where I *didn't* know whether I was in a state of mortal sin. A retired bishop told me, "when in doubt, always receive communion." In other words, if you don't know for certain you are in a state of mortal sin, and you have reflected upon it, you probably are not.

Your conscience is one thing, and your heart is another. Sometimes they work together, but sometimes your heart can make you feel guilty when you are really just obsessing over minor details.

Remember, God loves you, and Jesus didn't come to condemn the world, but to save it. We have a God who is not only our Lord and Savior, but also our Father.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote]Raphael's comment about the status of your faith is a little harsh. I don't think he realized how new in faith you are. Also, you don't have some of the Graces we recieve from the Sacraments, such as Baptism, Confirmation, and Communion.[/quote]

I wasn't trying to be harsh, if I came across that way. My point was not that she didn't have faith. I think anyone in her situation who stands strong must have great and enduring faith. My point was simply that even the slightest compliance to what they want you to do is going to seem like proof to them that you are wrong. I was attempting to bring out the idea that you have to be firm and unrelenting.

[Archbishop 10-K]

I had the luck of being born into a Seventh-day Adventist family, easily the most anti-Catholic denomination/religion in the world. Mind you, this is the denomination that started the idea of 666 being on the Pope's hat, all Catholics are sun-worshippers, Constantine single-handedly destroyed the faith, and that the Catholic Church will one day institute the mark of the Beast: forcing people to go to church on Sunday. How the Church would ever get enough influence to do this, I have no idea.

Edited June 24, 2004 by Archbishop 10-K

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote]Mind you, this is the denomination that started the idea of 666 being on the Pope's hat, all Catholics are sun-worshippers, Constantine single-handedly destroyed the faith, and that the Catholic Church will one day institute the mark of the Beast: forcing people to go to church on Sunday. How the Church would ever get enough influence to do this, I have no idea.[/quote]

Haha...yeah, I've had to debate the 666 thing before...

What I really find funny is that the name "Ellen Gould White" gives the same results!

[justfran]

[quote name='Archbishop 10-K' date='Jun 24 2004, 12:39 PM'] I had the luck of being born into a Seventh-day Adventist family, easily the most anti-Catholic denomination/religion in the world. [/quote]
Dad can join your religion then. When I told him I wanted to be baptised, he pretty much threw himself onto his soapbox, and all i could do was try and find Cantonese words that would help me defend the faith. A lot of things that he said were misconceptions and he out-yells me every single time (in real life I'm as quiet as a mouse and he can be a bit of a foghorn sometimes)
*shrug* Can't stop loving him though. He is my dad, after all.

[quote]I think anyone in her situation who stands strong must have great and enduring faith.[/quote]

You never considered the fact that I was a bit stupid not to say anything about it beforehand to save having to get into that situation. I'm pretty sure that there must have been some Divine Intervention in this, because usually Mum lets me stay home everytime I have THAT monthly thing, and THAT VERY morning was my first day, so i went off and told mum, thinking for sure she'd let me off since she always did every other time. but not now, not when my dad had taken a day off work so we could go as a family. I mean, it was a sure-fire plan, I wasn't making up excuses or anything, and pretty much the whole time I was like..."Whatdo-i-do-what-do-i-do.."

[quote]My point was simply that even the slightest compliance to what they want you to do is going to seem like proof to them that you are wrong. I was attempting to bring out the idea that you have to be firm and unrelenting.[/quote]

Not so unrelenting that you become a fanatic who would turn ppl away, I hope...

[quote]You both stand out to me as true Living Saints.[/quote]
I'm probably the last person who deserves to be a Saint...

Edited June 25, 2004 by justfran

[OwNeD_byGoD]

[quote]15 Promises Made by the Blessed Virgin to St. Dominic and Blessed Alanus



1. To all those who recite my Rosary devoutly, I promise my special protection and very great graces.

2. Those who will persevere in the recitation of my Rosary shall receive some signal grace.

3. The Rosary shall be a very powerful armor against hell; it shall destroy vice, deliver from sin, and shall dispel heresy.

4. The Rosary shall make virtue and good works flourish, and shall obtain for souls the most abundant divine mercies; it shall substitute in hearts love of God for love of the world, elevate them to desire heavenly and eternal goods. Oh, that souls would sanctify themselves by this means!

5. Those who trust themselves to me through the Rosary, shall not perish.

6. Those who will recite my Rosary piously, considering its Mysteries, shall not be overwhelmed by misfortune nor die a bad death. The sinner shall be converted; the just shall grow in grace and become worthy of eternal life.

[b]7. Those truly devoted to my Rosary shall not die without the consolations of the Church, or without grace.[/b]

8. Those who will recite my Rosary shall find during their life and at their death the light of God, the fullness of His grace, and shall share in the merits of the blessed.

9. I will deliver very promptly from purgatory the souls devoted to my Rosary.

10. The true children of my Rosary shall enjoy great glory in heaven.

11. What you ask through my Rosary, you shall obtain.

12. Those who propagate my Rosary shall obtain through me aid in all their necessities.

13. I have obtained from my son that all the confreres of the Rosary shall have for their brethren in life and death the saints of heaven.

14. Those who recite my Rosary faithfully are all my beloved children, the brothers and sisters of Jesus Christ.

15. Devotion to my Rosary is a special sign of predestination.

[/quote]
why i posted it, i dont know...

i felt compelled to post it so maybe someone need it?

[justfran]

yeah i sent you an email asking about where you got something or other remember???

I'm not exactly sure what the Church's exact definition fo true devotion is, but I pray the Rosary not only to talk to God, Jesus and Mary, but also to seek refuge, support, and a pick-me-up. I try and carry it with me all the time - it's kind of reassuring to just hold it, even.

[OwNeD_byGoD]

oh...never got an email but there you go =)

you're very strong.... saint in the making... deng wow...

[justfran]

My parents just don't get what I say to them about the faith....well, not yet anyway...

[justfran]

phatcatholic said this [url="http://phorum.phatmass.com/index.php?showtopic=14271&st=25"]here[/url]

[quote]while "bow down" holds the implication of "worship" in the verses that put forth the commandments, in need not always hold this implication.

--it depends on the context--

in other verses of the bible, individuals "bow down" [b]w/ no intent to worship[/b] (as in, give to something or someone else what belongs solely to God). likewise, when catholics "bow down" before statues of saints or the holy family our intent is not to worship either.

[b]in Lev and Deut, the obvious context is that God does not want his people worshipping anyone or anything other then himself. that is why he says, "do not bown down."[/b] but look at bowing elsewhere in scripture [/quote]

ok...
[b]I had absolutely no intent to worship Buddha, nor did i mean to venerate him or the statue[/b] But I'm not bowing down to the statues again.

Edited June 28, 2004 by justfran