Pentecostal Haters

[cmotherofpirl]

,Sep 1 2003, 08:43 AM]

WHERE?????

John 3:5

Jesus answered, "Amen, amen, I say to you, no one can enter the kingdom of God without being born of water and Spirit.

down to John 3:22

After this, Jesus and his disciples went into the region of Judea, where he spent some time with them baptizing.

Matthew 28:18

Then Jesus approached and said to them, "All power in heaven and on earth has been given to me.

19

Go, therefore, 12 and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the holy Spirit,

20

teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. 13 And behold, I am with you always, until the end of the age."

Baptism has always been the entrance into the Kingdom of God.

I will look for the Pauline reference.

[skuba steve]

i cant be bothered pasting all quotes but the only way you go about issues is along the lines of

"you're wrong, we are right!"

i dont understand why it can't be... "this is what i believe"

and now someone would post back saying

because you are wrong and we are right....

what is that going to achieve?

[cmotherofpirl]

Steve you ask questions or make comments and we try to answer or respond.

THere is a big difference between truth and belief.

Truth stands whether I believe it or not.

I can believe I am a car , but that doesn't change the truth of me being a human.

So if I say I believe baptism is entrance into to kingdom, I am stating my belief (opinion, choice, preference) about a truth rather than the truth itself.

[Joolye]

1. Do you think Christianity contains more truth than Islam?

2. Are Muslims saved? They believe and love God.

3. Are Jews saved? They believe in God, but deny Jesus.

4. Do you believe God intended us all to believe different and contradicting things about him?

5. If you were to be totally fair, then you should really believe that Christianity is equal to all the world's religions: Judaism, Hinduism, Wiccan, etc, etc. Is this what you believe?

6. If not, then you are being as unfair to those religions as you accuse us of being to yours... make sense?

1. Yes

2. No

3. No

4. No

5. No

6. No

[cmotherofpirl]

1. Yes

2. No

3. No

4. No

5. No

6. No

1. Do you think Christianity contains more truth than Islam?

yes

2. Are Muslims saved? They believe and love God.

If they don't know about Jesus, then they have a change of heaven through obedience to God through their religion.

3. Are Jews saved? They believe in God, but deny Jesus.

SAme as number 2. A chance.

4. Do you believe God intended us all to believe different and contradicting things about him?

Absolutely not.

5. If you were to be totally fair, then you should really believe that Christianity is equal to all the world's religions: Judaism, Hinduism, Wiccan, etc, etc. Is this what you believe?

No

[Joolye]

Do you believe God intended us all to believe different and contradicting things about him?

Remember there are 22 different branches in the Catholic Church.

2nd Quote above from cmotherofpirl from another thread.

And you's talk about us having different beliefs when there are 22 different branches in the Catholic church?

[cmotherofpirl]

All the branches are under the authority of the Pope, with one faith and one Baptism.

The differences are in the Mass services. Not the beliefs. That is why it is the katholicos (universal) Church.

THe newest is the Anglican rite, for the many whole Churches that converted when the Anglicans started ordaining women.

Its still the same Church in beliefs.

[dUSt]

6. No

Don't you see? If you believe that Catholicism shouldn't have a right to say "we believe the truth, and you don't", then what makes it okay for you to say, "Christians have the truth, and Muslims don't"?

It's the same thing!

God bless.

[Winchester]

Joolye,

Welcome welcome! Come in Come in! I'm a little late, but I was detained by the Spanish Inquisition, which, of course, I was not expecting.

I am sure what I am about to say has been covereed, but I like the look of my own typing.

The Catholic Church does not deny truth, no matter who says it, even Billy Graham or the Doobie Brothers. Whatever theological truth is stated by whatever religion, it is truth. Likewise, whatever is untruth no matter by whom it be spoken, it is untruth. Theological truth is not true by virtue of the Church speaking it, rather, by virtue of its truth, the Catholic Church speaks it.

I agree, there is much taught in many rieligions which is true. However, there being but one truth, when there are a verity of teachings, it follows that some must be false. I am certain you believe your religion teaches nothing but the truth, so you must at some point agree that my religion teaches untruth. If you do not agree to this, you must believe that there is either no truth, or that in fact, we totally agree. The latter is absurd, else you would not have bothered posting. The former is unthinkable in a Christian universe, since God is Truth.

Obviously we differ on points of doctrine. Now, if there is no one true religion which teaches all that God wants taught about Himself, you have to accept that God never transmitted His Word to us in a satisfactory manner, something which would rise above human interpretation and preserve for all the Word of God.

I submit to you that the Catholic Church, whose Dogmas have never changed, is this satisfactory transmission. The Catholic Church has stood alone against ancient heresies, has brought us the Bible, has shaped our society so strongly that still, even in these times of Godlessness, Christianity still shapes somewhat the unwilling secular world, and has alone held all the Christ taught, in spite of human failings, in spite of changing leadership, corrupt leadership, weak leadership and the persecutions of the ages. I submit that the Catholic Church alone will stand with Christ when He returns, when all others have abandoned Him for modern notions, for novelties, for, in short, the world.

What great moral strides, I ask you, have we made since the Protestant mutiny?

[hyperdulia again]

waiting...

[phatcatholic]

if recent protestant behavior is any indication, you may be waiting a while....

[Selah]

if recent protestant behavior is any indication, you may be waiting a while....

 

10 years and still waiting.

[AugustineA]

Hmm.. Most of my family is pentecostal. As in.. all of it.

 

It's all health and wealth for them. The theology of the cross is almost completely absent. although I'm sure not all pentecostals are like this. Are they part of a sect that splintered off from the Church, yes. Do I hate them, obviously not.

 

G.K. Chesteron figured that everybody was Catholic in some way, just failed Catholics. Calvinists grabbed the idea of predestination and ran full speed with it until they just became incredibly morbid failed Catholics. Evangelicals grabbed the idea of ecstatic praise and scripture and became very emotional interpretive failed Catholics. 

 

At the end of the day it makes sense if someone who sees a religious group decides it's all bosh. It makes no sense for a person to run in, steal one of their holy relics and start saying they understand that religion and everything else pertaining to it is bosh. That's the behaviour of a mad man. 

[MIKolbe]

Ok. I'll explain myself a bit here

I came here to learn about Catholicism, not to be tought about the faults in my own religion. Heck, we may fault we are trying to change that. I havn't come here pointing out all the faults in yours - so pleae don't do that to me!

I am sorry if I accused you of hatred... I didn't mean for it to come out that way - I repent and I am forgiven

I didn't come here to have my faith put down. The problem is that my conceptions of Catholism similar to the misconceptions you have of Petnecostalism. You are jugding like you are more holy than us, and authoritive figure which you arnt.

You can't go on saying that the Holy Spirit has bless your church and given you the full truth and not that to ours! You can't try and be God here. We already have one God, which I believe in, One and only one God!

God Bless all your socks off!

 

 

FWIW, I don't like you..but that's kinda my nature.