Socrates Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 Just taking a poll to see where people stand. Feel free to explain or clarify answers.
popestpiusx Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 I would only add that it would be useful to clarify the last part of (A) to distinguish the Pope's actual teachings qua Pope versus the personal opinions and private teachings of the person who happens to occupy the See of Peter.
Crusader_4 Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 as Brother Adam has stated A is the only Catholic Response.
cmotherofpirl Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 [quote name='popestpiusx' date='Oct 11 2004, 11:41 PM'] I would only add that it would be useful to clarify the last part of (A) to distinguish the Pope's actual teachings qua Pope versus the personal opinions and private teachings of the person who happens to occupy the See of Peter. [/quote] Who here is qualified to decide which is which? No one.
popestpiusx Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 [quote name='cmotherofpirl' date='Oct 12 2004, 06:48 AM'] Who here is qualified to decide which is which? No one. [/quote] It depends what you are talking about. For instance, the Holy Father is quoted as being very much against Communion in the hand. Would you consider that his opinion or a binding teaching of the Holy Father in his capacity as Pope?
popestpiusx Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 In fact it is somewhat foolish to say that no one is qualified to decide which is which. There are plenty of cases where it is easily discerned either from the context (if it is given in private conversation, as a speech to a group of people, or promulgated to the entire world etc.) or the subject matter and even from the way in which the thing is worded. These all assist one in deciding if what has been said is intended to be a binding teaching or whether it is the private opinion of the person.
cmotherofpirl Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 I was thinking of those people who try to tuirn disciplinary documents into dogma.
popestpiusx Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 (edited) [quote name='cmotherofpirl' date='Oct 12 2004, 09:38 AM'] I was thinking of those people who try to tuirn disciplinary documents into dogma. [/quote] By your statement it seems that you have already done what you said was impossible for anyone on here to do; namely, to decide which is which. Or am I misunderstanding? Edited October 12, 2004 by popestpiusx
Theoketos Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 This whole things stinks of "Values Clarification" from Carl Rogers! What do you believe about Ice Cream's best flavor? How do you feel about the Color Green? How do you fell about lieing sometimes? What do you think about murder? Then opinion becomes the subjective judge of reality, and thus relativism rules... Just my two cents...
popestpiusx Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 [quote name='Theoketos' date='Oct 12 2004, 10:30 AM'] This whole things stinks of "Values Clarification" from Carl Rogers! What do you believe about Ice Cream's best flavor? How do you feel about the Color Green? How do you fell about lieing sometimes? What do you think about murder? Then opinion becomes the subjective judge of reality, and thus relativism rules... Just my two cents... [/quote] To what are you referring?
Christina Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 [quote name='Brother Adam' date='Oct 11 2004, 08:31 PM'] If not A, then you are not Catholic. [/quote] Amen my friend
Socrates Posted October 12, 2004 Author Posted October 12, 2004 [quote name='Theoketos' date='Oct 12 2004, 09:30 AM'] This whole things stinks of "Values Clarification" from Carl Rogers! What do you believe about Ice Cream's best flavor? How do you feel about the Color Green? How do you fell about lieing sometimes? What do you think about murder? Then opinion becomes the subjective judge of reality, and thus relativism rules... Just my two cents... [/quote] Hey, I never said that all choices were correct!!! A. is the correct choice. I was just trying to clarify what other people on this site believed (sometimes it's hard to tell) and perhaps spark some good debate on this topic. Some Catholics seem confused about papal authority, and I thought this might create some good discussion/debate. Sorry if this poll came off as implying subjectivism or values clarification; that was not my intent. (perhaps the poll was not a good idea.) ~ Socrates
Theoketos Posted October 12, 2004 Posted October 12, 2004 Yeah, I came down to hard...Jumped to conculsions...I just get really excited some times I am glad that you know what value's clarification is though... Back to the Topic. What is the link between Mt 18:18 and Papal infallibility?
CatholicforChrist Posted October 13, 2004 Posted October 13, 2004 None of the above, as popesaintpiusx said, there needs to be a clarification on A. The fact that the Authentic Magisterium can err in pastoral decisions must be taken into account.
Guest superman2000 Posted October 15, 2004 Posted October 15, 2004 When we look in the Bible we find that prayer is directed to God alone. Asking a saint to help and guide or protect is something only God can do. As someone once put it, why go to the branch office when you can go to the president. There is not one example of a Christian addressing prayers to Mary or saints. Mary ROCKS, However, she is not the key. Jesus is the key, knock and it shall be opened unto you
1337 k4th0l1x0r Posted October 15, 2004 Posted October 15, 2004 (edited) I answered A, but choice B is a bit misleading. As Catholics we most certainly should follow our own consciences, that is a well informed conscience not influenced by thoughts or motives contrary to Catholic morality and faith. Also, the pope is not infallible on everything - he goes to confession every week - but is infallible on ex cathedra teachings. You can disagree with the pope when he states something like we should cooperate with the UN or that a certain war is unjust. There are times when he is absolutely correct and those times you have to follow him, but for the most part those times are few and far between. Edited October 15, 2004 by 1337 k4th0l1x0r
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