Praying For The Dead

[littleflower+JMJ]

Monica, with the greatest respect, I suggest you try to learn what Catholics believe from Catholics.

MEGA ditto

[Anna]

Monica, with the greatest respect, I suggest you try to learn what Catholics believe from Catholics.

Would you like someone who wants to know what Christians believe to ask it of an anti-Christian?

If you had questions about the Jewish faith, would you ask an anti-Semite?

Read for yourself, rather than letting your understanding be poisoned with someone else's biases.

[Anna]

....I think and ponder over stuff, too, Monica.....

I've been thinking about this question of yours:

Would an honest, loving God offer you eternal life as a free gift - then make you suffer to earn it - then lie about it in His Word?

Wow. Is that what you think God is doing? Telling us one thing, then doing another? Sometimes protestants seem to read parts of Scripture, and not look at it as a whole.

Lots of parents promise their children things, and follow through, at the right time. God knows when the time is right.

I happened upon this, which illustrates how God thinks a father should treat his children,

Hebrews 12:

7

Endure your trials as "discipline"; God treats you as sons. For what "son" is there whom his father does not discipline?

8

If you are without discipline, in which all have shared, you are not sons but bastards.

9

Besides this, we have had our earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them. Should we not (then) submit all the more to the Father of spirits and live?

10

They disciplined us for a short time as seemed right to them, but he does so for our benefit, in order that we may share his holiness.

11

At the time, all discipline seems a cause not for joy but for pain, yet later it brings the peaceful fruit of righteousness to those who are trained by it.

12

So strengthen your drooping hands and your weak knees.

I think this refutes the "free ride" interpretation of the gift which Christ freely gave to us. Free doesn't mean necessarily that we don't have to suffer for our sins, but free that Christ wasn't forced into becoming man and choosing death--death on a cross!

Pax Christi. <><

[Theologian in Training]

Ok, things are starting to make sense....Monica, as many others have stated, if you wish to know about the Catholic Church, honestly and fundamentally you have to stop hiding behind all of these things you have read. By doing so, you are allowing your beliefs of the Church be understood through the fiddler of others, mostly those who are adamant Anti-Catholics. If I were to understand what someone else believes I would read from them what they believe. For example, if I sought to understand Buddhism, I would speak to Buddhists, listen to them, entertain questions, read the Dhammapada, etc. I would not say, well this person, whom I might add, does not like Buddhists said....Rather, I would say, in my research I learned that Buddhists believe in reincarnation, what does this entail?

The way you seem to be approaching the matter is by saying, I believe this, show me why I shouldn't believe this. That is the wrong way of approaching the issue, because it puts the weight of the burden on us, when it is the Holy Spirit who will help you believe. We can merely show you the tools and help you understand our interpretations of the teachings of the Church, but we cannot, under any circumstances make you believe what we say is right, because, quite simply, we are not God. We are creatures of a Creator, an ant before the cross, workers in the harvest.

Perhaps in your struggle to understand you might give the Catechism of the Catholic Church a chance, or even a document or two of Vatican II. You don't need to fiddler it, look at it in view of someone else, just read it. If you have questions, that is good, it means you want to understand, but if you run and try to hide behind this or that person who has his/her own interpretation of the Church, then your sincerity in really wanting to understand becomes questionable. Before we can help you, you have to be willing to tell us what you believe, not what you believe filtered through what someone else believes. It is you who are curious, not the person you quote.

If you have sincere questions, and wish to speak about them openly, honestly, and candidly, the go ahead, but if you all you are looking for is how we refute your arguments, then we are both spinning our wheels.

That said, before you approach anything, precede it with prayer. The Holy Spirit is the reason for any intelligence you see on this board, and I think it would be safe to say that no one would refute that. Therefore, He can help you in your own understanding as well. Pray for His assistance; precede all things with prayer. Like I said before, we are not God, and so we cannot convert you, we are intruments of His grace. If you wish to hear those intruments play, then by all means, pose questions, but if all you want is to hear music play, then I suggest you buy the Massmatics CD

God Bless

[BLAZEr]

Thank You, TheoinTraining. I've been praying for a way to say exactly what you just said. God Answered my prayer, that way is you! Peace be with you.

[Katholikos]

If I wanted to learn about democracy, would I rely on an avid Communist's explanation of it? Not if I wanted the unbiased, unvarnished truth!

James McCarthy is a professional anti-Catholic, Monica. We're all too familiar with him and others like him. Their names come up over and over again as their "answers" and "opinions" come to our attention from people like you who use them as authoritative sources. Many of us converts read and heard them when we were Protestants. They're full of bull-oney.

Occasionally, we learn that their lies and misrepresentations don't always work. I told you in a private email about Patty Bonds, sister of James White, the best-known and best qualified anti-catholic apologist in the United States, who became a Catholic. She had been as anti-Catholic as her famous brother, but she attended a Mass for the first time in her life, thinking she could convert her Catholic friend to Protestantism, and Christ revealed himself to her in the Holy Eucharist. She was shaken to the core. It was only a matter of time, despite her brother's frantic protests and arguments, until she became a Catholic.

http://www.chnetwork.org, click on Converts, then on Patty Bonds.

Going to McCarthy and his ilk for info on the Catholic Church is like going to an electrician for a heart transplant -- and it's equally as fatal to your spiritual health.

"When I caught sight of him, I fell down at his feet as though dead" Rev 1:17.

We invite you to "catch sight of Him" in His Church and in the Holy Eucharist.

Jesus is our Brother. Is Mary not therefore our Mother?

O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for who have recourse to thee.

In the Two Hearts of Jesus and Mary.

JMJ Jay (Katholikos)