Jesus on the Cross

[Jesus Freak]

Every Catholic cross i have seen has Jesus hanging from it. Why?

Would it not be more appropriate to not have him there? Thus showing that he has risen?

[Mateo el Feo]

Hello Jesus Freak,

I like your user ID! Anyway, a Cross with Our Lord is called a "Crucifix." I suspect that others may have a more complete answer as to why Catholics use a Crucifix (ie. liturgical norms, etc), but here's something that came to me when I read your question.

Is there a time when Christ showed His love for us more than when He gave Himself as an eternal Sacrafice for us sinners on the Cross of Calvary? We worship a risen Lord; but recall the words of St. Paul:

[quote name='1 Corinthians 1:23']But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;[/quote]

[quote name='1 Corinthians 2:2']For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.[/quote]

God bless you!

[Jesus Freak]

Yes, but Jesus is not on the cross anymore. the crucifix is not needed. should we not be celebrating that He is off the cross?

[FutureSoror]

the thing that comes to mind for me is that looking at a crucifix reminds me just how much Jesus loves me.

It turns my thoughts toward him, and lifts my spirits because I know that He loved me so much that he died so that I did not have to suffer eternal fire. If God loves you that much what need is there ever to be in a dark mood?

[MichaelFilo]

Those two bible quotes were written after Jesus rose. They apply very much. God showed His Love for us by dieing on the Cross (John 3:16). He showed his triumph over death when He rose from the dead. We wear the Crucifex to show that we carry our own crosses and that we strive to live up to the love of Jesus Christ which is best expressed in the total self-giving love of His when He died on the Cross for our sins (again, John 3:16).

God bless,
Mikey

[Paphnutius]

[quote name='Jesus Freak' date='May 2 2005, 08:00 PM'] Yes, but Jesus is not on the cross anymore. the crucifix is not needed. should we not be celebrating that He is off the cross? [/quote]
A lot of that has to do with His sacrifice. The Mass is a sacrifice, His sacrifice. The crucifix bears this most plainly.

I understand the comment about not having the corpus (body) on the cross. Catholics may also have crosses instead of crucifixes, but the crucifix helps us to meditate and pray more on the passion of Christ. When He offered Himself upon the cross He was both victim and priest, and the crucifix represents this more fully. It is not that we do not believe nor show that He is risen (I do not think you are trying to make that point), but we bear before us all that He gave up for us. A good verse on this is Philllipians 2:6-11. A favorite canticle of mine. He humbeled Himself and accepted even death, death on a cross. To me it looses some element to just bear the cross, I understand your reasoning, but the crucifix is a symbol of love for me. It helps us to meditate on the five wounds He recieved.

It is not a denial that He has risen, but a reminder of just what happened. It would be like saying that we should not having any paintings, statues, or anything depicting Christ's life because He is risen.

[Jesus Freak]

[quote]We wear the Crucifex to show that we carry our own crosses and that we strive to live up to the love of Jesus Christ which is best expressed in the total self-giving love of His when He died on the Cross for our sins[/quote]

But we don't have to carry our own crosses. That is why Jesus died on the cross to begin with. He has already endured everything so that we would not have to by accepting his gift of dying for us.

[quote]It would be like saying that we should not having any paintings, statues, or anything depicting Christ's life because He is risen. [/quote]

No it wouldn't. We are not supposed to dwell on his death, but his resurrection and life, and WHY He died, not that he died.

Edited May 3, 2005 by Jesus Freak

[MichaelFilo]

[quote]Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.[/quote] ~Mathew XVI:XXIV King James Version (I suppose)

We not only carry our own crosses. We are called to carry our crosses.

By the way, who told you we are not supposed to dwell on His death? We are to dwell on His entire life, as He is God. We are to model our lives after His and the Blessed Virgin who most perfectly followed in the teachings of Her son. But back to who told you? You don't really have an authority to tell you what you are supposed to do, so I assume it's your translation of the bible. So please, provide the verses.

Furthermore:
[quote]And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.[/quote] ~Mathew X:XXXVIII
God bless,
Mikey

Edited May 3, 2005 by MichaelFilo

[Paphnutius]

[quote name='Jesus Freak' date='May 2 2005, 08:16 PM']
But we don't have to carry our own crosses. That is why Jesus died on the cross to begin with. He has already endured everything so that we would not have to by accepting his gift of dying for us. [/quote]
Except that if we are to be called His disciples we are to pick up our own crosses and follow Him. I believe that is in Matthew somewhere.

[quote]No it wouldn't.  We are not supposed to dwell on his death, but his resurrection and life, and WHY He died, not that he died.[/quote]

It is not dwelling on His death, but reflecting and meditating on that part of His life, which is a very important part of the whole scheme.

[argent_paladin]

The gospels (the good news) are dominated by the story of Christ's Passion. In fact, they "dwell" on his suffering and death, spending relatively little time on the resurrection. And if you want to look at it from a temporal view, why wear a cross when the cross is no longer there? Why not wear Christ? The cross is meaningless without Christ. That is why we have wear Christ on the Cross.

[Pilgrim]

To return to God, we as humans must repent and "die" to our old ways. To reunite with the all-perfect God, we must offer a perfect sacrifice by surrendering completely to His will. Unfortunately, being imperfect creatures, we are incapable of offering a perfect sacrifice or of surrendering completely to His will. So when God took on human flesh, HE became the perfect sacrifice that we ourselves were incapable of offering. When He died, He became the "Perfect Surrender" to God's will on our behalf.

Jesus came to Earth to die. He did many things in the meantime -- baptized, preached, drove out demons, etc. -- but His primary objective was to die in order to offer a perfect sacrifice to God for the sin of humanity.

His resurrection was glorious indeed, but that is not so shocking because it is easy to expect glorious deeds from God. What was very unexpected is that He should become meek, frail, and vulnerable for us. The real shocker is that He DIED for us. God, all-powerful and glorious God, chose to hang limp and naked on a cross. THAT is the real testament of God's love for us and that's why we venerate the crucifix -- as a reminder of God's great love for us.

I'm sure there's a more theologically complete explanation of why Catholics venerate the crucifix, but this is why I personally love the crucifix so dearly.

[argent_paladin]

We shouldn't give the impression that wearing a simple cross is bad. In fact, it was the general practice up until the 8th century to portray the crucifixion bloodlessly, mainly through allegory or allusions. But I think it makes sense in this day and age to emphasize the bloody, painful, humiliating aspects of the Gospel and not have it sanitized. This is because we live in a very clean, antiseptic time, far removed from the Roman Empire. For many centuries after Christ, people knew (possibly from experience) what a crucifixion looked like. Today, we can't really imagine. That is why we need to be reminded of the sacrifice Christ made for us, the pain he endured because he loved us.
It also is a reminder to be wary of any theology of "cheap grace", that the Christian life is simple and painless. It reminds us to prepare for a martyr's death. That being Christian means being persecuted, perhapst unto death. Wearing the crucifix reminds us of what the cross really means. It is not an empty, sterile object, but an event, a destination, not without suffering.

[Aloysius]

I invite you to the Book of Revelation where St. John has a vision of a Lamb who looks as if slain in heaven. This Lamb is Christ. Why does it look as if slain? because His death is non-temporal, meaning that we can all benefit from it. we do not have to benefit from this thing that happened once 2000 years ago, it is continually offered to us as the sacrifice that washes away our sins. the same sacrifice offered us now that happened 2000 years ago

[Mateo el Feo]

[quote name='Jesus Freak' date='May 2 2005, 09:16 PM']But we don't have to carry our own crosses.  That is why Jesus died on the cross to begin with.  He has already endured everything so that we would not have to by accepting his gift of dying for us.[/quote]
Others have already mentioned some of Our Lord's words in the Gospels. I thought of the following words He spoke in the Gospel of John:
[quote name='John 15:20']Remember the word that I said to you, 'A servant is not greater than his master.' If they persecuted me, they will persecute you; if they kept my word, they will keep yours also.[/quote]
When I carry my own small crosses, I find that meditating on the Passion of Our Crucified Lord can give me strength. It puts my suffering in perspective, shows me an example that I can follow, and shows me that Our Lord understands my suffering.

[quote name='Jesus Freak' date='May 2 2005, 09:16 PM']No it wouldn't.  We are not supposed to dwell on his death, but his resurrection and life, and WHY He died, not that he died.[/quote]
Our Lord's entire life is a lesson for us. If Our Lord didn't want us to meditate and learn from His suffering, one must wonder why each Gospel spends two full chapters (~10% of the Gospel text) discussing the week of Our Lord's Passion--7 days in the life of Our Lord, who walked among us for 33 years.

May I ask some questions? How do you feel about the movie "The Passion of the Christ?" If you saw it, was your love for Jesus deepened after seeing the movie?

God bless you!

(Edit) PS--Jesus Freak, you really know how to pick a question that will get a lot of responses! LOL!

Edited May 3, 2005 by Mateo el Feo

[Jaime]

The crucifix does help us recognize the sacredness of our suffering. While Christ is risen, we still have a ways to go. For me it helps to keep me on focus.

[Paphnutius]

Just another thing to think about. An empty cross leaves anyone that was crucified to be put on there. I mean really. The cross itself was simply a method of execution that was really painful made up by the Romans. It is the body of Christ (as others have mentioned) that makes the crucifix what it is. It is the corpus with the distinguishing wounds that lets us know who it is and what it was all about. An empty cross could just as easily represent any criminal that was executed that way. That is another reason why we prefer the crucifix over the cross. The cross itself is nothing without Christ.

[Piccoli Fiori JMJ]

If we do not dwell and meditate on His death, it becomes nothing to us, and is just something we like to over look. Jesus isn't all happy-cute lambs all through His life. If we meditate on His death, we know that this was how we could be forgiven from our sins. But also in meditating on His most Holy, painful, and humiliating death, we look forward to three days later when He rises. His last words in John was "It is done." It is in His death we recieve salvation, and we see this all in the Crucifix... it is not just a reminder of His death, but also one of what is to come: His Glorious Resurrection!

[guardsman]

[quote name='Jesus Freak' date='May 2 2005, 08:00 PM']Yes, but Jesus is not on the cross anymore.  the crucifix is not needed.  should we not be celebrating that He is off the cross?[/quote]
I, personally, would say this is an intellectually dishonest question. It is one of the BASIC questions taught to protestants to ask Catholics, as they try to save us from our "misguided" faith and bring us into their belief system. Of course, Jesus isn't on the cross anymore, He is Risen. Many Catholic Churches have "The Risen Christ" over the Altar instead of a Crucifix. But that is neither here nor there. The fact is, the Crucifix is an accepted Christian symbol in other denominations as well. (Orthodox, some Lutheran, Coptic) I'm sure there are many others. The point is, every time you sin, you help nail Jesus to the cross, because he died for your sins as well. If you don't like the symbol, I can understand that. But it represents Truth, which is what the Catholics are all about. Peace

[Extra ecclesiam nulla salus]

I was at an orthodox Church talking to the priest, who said that they worship the risen Lord and that is why they have risen bread as communion. But during the medevial days there was a big controversy over the crucifix. The Byzantine Emperor Leo III (who controlled the Patriarch of Constantinople) orderd all icons and representations of saints and crucifixs and statues were taken down. The Crucifix hanging from the placace gate was orderd removed the the officals taking it down were beaten to death my a fanatical mob. Leo III replaced it with a plain cross. Leo III thought that any image led to idolatry. The Patriarch of Constantinople objected and was replaced with a more agreeble man. The Pope Gregory II protested. The next pope called a council to settle the contervorsey, and icons were allowed in the church agian, but it strained tensions between east and west. The Orthodox still accuse us of idolatry because we have statues in our churches.

Sam

Edited May 3, 2005 by Extra ecclesiam nulla salus

[guardsman]

[quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' date='May 3 2005, 05:18 PM'] The Orthodox still accuse us of idolatry because we have statues in our churches.

Sam[/quote]
Well, maybe I'm wrong about the Orthodox. My only real contact with any Orthodox Christians is on forums like this one. But they usually defend Catholics when protestants accuse them of idol worship. I'm not really sure what the difference is between icons and statues.