Brother Adam Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Talk to Briguy in the Romans 8:30 thread. He'll take you around the OSAS block a few times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezic Posted June 23, 2005 Author Share Posted June 23, 2005 [quote name='Brother Adam' date='Jun 23 2005, 03:30 PM']Talk to Briguy in the Romans 8:30 thread. He'll take you around the OSAS block a few times [right][snapback]620827[/snapback][/right] [/quote] what is osas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 [quote name='jezic' date='Jun 23 2005, 03:34 PM']what is osas? [right][snapback]620832[/snapback][/right] [/quote] "Once Saved, Always Saved" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quietfire Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Ya know, there are times I feel so stupid. I cant tell how many times I have read over and over exactly what I wrote above about Luther. Then I start doing some research on the man, and boy!...it amazes me that the protestant movement that he fanned and flamed was actually believed. You know, I actually got sick and had to walk away from the computer at least a dozen times while reading about this man. He definitely was not normal....in any sense of the word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezic Posted June 23, 2005 Author Share Posted June 23, 2005 that is very true as i found out. It makes me wonder why a person would be proud to say they followed the ideas of that guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son_of_angels Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 The concept of being saved is the notion that in this life we make a one-time act or profession of faith and trust in Christ, which applies the atonement of the Lord in our life over all sins past, present and future. Those who do so are thus, according to Baptists, guarranteed eternal life (the "Blessed Assurance" notion). Being saved is the state after this profession of faith and contrition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezic Posted June 23, 2005 Author Share Posted June 23, 2005 but then is it different from Catholicism, when you don't usually call yourself saved? Do they have more complete conversions or is it all kind of misleading? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 well we WERE saved we are not saved we are BEING saved and if we persevere to the end we will BE saved that's the way St. Paul thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezic Posted June 23, 2005 Author Share Posted June 23, 2005 hmm alright but what about the second part? it still isn't making sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 They think they have more complete conversions I think... because they think they're into heaven (to them, their status is like... what it would be to us if we were in purgatory) it's like G.K. Chesterton once said (actually, before his conversion to Catholocism): Calvinism (read: most any OSAS protestant system) is all about being good calvinists, Catholocism is all about being bad (i.e. acknowledging your weaknesses) Catholics anyway, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son_of_angels Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Do they have more complete conversions? I'm not really sure. What I remember about my "salvation" experience was that it was A conversion, to seek truth and faith, and to live a life that I could believe was pleasing to God. This conversion has led me to the Catholic Church. So was it complete? Probably not, but it was real. Most people's conversion experience in the "OSAS" camp would be described as being an inspirational decision to follow God and flee the devil, yet that in and of itself cannot be complete because it lacks the sacramental and ultimately heavenly end which it fortells. In other words one who claims to be "saved" isn't really saved, thus not complete, because they are not, and cannot, be in a state of heavenly perfection while mortal. But a conversion CAN, but is always not, be perfected in its purpose only in the Catholic Church, because only in the Catholic Church is their the absolution of sins, the confirmation of the Holy Spirit, and the partaking of Christ in the Eucharist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philothea Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 I have read "Christian" (protestant) novels where as soon as someone converts, they're instantly perfect. They never have any flaws any more. Yeah, I WISH! I found this very annoying. :angry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gal. 5:22,23 Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 [quote name='philothea' date='Jun 23 2005, 05:23 PM']I have read "Christian" (protestant) novels where as soon as someone converts, they're instantly perfect. They never have any flaws any more. Yeah, I WISH! I found this very annoying. :angry: [right][snapback]620953[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I guess that is why it was a "novel" - fiction. I have never heard a Protestant teacher/pastor, etc. teach that. That line of thinking is not Scriptural. Why would St. Paul say that the things he wants to do, he does not, and the things he does not want to do, he does? Our former pastor told a joke about a man who confided in his pastor that since he gave his life to God, he no longer dealt with lust, or with any sin for that matter. The pastor looked at him and said, "Son, how long have you been struggling with lying?" I have always been taught that the notion of being "saved" comes from Romans 10:9-10. "That if you confess with your mouth, 'Jesus is Lord,' and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved." The problem is, of course, is that those who believe in OSAS, use a verse like this one to build an entire doctrine. It ignores others, such as Col. 1:22,23 which says, "But now He has reconciled you by Christ's physical body through death to present you holy in His sight, without blemish and free from accusation - IF you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from the hope held out in the gospel." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quietfire Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Well, Luther endorsed (quietly) polygamy. He was even present at the second wedding. Urged King James to marry his new spouse before his first marriage was aborted. The king didnt go for it. He also stated that even if you went on a rampage and decided to kill, say, your entire community, you would still be assured of a place in heaven right there next to God....cause yer saved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezic Posted June 24, 2005 Author Share Posted June 24, 2005 hmm that doesn't make sense either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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