infinitelord1 Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 from demons influencing us to demon possession and possible demons existing in flesh............what is your stance on the existence of demons.
scardella Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='infinitelord1' date='Jul 20 2005, 12:47 AM']from demons influencing us to demon possession and possible demons existing in flesh............what is your stance on the existence of demons. [right][snapback]650667[/snapback][/right] [/quote] They exist.
Socrates Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 They exist, but not "in the flesh." They are fallen angels (those that rejected God and are damned) and (like good angels) are pure spirit, having no body.
Honour Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='Socrates' date='Jul 20 2005, 09:44 AM']They exist, but not "in the flesh." They are fallen angels (those that rejected God and are damned) and (like good angels) are pure spirit, having no body. [right][snapback]651054[/snapback][/right] [/quote] What about a demon possesing a human body? And if demons can posses a human.....can angels?
Guest Eremite Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 "Possessing" a human body is not the same thing as having one. This is a distinction that is made with Christ himself. He did not put on his human nature as a mask; he actually assumed it, was ontologically united to it. Angels can put on a body as a "mask", as they frequently did in the Old Testament. But they do not possess people, as do demons. The only reason a demon possesses someone is because they have been invited, and they must carry out evil. A person who invites the good will invite God himself to possess his soul, not an angel.
scardella Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='Honour' date='Jul 20 2005, 11:47 AM']What about a demon possesing a human body? And if demons can posses a human.....can angels? [right][snapback]651057[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I don't know about the latter question, but there are quite a number of accounts of demons possessing humans. From what I've been told, demons can only possess someone if he gives them permission. I don't like to delve much more into demonology, really. It's scary stuff.
Honour Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='Eremite' date='Jul 20 2005, 09:59 AM'] Angels can put on a body as a "mask", as they frequently did in the Old Testament. But they do not possess people, as do demons. [right][snapback]651067[/snapback][/right] [/quote] So..If an angel could put on a "body mask", could not a demon? And wouldn't that be a demon in the flesh?
StColette Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='Honour' date='Jul 20 2005, 12:05 PM']So..If an angel could put on a "body mask", could not a demon? And wouldn't that be a demon in the flesh? [right][snapback]651069[/snapback][/right] [/quote] hmm it would make sense to me that demons would be able to appear as humans as Angels have been able to.
Guest Eremite Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 Yes, a demon could do it. As St. Paul tells us, demons also appear as angels of light.
Honour Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='scardella' date='Jul 20 2005, 10:04 AM'] I don't like to delve much more into demonology, really. It's scary stuff. [right][snapback]651068[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I agree one should excerise great caution and examine all motives before attempting to obtain information about demons. However, complete ignorance is not the way to go in my opinion. You are talking about beings that can negitively influence your spiritual life...you need to know at least that they exist...and understand what they can and cannot do.
StColette Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='Eremite' date='Jul 20 2005, 12:07 PM']Yes, a demon could do it. As St. Paul tells us, demons also appear as angels of light. [right][snapback]651072[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I thought he only said that about Satan yep 2Cor:11:14: 14 And no wonder: for Satan himself transformeth himself into an angel of light. (DRV)
Honour Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='Eremite' date='Jul 20 2005, 09:59 AM']" The only reason a demon possesses someone is because they have been invited, and they must carry out evil. [right][snapback]651067[/snapback][/right] [/quote] [quote name=' scardella' date='Jul 20 2005, 10:04 AM ']From what I've been told, demons can only possess someone if he gives them permission.[/quote] Very interesting information....references?
Socrates Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='Honour' date='Jul 20 2005, 12:09 PM']I agree one should excerise great caution and examine all motives before attempting to obtain information about demons. However, complete ignorance is not the way to go in my opinion. You are talking about beings that can negitively influence your spiritual life...you need to know at least that they exist...and understand what they can and cannot do. [right][snapback]651076[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Mostly they just negatively affect our thoughts and tempt us. Usually the best way to get people to go to hell is to completely ignore or disbeleive in their existance, so they typically keep a low profile, unless we "invite" them into our lives throught the occult. Very holy people can also be prone to visible demonic attacks, which God allows so they can gain grace by overcoming Satan.
Guest Eremite Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote]"The relationship between freedom of the will and diabolic possession is more complex. Culpable possession occurs when we misuse our freedom; as a result, we pay the consequence of the mistakes that brought about demonic possession. When possession is not culpable--because it stems from divine permission or from a malefice--man suffers from it against his free will, but he is called to respond to his trial as he would any other human adversity, such as disease. No matter what the origin, possession does not deprive us of freedom except during times of acute crisis, when we are not responsible for our words and actions. Freedom of the will, nevertheless, remains. We are still free to commit good or evil actions, to sanctify ourselves or to beaver dam ourselves." --Father Gabriele Amorth, Chief Exorcist for the Diocese of Rome[/quote] So it's a bit nuanced.
little_angel202 Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 perhaps a deamon could posses a dead persons body if this person had gone to hell and then given a deamon permission to posses his body? thoughts??
ironmonk Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='infinitelord1' date='Jul 20 2005, 02:47 AM']from demons influencing us to demon possession and possible demons existing in flesh............what is your stance on the existence of demons. [right][snapback]650667[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Demons are fallen angels. The scriptures tell us that some have unknowningly entertained angels... some of those angels could be fallen angels. Ya never know what someone is.... human or angel. Enjoy that food for thought God Bless! ironmonk (just a man - the most militant Catholic you'll ever meet with a smile)
ironmonk Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='scardella' date='Jul 20 2005, 02:04 PM']I don't know about the latter question, but there are quite a number of accounts of demons possessing humans. From what I've been told, demons can only possess someone if he gives them permission. I don't like to delve much more into demonology, really. It's scary stuff. [right][snapback]651068[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Saint Pio use to get physically attacked by Satan and other demons. His gaurdian angel would come to his rescue. Satan would sometimes pose as Mary and even Christ... [b]Remember... always test the spirits[/b]. [b]1 John 4:1[/b] Beloved, do not trust every spirit but test the spirits to see whether they belong to God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. [b]2 [/b]This is how you can know the Spirit of God: every spirit that acknowledges Jesus Christ come in the flesh be longs to God, [b]3 [/b]and every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus 2 does not belong to God. This is the spirit of the antichrist that, as you heard, is to come, but in fact is already in the world. God Bless! ironmonk
Socrates Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='little_angel202' date='Jul 20 2005, 12:22 PM']perhaps a deamon could posses a dead persons body if this person had gone to hell and then given a deamon permission to posses his body? thoughts?? [right][snapback]651091[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Someone's been watching too many horror movies!
Guest Eremite Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 Since we're on the subject, Pope Leo XIII's vision is pretty interesting: [quote]"Father Domenico Pechenino writes: 'I do not remember the exact year. One morning the great Pope Leo XIII had celebrated a Mass and, as usual, was attending a Mass of thanksgiving. Suddenly, we saw him raise his head and stare at something above the celebrant's head. He was staring motionlessly, without batting an eye. His expression was one of horror and awe; the color and look on his face changing rapidly. Something unusual and grave was happening in him. "'Finally, as though coming to his senses, he lightly but firmly tapped his hand and rose to his feet. He headed for his private office. His retinue followed anxiously and solicitously, whispering: 'Holy Father, are you not feeling well? Do you need anything?' He answered: 'Nothing, nothing.' About half an hour later, he called for the Secretary of the Congregation of Rites and, handing him a sheet of paper, requested that it be printed and sent to all the ordinaries around the world. What was that paper? It was the prayer that we recite with the people at the end of every Mass. It is the plea to Mary and the passionate request to the Prince of the heavenly host, beseeching God to send Satan back to hell.'" -"An Exorcist Tells his Story"[/quote] Though it's not related here, I've read elsewhere that Leo XIII's vision included Satan saying he would destroy the Church in 85-100 years. I don't think we can deny that he's been trying his darndest.
little_angel202 Posted July 20, 2005 Posted July 20, 2005 [quote name='Socrates' date='Jul 20 2005, 12:30 PM']Someone's been watching too many horror movies! [right][snapback]651097[/snapback][/right] [/quote] lol actaully reading to many vampire books !! but still could be possible
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