Prophet

[Timothy]

A friend of mine has told me that he believes he is a prohet and recieves messages from God. Am I to believe him? What does somebody do after hearing these things? I have prayed for guidence from God. Just curious to see what you all would do? What would you say?

[White Knight]

You'll know by what he says, if it truely comes from God then it will come true extactly how God said it would. but if it doesn't come true, even though he doesn't speak it, you will know its false. Time my Friend Time, Also alot of prayer. Ask God for revelation of this truth.

[scardella]

Also, see if what he is saying is in accordance w Church teaching. No genuine private revelations are in conflict with Church teachings. Prayer and discernment is a wise course of action. Also, you might want to see if your friend would talk to a priest about it to see what the priest thinks.

[White Knight]

I think they used to wait and see in the Old Testment. If the prophet spoke truth, He was honored, because he was of God, but if he spoke falsely meaning what he says didn't come true, then they'd basically disanounce him and stone him to death.


Now since we live in modern day times, we dont stone folks anymore, but a lesson can be learned from this. If a Prophet spoke Truth, then you will know if it came true, then it is true, but if it doesn't come true, what he says is false.


Its just a matter of Patience, Guidence, Timing, and Prayer wit hGod to understand. and I personally believe it requires much more than this in a way.

[Semperviva]

he could have the 'gift of prophecy'

...quite possible

[Ave Maria Totus Tuus]

[quote name='scardella' date='Aug 3 2005, 02:59 PM']Also, see if what he is saying is in accordance w Church teaching.  No genuine private revelations are in conflict with Church teachings.  Prayer and discernment is a wise course of action.  Also, you might want to see if your friend would talk to a priest about it to see what the priest thinks.
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Agreed.

[Socrates]

[quote name='Timothy' date='Aug 3 2005, 02:25 PM']A friend of mine has told me that he believes he is a prohet and recieves messages from God.  Am I to believe him? What does somebody do after hearing these things?  I have prayed for guidence from God.  Just curious to see what you all would do?  What would you say?
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After hearing these things, I'd call the looney bin.

[Paladin D]

[quote name='Socrates' date='Aug 3 2005, 10:55 PM']After hearing these things, I'd call the looney bin.
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It depends if the person believes he's receiving public revelation, or just private revelation.

[Timothy]

Well basically most of his revelations have been about the United States and the anit christ. He has told me about dreams that he states are from God that have told him the end is near. Which mostl of them have been to that extent so far.... However, recently he has told me that he had a mesage from Christ that he saw me in hell. Now with that said....WHAT DO I DO?? I don't think I have done something aweful that would offend Christ to the extent to cast me into the depths of hell. But I am human and I will be going to confession in the near future. But with that said how does one respond to a self pro claimed prophet who claims that he has recieved a message in the form of a dream and he saw me and another one of his friends in hell. Most people would just play it off as a bad dream, but this guy insist that it wasn't. What do you think?

[Guest Eremite]

Also, don't just judge the content of the supposed "revelations", but look at his life. By their fruits you will know them. Is he an orthodox Catholic? Is he humble, devout, joyful, etc?

As a general rule of thumb, a person who goes about flaunting their supposed "revelations" isn't getting any. How often did Jesus tell someone he healed, "go, and tell no one".

Don't worry about him saying you're going to hell. Make an examination of conscience, go to confession, and let that be the end of it. You can't worry about the future. You just have to live your life, and pray for the grace of perseverance.

John Paul II is alleged to have said, during a visit to Fulda, Germany:

[quote]"Many wish to know simply from curiosity and a taste for the sensational, but they forget that knowledge also implies responsibility. They only seek the satisfaction of their curiosity, and that is dangerous if at the same time they are not disposed to do something, and if they are convinced that it is impossible to do anything against evil."

[Then, grabbing a rosary, he said:]

"Here is the remedy against this evil. Pray, pray, and ask for nothing more. Leave everything else to the Mother of God."[/quote]

[Timothy]

I don't want to say anything negative about him, beacuase I try not to do that to anybody. However, I will say he probally has more enemies then friends. John Paul II's advice will be used and I will do as he says. Thank you and God Bless you for showing me that.

Now what would you all do if this happened to you, becuase I for some reason have been really depressed ever since he told me this. And he tells me this 1 week before my wedding 8-13-05 : (which by the way he had the dream 2-3mths ago???)

[Quietfire]

Timothy,
Are you depressed because everything he said has come to pass? You never stated if he was Catholic.

Look, talk to your confessor. If you have examined your conscience, and gone to confession, then that is all you can do at this time.

Maybe his revelation is future tense. In the fact that it "could" happen by some future events. You know, you took a "wrong turn", so to speak.

I get the feeling that you are devout. With that in mind, and this revelation, it may be just the thing to keep you on the narrow road.

Even St. John warned first the results of their continued activity of the Church's in Revelation. It wasnt definite. They were warned that if they continued in what they were doing, then their lamp stands would be removed.

This may be more of a blessing for you, and should not depress you in any way.

How many people would love to get a warning ahead of time.

Pax

[Timothy]

I spoke to my confessor and he had many things to say in regards to the so-called revelation that was had. Among the comments were "most erroneous, completely false, what is he on?, stupid..etc...." I think you get the point.

As for my short depression, it was due to the idea of the single most important thing in my life (Christ) taken away from me. Just imagine spending eternity without the love of Christ in your life....very depressing. But after prayer and speaking to my priest I am back on track and happy again.

Now here is the question I pose. What would you say to the person going around saying these things? Especially, if you see them regularly

Oh yeah, he is Catholic.

Edited August 5, 2005 by Timothy

[Guest Eremite]

Timothy,

Here's a good article on private revelations in general:

[url="http://www.catholic-pages.com/bvm/private_revelations.asp"]http://www.catholic-pages.com/bvm/private_revelations.asp[/url]

[Timothy]

[quote]© What virtues does the person have? What was his general level before and after the alleged revelation? If a great advance in holiness is seen, and it seems to have come from the revelation, there is good probability for the revelations. We think of the Fatima children. But if the seer has stayed at the ordinary level of virtue, the visions come under some suspicion, for would God use extraordinary means to lead to a merely ordinary state of holiness? Exception: God might use an ordinary person to help others. The message of Fatima for example would have ample justification even if the children had not become holy: this message God wanted given to the world. And the three things asked for are theologically sound and called for independently of any revelation.[/quote]

This one sticks out in particular. After his revolation he cliamed to to self indulge and get caught up in earthly things( as a mechanism to forget about it). He bought a home theater system worth about $10k. Now if I had a revolation from Christ and I$10k to spend I would hope I would give it to the Catholic Relief Fund or something to that nature.

Edited August 5, 2005 by Timothy

[p0lar_bear]

This is from a longer thing on the charismatic gifts, but I think it kind of fits...



Discerning between authentic and inauthentic manifestations can be difficult, especially for someone not acquainted with the manifestations of charismatic gifts. Several keys can aid in the discernment of spirits. Matthew 12:33 tells us “a tree is known by its fruit.” Looking at the fruit of the message and at the fruit of the gift in the life of the person can be telling. The personal sanctity of the person is not an absolute measure. Just as God used Balaam to bless the Israelites and proclaim them as the Chosen People (Num. 22), sinners and unbelievers can receive charismatic gifts. On the other hand, a holy person may mistake his or her own zealousness and emotional responses for authentic gifts. However, those involved with authentic gifts should be drawn into the heart of the Church. Disunity or disobedience to the Church in the name of the Spirit is a contradiction; such a message is not authentic. The Holy Spirit does not lead people into sin, but rather to the Light.

John told his listeners that they would “know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error” (1 Jn 4:6) by whether the spirit confessed or denied the truths of the faith. The claims made in the name of prophecy or words can help discern the authenticity of the gift. Some claims simply prove to be false. Others are not as simple. One important criterion is fidelity to the faith. Statements contrary to the faith or claiming to be new revelation are not from the Holy Spirit.

The desire of the person seeking these gifts should also be consistent with the teachings of the Church. The gifts should not be sought so much as the Giver. Authentic gifts are not forms of divination or fortune-telling, and should not be sought as such. Neither should the person be so interested in the emotional ‘high’ which can result that they are willing to compromise the faith or leave the Church to find a charismatic community that satisfies their emotional need.

The Holy Father, Pope John Paul II listed four guidelines for the discernment of the manifestations of these gifts:

“a) Agreement with the Church's faith in Jesus Christ (cf. 1 Cor 12:3). A gift of the Holy Spirit cannot be contrary to the faith which the same Spirit inspires in the whole Church. "This is how," St. John writes, "you can know the Spirit of God: every spirit that acknowledges Jesus Christ come in the flesh belongs to God, and every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus does not belong to God" (1 Jn 4:2).

“b) The presence of the "fruit of the spirit: love, joy, peace" (Gal 5:22). Every gift of the Spirit fosters growth in love, both in the person himself and in the community, and thus it produces joy and peace. If a charism causes trouble and confusion, this means either that it is not genuine or that it has not been used in the right way. As St. Paul says: "He is not the God of disorder but of peace" (1 Cor 14:33). Without love, even the most extraordinary charisms are not at all useful (cf. 1 Cor 13:1-3; cf. also Mt 7:22-23).

“c) Conformity with the Church's authority and acceptance of its directives. After laying down very strict rules for using charisms in the Church of Corinth, St. Paul says: "If anyone thinks that he is a prophet or a spiritual person, he should recognize that what I am writing to you is a commandment of the Lord" (1 Cor 14:37). The authentic charismatic is recognized by his sincere docility to the pastors of the Church. A charism cannot cause rebellion or a rupture of unity.

“d) The use of charisms in the community is subject to a simple rule: "Everything should be done for building up" (1 Cor 14:26). That is, charisms are accepted to the extent that they make a constructive contribution to the life of the community, a life of union with God and of fraternal communion. St. Paul insists firmly on this rule (1 Cor 14:4-5, 12, 18-19, 26-32).” (“Charisms have role in Church’s life,” General audience of Wednesday, 24 June, L’Osservatore Romano, July 1, 1992.)

[Socrates]

[quote name='Timothy' date='Aug 5 2005, 11:23 AM']I spoke to my confessor and he had many things to say in regards to the so-called revelation that was had.  Among the comments were "most erroneous, completely false, what is he on?, stupid..etc...."  I think you get the point.

As for my short depression, it was due to the idea of the single most important thing in my life (Christ) taken away from me.  Just imagine spending eternity without the love of Christ in your life....very depressing.  But after prayer and speaking to my priest I am back on track and happy again. 

Now here is the question I pose.  What would you say to the person going around saying these things?  Especially, if you see them regularly

Oh yeah, he is Catholic.
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I would generally ignore him, but try not to become too confrontational with him. He sounds like just a deluded looney.
And obviously, his "revelations" are not bearing good fruit. (Causing needless depression and anxiety.) Why would got send a vision of you in hell? God predestines no one to hell. Just pray, avoid sin, and do whatever else you'd do as a good Catholic, and don't give these dubious "visions" any more thought.

[jasJis]

[quote name='Timothy' date='Aug 5 2005, 11:23 AM']Now here is the question I pose.  What would you say to the person going around saying these things?  Especially, if you see them regularly[right][snapback]673254[/snapback][/right]
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You have a choice of two. Use them alternatively.

'Talk to the palm.'
and
'Shut the hell up.'

A third option, if you can 'take' him:
'Wait, wait. I just got a prophetic vision. I forsee you having a size 9 bruise in your ass if you don't stop with this hokey prophet carp.'

[Norseman82]

You can tell him that when he drives [i]jasjis[/i] to responses like that, that alone is proof he is out of line, as I've never seen jasjis react like that before.

Some other things:

1) Private revelations (assuming he had one) are not binding on the general public.
2) Do you think he may have feelings for your fiancee and was trying to sabotage the wedding so he could make a play for her, or that he might have just been jealous? Was this fiancee the subject of any previous fights between your friend and you?

[Sinner]

get a group of friends together and find some nice sharp jagged rocks...... um you know the rest of the story.