Prophet

[p0lar_bear]

This is from a longer thing on the charismatic gifts, but I think it kind of fits...



Discerning between authentic and inauthentic manifestations can be difficult, especially for someone not acquainted with the manifestations of charismatic gifts. Several keys can aid in the discernment of spirits. Matthew 12:33 tells us “a tree is known by its fruit.” Looking at the fruit of the message and at the fruit of the gift in the life of the person can be telling. The personal sanctity of the person is not an absolute measure. Just as God used Balaam to bless the Israelites and proclaim them as the Chosen People (Num. 22), sinners and unbelievers can receive charismatic gifts. On the other hand, a holy person may mistake his or her own zealousness and emotional responses for authentic gifts. However, those involved with authentic gifts should be drawn into the heart of the Church. Disunity or disobedience to the Church in the name of the Spirit is a contradiction; such a message is not authentic. The Holy Spirit does not lead people into sin, but rather to the Light.

John told his listeners that they would “know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error” (1 Jn 4:6) by whether the spirit confessed or denied the truths of the faith. The claims made in the name of prophecy or words can help discern the authenticity of the gift. Some claims simply prove to be false. Others are not as simple. One important criterion is fidelity to the faith. Statements contrary to the faith or claiming to be new revelation are not from the Holy Spirit.

The desire of the person seeking these gifts should also be consistent with the teachings of the Church. The gifts should not be sought so much as the Giver. Authentic gifts are not forms of divination or fortune-telling, and should not be sought as such. Neither should the person be so interested in the emotional ‘high’ which can result that they are willing to compromise the faith or leave the Church to find a charismatic community that satisfies their emotional need.

The Holy Father, Pope John Paul II listed four guidelines for the discernment of the manifestations of these gifts:

“a) Agreement with the Church's faith in Jesus Christ (cf. 1 Cor 12:3). A gift of the Holy Spirit cannot be contrary to the faith which the same Spirit inspires in the whole Church. "This is how," St. John writes, "you can know the Spirit of God: every spirit that acknowledges Jesus Christ come in the flesh belongs to God, and every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus does not belong to God" (1 Jn 4:2).

“b) The presence of the "fruit of the spirit: love, joy, peace" (Gal 5:22). Every gift of the Spirit fosters growth in love, both in the person himself and in the community, and thus it produces joy and peace. If a charism causes trouble and confusion, this means either that it is not genuine or that it has not been used in the right way. As St. Paul says: "He is not the God of disorder but of peace" (1 Cor 14:33). Without love, even the most extraordinary charisms are not at all useful (cf. 1 Cor 13:1-3; cf. also Mt 7:22-23).

“c) Conformity with the Church's authority and acceptance of its directives. After laying down very strict rules for using charisms in the Church of Corinth, St. Paul says: "If anyone thinks that he is a prophet or a spiritual person, he should recognize that what I am writing to you is a commandment of the Lord" (1 Cor 14:37). The authentic charismatic is recognized by his sincere docility to the pastors of the Church. A charism cannot cause rebellion or a rupture of unity.

“d) The use of charisms in the community is subject to a simple rule: "Everything should be done for building up" (1 Cor 14:26). That is, charisms are accepted to the extent that they make a constructive contribution to the life of the community, a life of union with God and of fraternal communion. St. Paul insists firmly on this rule (1 Cor 14:4-5, 12, 18-19, 26-32).” (“Charisms have role in Church’s life,” General audience of Wednesday, 24 June, L’Osservatore Romano, July 1, 1992.)

[Socrates]

[quote name='Timothy' date='Aug 5 2005, 11:23 AM']I spoke to my confessor and he had many things to say in regards to the so-called revelation that was had.  Among the comments were "most erroneous, completely false, what is he on?, stupid..etc...."  I think you get the point.

As for my short depression, it was due to the idea of the single most important thing in my life (Christ) taken away from me.  Just imagine spending eternity without the love of Christ in your life....very depressing.  But after prayer and speaking to my priest I am back on track and happy again. 

Now here is the question I pose.  What would you say to the person going around saying these things?  Especially, if you see them regularly

Oh yeah, he is Catholic.
[right][snapback]673254[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]

I would generally ignore him, but try not to become too confrontational with him. He sounds like just a deluded looney.
And obviously, his "revelations" are not bearing good fruit. (Causing needless depression and anxiety.) Why would got send a vision of you in hell? God predestines no one to hell. Just pray, avoid sin, and do whatever else you'd do as a good Catholic, and don't give these dubious "visions" any more thought.

[jasJis]

[quote name='Timothy' date='Aug 5 2005, 11:23 AM']Now here is the question I pose.  What would you say to the person going around saying these things?  Especially, if you see them regularly[right][snapback]673254[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]
You have a choice of two. Use them alternatively.

'Talk to the palm.'
and
'Shut the hell up.'

A third option, if you can 'take' him:
'Wait, wait. I just got a prophetic vision. I forsee you having a size 9 bruise in your ass if you don't stop with this hokey prophet carp.'

[Norseman82]

You can tell him that when he drives [i]jasjis[/i] to responses like that, that alone is proof he is out of line, as I've never seen jasjis react like that before.

Some other things:

1) Private revelations (assuming he had one) are not binding on the general public.
2) Do you think he may have feelings for your fiancee and was trying to sabotage the wedding so he could make a play for her, or that he might have just been jealous? Was this fiancee the subject of any previous fights between your friend and you?

[Sinner]

get a group of friends together and find some nice sharp jagged rocks...... um you know the rest of the story.

[White Knight]

[color=blue][b]Timothy[/b] [/color]heres some advise.

[b]Prayer:[/b] just keep praying to God about this, pray for revelation of truth of the issue your dealing with is, obviously the clearest choice. and wisest choice of these.

[b]Consult a Pastor or Preist (Preist):[/b] Ask them what the Catholic Church teaches and believes on this.

[b]Read the Scriptures:[/b] preferablity Old Testmant to find out about Prophets. Real ones and False Ones.

[b]Time:[/b] After doing these three things prior to this one. Just wait and see how things turn out. Dont rush into this at all. Just wait. and be patient.


God Bless. Pax Christi.

Edited August 7, 2005 by White Knight

[musturde]

Poor guy, he's probably hallucinating (or lying). Usually, "revalation prophets" are the ones you need to keep an eye out for because they're usually the most out of line. Telling you you're gunna go to hell is useless information and sounds more Evangelical (not all but some) than Catholic.

[Timothy]

No you guys are right I am blowing this off big time! I mean I have been praying very hard about this and have received many indications that this is a completely false and bogus accusation! Now I just feel sorry for the guy. It’s like the Scripture this Sunday was written just for me!! Amazing thanks to God, Coincidence I think not.


The only thing this whole little incident tried to do was weaken my faith in Christ. I realized that after this past Sunday’s mass. For me I have told my priest about him and it is up to my priest if he wants to take further action (probably not). You all have been very helpful. God Bless the Pham!