LittleLes Posted August 20, 2005 Author Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='Aug 20 2005, 07:45 AM']I've been surprised enough times that I really have no problems giving the Church the benefit of the doubt. I can recall early on in my conversion approaching doctrines which struck me the same way 2 + 2 = 5 would, but after I actually came to grasp the basis of the teaching, and began to truly experience the profundity of the Catholic world-view, I can scarce believe I once thought otherwise. [right][snapback]691554[/snapback][/right] [/quote] RESPONSE: But if you are reality -oriented, you know that 2 + 2 = 4. But I suppose if you are a "true believer," and are willing to put aside common sense, and are told that the party line says that 2 + 2 = 5 (if you view it "in context" ), you just have to accept it. And certainly don't dispute this with another Catholic on Phatmass or you'll be locked out or put on suspension! You certainly don't want to cause "scandal"
Laudate_Dominum Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='LittleLes' date='Aug 20 2005, 09:53 AM']RESPONSE: But if you are reality -oriented, you know that 2 + 2 = 4. But I suppose if you are a "true believer," and are willing to put aside common sense, and are told that the party line says that 2 + 2 = 5 (if you view it "in context" ), you just have to accept it. And certainly don't dispute this with another Catholic on Phatmass or you'll be locked out or put on suspension! You certainly don't want to cause "scandal" [right][snapback]691650[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Silly goose! I never suggested that I believe 2 + 2 = 4, or that the Church teaches this.. You are fighting a straw man and not even trying to understand what I was saying.. Again, you seem to just like arguing for its own sake.. Why not listen to what people are actually saying instead of just trying to contradict everything all the time.. Sheesh.
EcceNovaFacioOmni Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='LittleLes' date='Aug 20 2005, 10:46 AM']RESPONSE: That's right. Lay people are only suppose to believe what they are told to believe. [right][snapback]691644[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I'll play your game. Back that up.
mariology21 Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='LittleLes' date='Aug 20 2005, 10:46 AM']RESPONSE: That's right. Lay people are only suppose to believe what they are told to believe. [right][snapback]691644[/snapback][/right] [/quote] No. Lay people are called to believe what the Church teaches.....through an informed conscience. Even though we are "just" lay people we still are called to read, and be informed about the Church and Her teachings and WHY She teaches them. We all need to participate in our faith. And part of that is learning about our faith. Yes we may have "problems" with some of the things the Church teaches but if we are serious about our faith we will pray and try to discern and figure out why we have that problem with a certain teaching. And ultimatly that is a growing process used by the Holy Spirit. I have a friend who used to highly disagree with the Church's teaching on contraception. She followed the teaching because she was a devout Catholic and truly believed that what the Church teaches is the Truth. But she prayed, and studied and finally she came to embrace the Church's teaching on it with open arms. But she continued to learn about it....she didn't just "believe" because she was told to. And she didn't just walk away from the Church because of it either. ~Jen
Kilroy the Ninja Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 Les, please lay out specifically the debate you wish to engage in with this thread or it will be closed. Please do go enjoy yourself at beliefnet.
Paladin D Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 [b]Littleles[/b], your own position is biased to your personal agenda and goal. Don't point the "biased" finger at one party, while you're doing the samething.
LittleLes Posted August 20, 2005 Author Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='Paladin D' date='Aug 20 2005, 12:21 PM'][b]Littleles[/b], your own position is biased to your personal agenda and goal. Don't point the "biased" finger at one party, while you're doing the samething. [right][snapback]691797[/snapback][/right] [/quote] RESPONSE: Yes. But my personal agenda is the establishment of fact and the open exchange of ideas. Not slavish compliance with a party line compelled by preconceptions. I think that's pretty noble. Don't you? :
LittleLes Posted August 20, 2005 Author Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='thedude' date='Aug 20 2005, 10:24 AM']I'll play your game. Back that up. [right][snapback]691687[/snapback][/right] [/quote] RESPONSE: Sure. Read the limits placed on posters by Phatmass.
LittleLes Posted August 20, 2005 Author Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='mariology21' date='Aug 20 2005, 10:35 AM']No. Lay people are called to believe what the Church teaches.....through an informed conscience. Even though we are "just" lay people we still are called to read, and be informed about the Church and Her teachings and WHY She teaches them. We all need to participate in our faith. And part of that is learning about our faith. Yes we may have "problems" with some of the things the Church teaches but if we are serious about our faith we will pray and try to discern and figure out why we have that problem with a certain teaching. And ultimatly that is a growing process used by the Holy Spirit. I[/quote] RESPONSE: Watch it. Don't discuss your views with catholics on this website.
Paladin D Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='LittleLes' date='Aug 20 2005, 01:37 PM']RESPONSE: Yes. But my personal agenda is the establishment of fact and the open exchange of ideas. Not slavish compliance with a party line compelled by preconceptions. I think that's pretty noble. Don't you? : [right][snapback]691825[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Sounds like something you would hear in a political party statment on C-Span. Nice try.
Noel's angel Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 [quote name='LittleLes' date='Aug 19 2005, 11:56 PM']For those who want to be told what they can believe, the is always Phatmass. But for those of us who don't buy into this philosophy, fortunately there are others apologetic websites. [right][snapback]691005[/snapback][/right] [/quote] No one is forcing you to post on Phatmass. If you think it is so pathetic, you can always leave. Why come to a place only to criticise it and say there are so many other better places you could be? Go to your other wonderful websites if you don't like it here-I'm sure you wouldn't ask to come into another person's house and then complain about how someone else's house is much better.
Noel's angel Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 aren't we all! only we're not afraid to admit it
Kilroy the Ninja Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 Since Littleles has decided to ignore my request for a debatable topic, this thread will be closed. God Bless.
dUSt Posted August 23, 2005 Posted August 23, 2005 [quote name='LittleLes' date='Aug 20 2005, 09:46 AM']RESPONSE: That's right. Lay people are only suppose to believe what they are told to believe. [right][snapback]691644[/snapback][/right] [/quote] If you have a problem being told what to believe, then maybe you have a problem believing in God, period? He's very authoratative.
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