Saw an interview with Mel Gibson

[prose]

He said that he didn't believe that transsubstantiation occurs in the english format of the Mass after Vatican II.

Interesting.

He actually built a church where priest celebrate Mass in Latin b/c he believes that is the only way it happens.

[Luthien]

[prose]

That is pretty well what I thought.

[Didacus]

I don't know wether I would say he is eccentric or faithful?

[thessalonian]

[quote name='Didacus' date='Aug 22 2005, 12:55 PM']I don't know wether I would say he is eccentric or faithful?

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What he is is a traditionalist/schimsatic. But of course he has that problem of Unam Sanctum when he rejects the Pope (bishop of Rome). That of course would put him as the object of his view of EENS (i.e. no schismatics..). I pray that he is in ignorance or repents of his error. I do wonder if he would think that transubstantiation takes place when the consecration is spoken in Aramic?

Edited August 22, 2005 by thessalonian

[Brother Adam]

His views make as much sense as a KJVO Bible thumper.

[Aloysius]

to be fair I believe he is referring to the erroneous translation as invalidating the mass, not the language.

he is incorrect, because if a priest is acting in persona christi all he has to do is say the words that have to do with the nature of the substances to change them, because he is in effect acting in the very person of God and when God says something it becomes ontollogically true.

so then the priest only must say "this is my body" and "this is my blood"

the missing "mystery of faith" or the part where he says "will be shed for all" does not invalidate it.

now, priests only have the power to affect something ontologically for the sacrament of the Eucharist, that's the limit of Himself Christ gave to the priesthood... otherwise the priest could hold up a button and say "This is a sportscar" and its substance would become a sportscar... now that would be dope.

of course, if just the substance was a sportscar, but the accidents remained a button... it would look and feel like a button... but the question is, could you drive it? its substance would be a sportscar, right?

just hold onto the button and go flyin through the streets!

perfect.

okay then.

yes.

that's enough off trackness.

anyway, "mysterium fidei" isn't even contained in every rite in the first place, and every rite has valid consecrations.

[Era Might]

Keep in mind that Mel was probably raised with certain strange ideas, and he doesn't come across as a bookish man. If he does indeed hold this belief, it's probably a result of the misdirection people gave him and general ignorance.

Pray for him, certainly, that he may come into full communion with the Church if he is not in fact there.

[annie]

Aloysius,
Could a priest who becomes a deaf/mute still perform his duties of transubstantiation?

[Extra ecclesiam nulla salus]

is mel a sede or an sspxer?

[Niccolò]

[quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' date='Aug 22 2005, 03:27 PM']is mel a sede or an sspxer?
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I really don't think he's either (and I pray he's not).

I saw the same program, and the interview in question was done more than ten years ago (you can tell by the thick Australian accent Mel had). Nevertheless, if he still holds those views it's obviously quite problematic.

I don't think it's accurate to call his large chapel a "church," because it makes it sound like he just up and started his own parish. If he wanted to build a large chapel on his property and have a priest come and say private mass, I don't think there's anything wrong w/ that (correct me if I'm wrong). Now, the type of priest he invites to say mass is another question.

Edited August 22, 2005 by Niccolò

[Extra ecclesiam nulla salus]

hes defiently a sedevacantist.

he openly procalims to be a schismatic.

[brendan1104]

mel is an independent semi-sedevacantist.

his dad is defnitely a full fledged sedevacantist.

nobody knows if mel met with JP2 or not.

and mel was referring to the novus ordo translation.

but if the consecration is properly done in any language, it is valid.

i asked two priests.

[Extra ecclesiam nulla salus]

the consecration is valid even though their is a mistranslation

even the SSPX admits it.

Edited August 22, 2005 by Extra ecclesiam nulla salus

[Ellenita]

[quote]mel is an independent semi-sedevacantist.[/quote]

Oh my goodness, is this yet another faction????


The interview was shown recently on cable in the UK - it was made in 1990!

[prose]

I thought he was a member of Regnum Christi? And I KNOW Regnum Christi is approved by the Vatican.

How can he be separate from the Church, and still be an RC member?

[Era Might]

[quote] I know nothing about the Church in Malibu. It is certainly not in communion with the Universal Catholic Church nor the Archdiocese of Los Angeles.

I have never met Mr. Gibson, and he does not participate in any parish of this Archdiocese. He, apparently, has chosen to live apart from the communion of the Catholic Church. I pray for him.

--Roger Cardinal Mahoney, Archbishop of Los Angeles[/quote]

[cathgirl]

[quote name='Aloysius' date='Aug 22 2005, 02:26 PM']now, priests only have the power to affect something ontologically for the sacrament of the Eucharist, that's the limit of Himself Christ gave to the priesthood... otherwise the priest could hold up a button and say "This is a sportscar" and its substance would become a sportscar... now that would be dope.

of course, if just the substance was a sportscar, but the accidents remained a button... it would look and feel like a button... but the question is, could you drive it?  its substance would be a sportscar, right?

just hold onto the button and go flyin through the streets!

perfect.

okay then.

yes.

that's enough off trackness.

anyway, "mysterium fidei" isn't even contained in every rite in the first place, and every rite has valid consecrations.
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That made me smile! I've heard of other examples like this one, but this one tops all

[morostheos]

I would LOVE to see something that Mel has said recently confirming he is not in communion with the Church. From all that is speculated about him, I have yet to see anything definite.

[son_of_angels]

Yet, even if he is out of communion with the Church, one must at least admit that, as his piety comes from the heart of Catholic tradition, there are a great many holy and pious things that he has created, like the "Passion of the Christ."
Unfortunately, holy and pious things don't prevent Hell. I hope he repents. Who knows, if he does, his movie might could count as a miracle. Imagine that, "St. Mel Gibson patron of crucifixes and movies"