Opus Dei head argues against giant masses

[son_of_angels]

I think it should be remembered that concelebration is a totally new craze (stemming, of course, from the one or two occasions that allowed concelebration, ordinations, etc.). Personally I would like to see the practice completely removed. Any additional priests should take the roles of Lector, Subdeacon, and Deacon in the Mass. In papal masses, custom once dictated that a Cardinal Deacons served in their roles as Deacon of the mass (of course, I'm for a reform of the curia so that Cardinal Priests and Deacons actually ARE priests and deacons)

[Snarf]

Catholicity. That's what it's all about. When you're in a mass of more than 100,000 people, as I was in the Pontifical Mass presided over by JPII on 25 June 2000, you are astounded by being surrounded by that many people gathered for the exact same reasons as you, thinking the same thoughts as you, and knowing that they each represent thousands more at their home communities. It fills you with awe of the magnificance of the Church Militant.

Yes, there are obviously detriments. I think that the ticketing issue solves most of them, but there will always be those who render themselves unworthy of the wonderful experience they undergo.

[Piccoli Fiori JMJ]

[quote name='Maria' date='Oct 6 2005, 10:08 PM']Angela, you made it to mass at the Dom at 6:00? Where were you staying and at what time did you get up?
[right][snapback]749132[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]
We were at the Ibis Hotel in Cologne and we got up before 5... it was tough, but it was all part of the pilgrimage and so worth it...

[son_of_angels]

Catholicity does not only refer to largeness of the church, but also to the fulness which we have received from history. Catholic means universal, but in a sense which reflects two main characteristics: universally received by the true faithful, and existing as the foundation of truth from the beginning.

I am tired of hearing liberal professors misuse this term as though anyone but those who follow the orthodox faith could legitimately use it.

As such, I think it is more important that we represent the truth of the Mass, in the way we celebrate it, than that we represent some contrived and novel notion of the concept "Catholicity." I think the symbolism of only one priest, as we have one Lord, making, in the one sacrifice of Christ, a true offering for our sins, is not something which should be forgotten lightly in order to show how big we are. In fact, the whole concelebration thing seems to me just a way to let all the big shots of a church to get their paragraph in.

[son_of_angels]

Here's an idea Cappie. Say your midnight Mass sine populo in Latin (with a congregation present), then make your Mass at Dawn the most solemn(like at 5:00 a.m.), and the mass during the day the major thrust for attendance. That'll spread 'em out.

[Maria]

The day of the pilgrimage we got up at ~4:30, and probably got there in time for it, but we were waiting to get in for the official pilgrimage thingy. They didn't make us walk all the way to the starting point and them back, thankfully. They actually let us in during mass, before communion and after the consecration (I think). We all crept to the transept and stood there as inconspicuously as possible, and then found that we couldn't go back later. It did have the positive effect of giving the visit a prayerful atmosphere, at least.
The only other time we woke up at that kind of time was to get to Marienfeld. And my sister and I were sick. You see, I'm making excuses because we wanted to go. At least we made sure we went to mass every day... unless we missed on the day of the pope's arrival... I can't remember, but I was stuck in the crowds that day.

[jmjtina]

the bishop has some wise words and has brought up some valid points.

My bishop is actually building more parishes because he believes in smaller communities within the parish as well and sees how important it is for the priest to know his flock. He also saw the lack of reverence and put the two together. More smaller parishes, the better the fruit.

It has been a blessing.

[Snarf]

I absolutely agree that the bulk of masses should be small, intimate, and holy. But there's more good than bad in the beauty of the mega-masses, so long as they are reserved for special instances, such as Pontifical audiences.

[God Conquers]

CAM, per this statement:

[quote]If one person is not actively participating (participatio actuosa) in the Mass, then a sense of the sacred has been lost, no matter how slight.
[/quote]

I was just wondering if ANY mass ever has a sense of sacred....

I mean, I LOVE the mass and KNOW what is being celebrated... but even I am distracted/lack participation at times.

At a mass with over 50 people you're bound to get someone not participating, unless the people attending are all exceptional Catholics. And even then....

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='FutureNunJMJ' date='Oct 6 2005, 09:06 PM']He is quite right about the sacred-ness being absent...
I saw it all over WYD...  people eating lunh during Mass, people making out, people doing all sorts of things they shouldn't have...  Its nice, but it really takes away from the meaning of the Mass (Which of course is Jesus, not community...)
[right][snapback]748834[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]
sounds like it was more of a concert than Holy Mass to some people...

[Cam42]

[quote name='Snarf' date='Oct 7 2005, 12:18 AM']Catholicity.  That's what it's all about.  When you're in a mass of more than 100,000 people, as I was in the Pontifical Mass presided over by JPII on 25 June 2000, you are astounded by being surrounded by that many people gathered for the exact same reasons as you, thinking the same thoughts as you, and knowing that they each represent thousands more at their home communities.  It fills you with awe of the magnificance of the Church Militant.

Yes, there are obviously detriments.  I think that the ticketing issue solves most of them, but there will always be those who render themselves unworthy of the wonderful experience they undergo.
[right][snapback]749139[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]

I daresay that the ideal which you are describing is fine, however, when 100,000 people are attending a papal Mass, I would argue several things:

1. There are too many people to control the masses (people)
2. The reasoning is not to go to Mass, but rather to see the Pope
3. The threat of desecration of the Blessed Sacrament is too great to be overlooked.

I also don't think that the majority of people who were there were thinking: "Gee, this is such an honor that I am an ambassador for (insert parish name). I must go home and give a report to my pastor, since I was the unofficial ambassador."

I think that most people are thinking, "Man, the Pope is dope. And I gotta see him."

So, they will strain and strain, and when they hear his voice, they will cheer and cheer. What is the impotice of the Mass? Is it to see the Pope? Or is it to see Jesus called down from heaven?

I would argue that it is the former and not the latter. And that is unfortunate.

[Joey1976]

Does Opus Dei have a publication that you can subscribe to? I thought i heard they have a magazine that you can get. Is this true? Thanks

[theculturewarrior]

This reminds me of the beginning of the Life of Brian.

"Would you shut up? I can't 'ear wha 'e's sayin!"

[Cam42]

[quote name='Joey1976' date='Oct 7 2005, 12:12 PM']Does Opus Dei have a publication that you can subscribe to? I thought i heard they have a magazine that you can get. Is this true? Thanks
[right][snapback]749525[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]

Nope.....but here is the [url="http://opusdei.org/"]website[/url].