Paphnutius Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Feb 16 2006, 09:13 PM']I think you're missing that the end of a needle can be known theoretically to be a single point. That single point following physical laws could only have a single entity touching. I guess... but can points have corners and such and even in a three dimensional element sense and thereby have more than one point? So the question becomes how many points touch a theoretial point? [right][snapback]889966[/snapback][/right] [/quote] But this point must occupy some dimension correct? If not then the entire world can be considered one "point" but many entities touch it. This discussion would be fruitless unless we qualify the dimension of the point in discussion. Furthermore, a point on a basic graph can always be subdivided into fractional points, such as (1.45, 3.6784) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dairygirl4u2c Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 (edited) I'm not sure if it'd occupy a dimension. I was only using it in a theretical sense. But then, yes, I suppose there'd have to be a theoretical dimension. I don't think it follows that the entire world can be considered a point from what I was meaning to say. So as you said, we need to quanify. But we can't cuz there's always an infiity to subdivide to a theoretical point which is what I meant. THen we're back tosaying how many theoretical poits touch other theoretial points? that's like infinity and would then go back to how is it possibe to have infiity angels etc. I really have no way of knowing how to answer this ?..... Edited February 17, 2006 by dairygirl4u2c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReinnieR Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Feb 16 2006, 09:13 PM']I think you're missing that the end of a needle can be known theoretically to be a single point. That single point following physical laws could only have a single entity touching. I guess... but can points have corners and such and even in a three dimensional element sense and thereby have more than one point touching? So the question becomes how many points touch a theoretial point? [right][snapback]889966[/snapback][/right] [/quote] good point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dairygirl4u2c Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 (edited) I can always throw in the theoretical possibility that in the way God designed things, wanting things to be black and white, set that asingle point does exist and can be dimensionalized, but we just don't know it. So, if a single point such as this eixsts, how many other points of the same size can touch it? If I have a two inch diameter ball, how many other balls can touch it? I'm pretty sure we could figure that out since the ball and the point would be the same in ratio to the objects touching. I'm not a mathematican and so I can't, but I think it could be done. . And again, as with the ball, there's the space in between the balls. Can there be space inbetween the point? I would have to say no. It'd have to be nothingness... hell perhaps... but can that even be? and again this is just speculation Edited February 17, 2006 by dairygirl4u2c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 that's exactly what I was going to say before my computer crashed: there is only one precise point that is the absolute tip of a needle. the size that point is expanded out to be is irrelevant, only one angel can occupy that point, that location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paphnutius Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Feb 16 2006, 09:29 PM'] If I have a two inch diameter ball, how many other balls can touch it? I'm pretty sure we could figure that out since the ball and the point would be the same in ratio to the objects touching. I'm not a mathematican and so I can't, but I think it could be done.[right][snapback]889993[/snapback][/right] [/quote]This has to do with surface area. A point may have any given dimensions that we set to it, but we must realize that once we designate a point as having those dimensions they may always be subdivided into smaller ones (once again Xeno's paradox). If a point has a surface area of X, then the maximum number of other points or entities that can touch it is limited by that surface area. So....if the point on the end of the pin has the dimensions X, Y, and Z, its surface area is then A. The number of entities that can touch that point are limited by A and the surface area in contact with the objects touching it. I could plug in numbers but Iam getting sleepy. I hope that makes sense. You cannot say that this is point A and nothing else may occupy the same space so no angels (or only one) may fit on it. It has nothing to do with occupying the same space, but rather the surface area and area of contact with that point. Hence the reason I think it is limitless regardless of the number of angels so long as we do not know the limits of their manifestation powers. This is because while there are onl X number of angels, there would theoretically be more room on the pin if they may manifest microscopically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paphnutius Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Feb 16 2006, 09:35 PM']that's exactly what I was going to say before my computer crashed: there is only one precise point that is the absolute tip of a needle. the size that point is expanded out to be is irrelevant, only one angel can occupy that point, that location. [right][snapback]890009[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I would disagree. Let us say the end of the needle is 1 inch wide (yes I know that is a big needle but I want to use easier math), but an angel may manifest itself to be the size of .1 inches. Then obviously more than one angel would fit on the end of the needle. If you understand that one ince as a single point, that point can still be subdivided as I have shown with the graph example (1.5232, 3.4543) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 the precise TIP of a needle is a location, a point. as such it has no manifest measurable dimension. you can expand that point out to the size of 1 spheric inch in our three dimensional world, the point, or location, always remains the exact pinpoint center, a theoretical point. no two angels can occupy that one theoretical point at the same time. that point is the only true tip of a needle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morostheos Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 Do you all know if the thing I was told about angels only having once choice in their lives is correct??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paphnutius Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Feb 16 2006, 09:48 PM']the precise TIP of a needle is a location, a point. as such it has no manifest measurable dimension. you can expand that point out to the size of 1 spheric inch in our three dimensional world, the point, or location, always remains the exact pinpoint center, a theoretical point. no two angels can occupy that one theoretical point at the same time. that point is the only true tip of a needle. [right][snapback]890027[/snapback][/right] [/quote]But any given point is divisble into half A and half B. The northern half, and the southern half Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 yes, they made only one choice between serving God and not serving Him. those who chose not to serve Him have wills which are enslaved to evil. those who chose to serve Him have completely liberated wills, and will do what the perfected nature of how they were designed leads them to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paphnutius Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Feb 16 2006, 09:52 PM']yes, they made only one choice between serving God and not serving Him. those who chose not to serve Him have wills which are enslaved to evil. those who chose to serve Him have completely liberated wills, and will do what the perfected nature of how they were designed leads them to do. [right][snapback]890035[/snapback][/right] [/quote] So is there a seperate question for the rebellious angels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='Paphnutius' date='Feb 16 2006, 10:52 PM']But any given point is divisble into half A and half B. The northern half, and the southern half [right][snapback]890034[/snapback][/right] [/quote] an actual point is not divisible, it is completely immesurable. a point merely means a location, and it is a theoretical construct that cannot be picked out in observation. in observation, or rather theoretical observation, we get down to an infinitely small number. but matter is finite, if it were not then we could not move anywhere because all distances would be infinity away. so at the end of that infinitely small number, there is a point. that point has no dimensions, it is a pure location. it exists as a component of space-time. in that one point, only one angel can manifest himself. that angel can be any size around that point, and that size could be measured, but the point of the absolute tip can only be occupied by one entity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='Paphnutius' date='Feb 16 2006, 10:54 PM']So is there a seperate question for the rebellious angels? [right][snapback]890038[/snapback][/right] [/quote] nah, it's just that they'd only want to dance on the tip of that needle if they were dancin to that darn rock n roll of you crazy kids... music of the devil! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morostheos Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Feb 16 2006, 11:52 PM']yes, they made only one choice between serving God and not serving Him. those who chose not to serve Him have wills which are enslaved to evil. those who chose to serve Him have completely liberated wills, and will do what the perfected nature of how they were designed leads them to do. [right][snapback]890035[/snapback][/right] [/quote] So then, they wouldn't be dancing on the point unless God willed it, right? And God could will as many angels as he wanted on the point, regardless of physical limitations, because He's God. So, the amount that could dance there would be the amount God willed to dance there, as none could dance there without God willing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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