"By grace alone?"

[Anastasia13]

Even as a Protestant, I would say that Aloysius's posts seem like a pretty good answer.

[thessalonian]

I think the problem of semi-pelganism is fixed if we understand that the will we have is fashioned by God even before we become Christian, by God through actual grace. All creation cries out to the glory of his name, acting on our will, opening it up to his existence. This let's more grace in. He also has implanted his laws on our hearts (rom 2:14-16) which effects our wills as well. All of this aids in bringing about faith. "In him we live and move and have our being". Even before we are saved.

[Guest JeffCR07]

Myles, L_D, thanks, but I really don't have the proper qualifications for that ranking. I don't have any formal education in Scholastic philosophy or theology, and I haven't graduated from College yet, so I'm certainly not up to snuff. But thanks, the thought means a lot to me

[Dust's Sister]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1009968' date='Jun 21 2006, 03:39 PM']
we are not saved by our faith or by our works, but by the free gift of grace. through our faith and works we sustain the grace given to us and keep our bodies in a state receptive to the grace God wishes to give us, but that action cannot be said to be saving us. it is God who saves us.

grace is like a puppy given to us freely by God. this puppy can lead the way to heaven. but if we do not feed the puppy, the puppy will die. that does not mean that feeding the puppy gets us into heaven; it is technically the puppy alone who gets us into heaven.

so I would say it is accurate to say grace alone saves us. if we do not do good works which sustain our faith then we cannot properly receive grace and any grace which we have received can be starved to death by evil works and lack of good works and lack of faith.
[/quote]


[quote name='Extra ecclesiam nulla salus' post='1010031' date='Jun 21 2006, 06:16 PM']
The Catholic position on salvation can be summed up thus: We are saved by Christ's grace alone, through faith and works done in charity inspired by the Holy Spirit.

Sola gratia! Grace alone -- but a grace we have to co-operate with. Thinking that all one has to do is pray the "Sinner's Prayer" once to be saved is wrong. Thinking that all one has to do is be a "good person" to be saved is wrong.

[b] Catholic teaching for 2,000 years:
we are saved by grace alone, through faith that works in love

Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

James 2:24
Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
[/b]
[/quote]


[quote name='Aloysius' post='1010034' date='Jun 21 2006, 06:23 PM']
make sure to note it is not our cooperation which saves us, as if the grace itself were insufficient. it is our cooperation (i.e. good works which nourish our faith) which makes us receptive to the grace which alone saves us.

a formula like "1/2 grace + 1/2 human cooperation = salvation" would be semi-pelagian and heretical. it is "100% grace + human ability to receive that grace as nourished by faith and works = salvation"

Ephesians 2:8-9 has always been the greatest explanation of the Catholic position. Grace works through faith. If there is no faith, there is nothing for grace to work with. Good works keep faith alive (for faith without works is dead say the scriptures) so without them, there would be no faith, and thus nothing for grace to work with in you.
[/quote]


These posts were very helpful, thank you!

Aloysius.. I loved your formula's!