Do You Pray In Latin?

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='saint_wannabe' post='1306489' date='Jun 30 2007, 04:12 PM']i dont see the point, God understands it just as good as English right?

question: does anyone know when demons are being exorcised they start talking in Latin?[/quote]

Oh yes, God understands us regardless of the language. But some find Latin to be more beautiful or expressive. Every language has its limitations, and we may find another language more adequately expresses what we are praying. So if I use Hebrew when praying, it is because the Hebrew word is more expressive, or more closely matches, what I'm trying to say, or because I find that expression to be more beautiful in Hebrew. I'm assuming (someone correct me if I'm wrong) that that is at least part of the reason of why some choose to pray in Latin. I hope that makes sense.

[Resurrexi]

[quote]I don't assist I [participate smile.gif

I see no point in praying in latin if I can pray in english. However I do sing in latin.[/quote]

[quote][b]Baltimore Catechism No. 3:[/b]
Q. 946. How should we assist at Mass?
A. We should assist at Mass with great interior recollection and piety and with every outward mark of respect and devotion.
http://www.catholic.net/Catholic Church/Catechism/3/l24.html#RTFToC2[/quote]

The point of praying in Latin is that you are praying in the sacred tongue of the Roman Church and that you are not praying a translation of the prayer, but the original. Oftentimes prayers are not translated in the best manner possible. Being a Latin student, I find it extremely difficult to pray in English because I usually pray from my Missal or from the [i]Raccolta[/i] both of which usually have the Latin and English for the prayer. Because they have both the Latin and English I compare the versions and often find translation mistakes or words not translated the way I would translate them, which makes me dislike the translation so I just pray the prayer in Latin. I don't pray in my own words either so unless I'm praying in a group with others who don't know Latin I have no use for the vernacular.

[homeschoolmom]

Some of us actually pray from the heart and just make it up as we go along... no need for Latin then.

[Era Might]

[quote name='Pio Nono' post='1306477' date='Jun 30 2007, 10:50 AM']I pretty much enjoy praying in any language EXCEPT English. And German. They're ugly languages.[/quote]
WHA WHA WHAAAAAAAT?????

I won't argue about German, but English is a not ugly at all. It is quite beautiful, especially written.

[quote]The English language befriends the grand American expression ... it is brawny enough and limber and full enough ... on the tough stock of a race who through all change of circumstance was never without the idea of political liberty, which is the animus of all liberty, it has attracted the terms of daintier and gayer and subtler and more elegant tongues. It is the powerful language of resistance ... it is the dialect of common sense. It is the speech of the proud and melancholy races and of all who aspire. It is the chosen tongue to express growth faith self-esteem freedom justice equality friendliness amplitude prudence decision and courage. It is the medium that shall well nigh express the inexpressible.

--Walt Whitman[/quote]
Respect.

[Pio Nono]

JMJ
6/30 - First Martyrs of the Roman Church

I don't see Whitman saying it's beautiful, though. :

[quote]Oh yes, God understands us regardless of the language. But some find Latin to be more beautiful or expressive. Every language has its limitations, and we may find another language more adequately expresses what we are praying. So if I use Hebrew when praying, it is because the Hebrew word is more expressive, or more closely matches, what I'm trying to say, or because I find that expression to be more beautiful in Hebrew. I'm assuming (someone correct me if I'm wrong) that that is at least part of the reason of why some choose to pray in Latin. I hope that makes sense.[/quote]
Right on, brother. This is why I pray my Rosary in Italian rather than Spanish - "Padre nostro, che sei nei cieli" rolls off the tongue much better than "Padre nuestro, que estas in el cielo"; also, "Ave Maria, piena di grazia, il Signore e' con te," rather than "Dios te salve Maria, llena eres de gracia, el Senor es contigo".

[StColette]

Dr. Miravalle would have us pray the Ave Maria before every class, but I no longer have a class with him since I've take almost all the ones he offers.

Now with my French Prof. we pray or prayers in French, I must say the Hail Mary in French is a lot more difficult than it in Latin

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' post='1306495' date='Jun 30 2007, 10:27 AM']Some of us actually pray from the heart and just make it up as we go along... no need for Latin then. [/quote]

I always pray memorized prayers from the heart and memorized prayers profit you nothing if you don't pray them from the heart.

Edited June 30, 2007 by StThomasMore

[homeschoolmom]

No doubt. I didn't mean to imply that. What I meant was that, for some people, the prayers they pray are not memorized. Therefore, unless they are fluent in Latin, the vernacular is probably their prayer-language-of-choice. Not to say that a memorized prayer cannot be heartfelt....

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='Pio Nono' post='1306506' date='Jun 30 2007, 04:35 PM']JMJ
6/30 - First Martyrs of the Roman Church

I don't see Whitman saying it's beautiful, though. :
Right on, brother. This is why I pray my Rosary in Italian rather than Spanish - "Padre nostro, che sei nei cieli" rolls off the tongue much better than "Padre nuestro, que estas in el cielo"; also, "Ave Maria, piena di grazia, il Signore e' con te," rather than "Dios te salve Maria, llena eres de gracia, el Senor es contigo".[/quote]

Thanks. I've heard Italian is a good language like that (my husband is the one who knows the Romance languages, not me). I can see how that would flow a bit better, seeing your comparison there.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' post='1306457' date='Jun 30 2007, 09:15 AM']Now, are you SURE about that? [/quote]



Hmm, maybe that's why I've had so much trouble with unanswered prayers ...

[son_of_angels]

[quote]Some of us actually pray from the heart and just make it up as we go along... no need for Latin then.[/quote]

Some of us (i.e. all of us [i]should[/i]) pray in the words which Holy Mother Church has offered as her divine worship and veneration for millenia. In the western rite, those prayers are in Latin, and translated to other languages. Those translations often differ from one another both in wording and in content. Therefore, there is a reasonable purpose, other than just preference, for praying in Latin above other languages, just as their is a reasonable purpose for reading the New Testament in Greek rather than Swahili.

It's all well and good to pray using your own words, but is that really just a mask for pride, i.e. holding up your own prayers above those taught to us by the Church Fathers?

Always add, never subtract.

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='son_of_angels' post='1306577' date='Jun 30 2007, 02:42 PM']It's all well and good to pray using your own words, but is that really just a mask for pride, i.e. holding up your own prayers above those taught to us by the Church Fathers?[/quote]
I'm going to go with "no" here... thanks for asking.

[StColette]

[quote name='son_of_angels' post='1306577' date='Jun 30 2007, 01:42 PM']It's all well and good to pray using your own words, but is that really just a mask for pride, i.e. holding up your own prayers above those taught to us by the Church Fathers?[/quote]

Considering the prayers of the Church Fathers were once "their own words" or "their own prayers" I would say that it's definitely not a mark for pride. Some of the most beautiful prayers I've ever heard have come from the personal prayers of Saints, in their own words.

Edited June 30, 2007 by StColette

[Moneybags]

The head exorcist of Rome - [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriele_Amorth"]Fr. Gabriele Amorth[/url] - has said that the Latin prayers of Exorcism are much more powerful than the prayers in the vernacular.

[Mercy me]

[quote name='StThomasMore' post='1306494' date='Jun 30 2007, 11:26 AM']I don't pray in my own words either so unless I'm praying in a group with others who don't know Latin I have no use for the vernacular.[/quote]

You really should pray in your own words. Memorized prayers are great and use them everyday but personal prayer is also required.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='St. Benedict' post='1306664' date='Jun 30 2007, 03:22 PM']The head exorcist of Rome - [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriele_Amorth"]Fr. Gabriele Amorth[/url] - has said that the Latin prayers of Exorcism are much more powerful than the prayers in the vernacular.[/quote]
I'd like to see the actual quote of him saying that. Could you provide a reference, please?

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Mercy me' post='1306693' date='Jun 30 2007, 03:43 PM']You really should pray in your own words. Memorized prayers are great and use them everyday but personal prayer is also required.[/quote]

Memorized prayers are personal prayer. If you say them from the heart and dont rush through them they are much better than any made up prayer you could pray. Personal prayer is not required. What is required is the lifting up the heart to God and the external words and actions which show that you are doing so.

[King's Rook's Pawn]

[quote name='Pio Nono' post='1306477' date='Jun 30 2007, 11:50 AM']I pretty much enjoy praying in any language EXCEPT English. And German. They're ugly languages.[/quote]

I don't think any language is "ugly." I think English can be wonderfully poetic and expressive. Just look at the poetry in the great plays of Shakespeare. Or the works of Milton, Dryden, Robert Frost and a thousand others. I can't speak for German because I don't know any German, but I assume it's the case there too. Goethe wrote in German. You probably mean that Germanic languages should guttural, as opposed to the more soft-sounding Romance languages. I'll agree, but I don't think that's what makes a language beautiful. What makes it beautiful is how expressive it is.

Edited June 30, 2007 by King's Rook's Pawn

[King's Rook's Pawn]

[quote name='StThomasMore' post='1306702' date='Jun 30 2007, 05:53 PM']Memorized prayers are personal prayer. If you say them from the heart and dont rush through them they are much better than any made up prayer you could pray. Personal prayer is not required. What is required is the lifting up the heart to God and the external words and actions which show that you are doing so.[/quote]

I don't think anyone is suggesting that we do away with or even de-emphasize the standard memorized prayers. But why would you limit yourself by never praying in your own words? How do you pray about matters specific to yourself? I think it's best to have a these two kinds of prayers. At night, for example, I pray in my one words about specific concerns and then a few memorized prayers afterward.

I do love the Latin language and think it should be used more often amongst Catholics. Not because it's necessarily more beautiful or expressive, but because it is part of our history and heritage and sanctified by Time and centuries of sacred use.

[Era Might]

[quote]Understanding of prayer is worth more than the silken garments in which it is royally dressed. ...If the divine Latin language kept us apart from the children, from youth, from the world of labor and of affairs, if it were a dark screen, not a clear window, would it be right for us fishers of souls to maintain it as the exclusive language of prayer and religious intercourse? What did St. Paul have to say about that? Read chapter 14 of the first letter to the Corinthians: "In Church I would rather speak five words with my mind, in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue" (I Corinthians 14:19).

--Pope Paul VI[/quote]