Of Icons And Linguistics

[Aloysius]

I have often said that the Latin Language was somewhat the equivalent of an iconostasis for the Roman Rite. Since I never really had much of a backing for saying that, I went searching for a quote (in rare form, I tried to find someone to site, haha, yeah, I know, so not my style, I don't usually site, just spout off whatever I have in my head)

[quote]In the East, mystery in worship is maintained largely by the iconostasis. In the West, the Latin language functioned as a kind of iconostasis of language.[/quote] -Bishop Peter J. Elliot "Liturgical Translation: A Matter of Truth"

Anyway, I've been thinking about the parallels, and they're quite beautiful, and can be extended to other languages as well. There is a two-fold purpose to the iconostasis, as I understand it: on one hand, it preserves the mystery of what is going on behind it; on the other, it shows forth more fully and truly what is really present there by the divine energy in the icons, it acts as a sort of window to translate to the human eye the heaven which is truly present on the altar.

Latin also shows the mystery of the liturgy to the senses. But as a language, and especially in its ancient prayers with the same words in the same language for so many centuries, it carries with it all the prayers of all the saints who have spoken or heard those same words at mass. An icon shows forth all the saints which are present by their images, Latin shows forth all the saints who are present by their language.

It carries over into ordinary prayers to various saints; Latin beautifully conveys this when praying to any Roman Rite Saint; but there is also something to be said for what it's like to pray to St. Joan of Arc in French, to pray to St. John of the Cross in Spanish, to pray to St. Brendan in Irish Gaelic (just three examples from my own personal prayer life)... but Latin covers them all so well, too. It establishes in sensory form the true mysterious nature of their existence in heaven, and when it is in the language that they themselves once prayed in on earth, it presents to us a real 'anamnesis' of their human lives that Catholic Culture retains by retaining their languages.

[goldenchild17]

I like. nice stuff.

[bonoducchi]

Then why do we not the Eucharistic Prayer in Aramaic, since for a fuller sense of anamnesis, we would celebrate the sacrament in Christ's language?

[Aloysius]

for the same reason not all of our icons are of Christ, but of His saints. Latin carries the anamnesis of His saints of the Latin Church who all attended mass in Latin for so many centuries.

sure, we could do the consecration in Aramaic. But that is not our custom, that does not carry the anamnesis of our culture and our society, of the Body of Christ through the centuries of our civilization; it would be quite a powerful icon of Christ, and is such in the Maronite Rite where it is done, but we don't go around replacing icons of saints with icons of Christ for no apparent reason; for the saints are part of the Body of Christ and there is no competition between devotion to them and devotion to Him.

[Era Might]

I first heard the comparison of Latin to an iconostasis at the extraordinary form Mass on EWTN. It's an interesting idea, and I think it does work as a comparison, but I also think it should be balanced with the value of the vernacular as well. I don't know if they are all this way, but the iconostasis at my local Eastern Church has the three doors, and the altar can be seen through the main door, so it's not completely hidden. And also the Priest can be heard when he prays. So I think that can be a comparison to the use of the vernacular in certain parts of the Mass.

[Aloysius]

Well sure. I'm just describing what is being done when the sacred language is used (or when the language of a particular saint is used in private prayer to that saint). When you don't use it, you are simply not putting up an icon in that spot. We don't put icons everywhere all the time necessarily. You can still pray in the vernacular just as you can still pray with no icon present. The icon enhances the prayer, and the iconographic language enhances the prayer in the same way.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Era Might' post='1391747' date='Sep 23 2007, 03:53 PM']I first heard the comparison of Latin to an iconostasis at the extraordinary form Mass on EWTN. It's an interesting idea, and I think it does work as a comparison, but I also think it should be balanced with the value of the vernacular as well. I don't know if they are all this way, but the iconostasis at my local Eastern Church has the three doors, and the altar can be seen through the main door, so it's not completely hidden. And also the Priest can be heard when he prays. So I think that can be a comparison to the use of the vernacular in certain parts of the Mass.[/quote]
Just to clarify, the two doors on the sides are the "deacon's doors" and the central doors are the "holy doors."
In modern pratice the opening and closing of the holy doors seems to vary depending on where you go. Some churches hardly ever open the doors during Divine Liturgy. I'm not arguing for or against your point, I'm just trying to provide some information. Peace.

[Laudate_Dominum]

Something else I might mention that ought to perhaps be taken into account in the Latin analogy is that the meaning of the iconostasis is not so much to separate the congregation from the Holy of Holies as to connect heaven and earth. The icons that adorn the iconostasis should not be seen as barriers but as windows into the heavenly realm.
The holy doors (and the iconostasis as a whole really) represents Christ who is the door if you know what I mean.

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Era Might' post='1391747' date='Sep 23 2007, 02:53 PM'][. . .] I don't know if they are all this way, but the iconostasis at my local Eastern Church has the three doors, and the altar can be seen through the main door, so it's not completely hidden. And also the Priest can be heard when he prays. So I think that can be a comparison to the use of the vernacular in certain parts of the Mass.[/quote]
It is true that the Royal Doors are open during some parts of the liturgy, but they are supposed to be closed during the Eucharistic anaphora, and the sanctuary curtain that is behind them should also be closed at this point, but sadly because of Latinization most Eastern Catholic Churches do not even have a curtain, and many Churches (probably the majority of them) also fail to close the Royal Doors. Of course the failure to close the Royal Doors and to use the sanctuary curtain is a liturgical abuse. Finally, although the modernized Ruthenian liturgy calls for the prayers of the priest to be said audibly, this is a modern innovation, because by Tradition the majority of the high priestly prayers recited by the priest during the liturgy (and in particular the anaphora) should be said in a low voice.

Edited September 23, 2007 by Apotheoun

[Aloysius]

yep. latin is a window to the numberless saints who have gone to mass in Latin through the centuries.

[Apotheoun]

As far as the Latin language being an iconostasis is concerned, I am not opposed to that idea, but I think it would be easier for the Latin Church to simply restore the old Chancel / Rood screen, which was the Western Church's version of the iconostasis. The Rood screen only disappeared from Western Church buildings beginning with the Reformation, and vanished almost completely by the end of the Victorian era.

Below is a modern example of a Chancel / Rood screen in a Catholic Church ([i]Anglican Use[/i]):

[img]http://www.atonementonline.com/images/easter_04.jpg[/img]

[Era Might]

[quote name='Apotheoun' post='1391805' date='Sep 23 2007, 05:39 PM']It is true that the Royal Doors are open during some parts of the liturgy, but they are supposed to be closed during the Eucharistic anaphora, and the sanctuary curtain that is behind them should also be closed at this point, but sadly because of Latinization most Eastern Catholic Churches do not even have a curtain, and many Churches (probably the majority of them) also fail to close the Royal Doors.[/quote]
I don't remember if the door is closed during the anaphora, it may be, but I'm pretty sure it is opened during the first part of the Liturgy. But the iconostasis is a grill and not a wall, so it can be seen through in between the icons. Here is a picture:

[img]http://www.melkitecathedral.org/images/inside.jpg[/img]

[Apotheoun]

As I explained in a private message to Prose:

"In the East we do not expose the Eucharistic elements because that is not their theological purpose. Besides, just as one does not have to look directly into the sun in order to see its light; so too in our theology the presence of Christ shines forth out of the elements and fills the entire Church building, and thus we bask in the light of glory, but need not gaze directly upon the divine presence."

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Era Might' post='1391811' date='Sep 23 2007, 03:51 PM']I don't remember if the door is closed during the consecration, it may be, but I I'm pretty sure it is opened during the first part of the Liturgy. But the iconostasis is a grill and not a wall, so it can be seen through in between the icons.[/quote]
As I said in my post: ". . . because of Latinization most Eastern Catholic Churches do not even have a curtain, and many Churches (probably the majority of them) also fail to close the Royal Doors. Of course the failure to close the Royal Doors and to use the sanctuary curtain is a liturgical abuse."

When I have attended divine liturgy at the Russian Orthodox Cathedral in S.F., the Royal Doors and the sanctuary veil are always closed during the anaphora.

P.S. - The Ruthenian and Ukrainian Churches are not the best guides in these matters, since both of these Churches have varying degees of divergence from Orthodox practice.

P.P.S - "But the iconostasis is a grill and not a wall, so it can be seen through in between the icons." Some iconostases are walls, and not simply grills.

Edited September 23, 2007 by Apotheoun

[Era Might]

By the way, do you know what the name of that icon behind the altar is in that picture. I've seen it a lot.